http://dbd.game/killswitch
Abandon system changes major advantages
Apparently you can never lose as the last survivor now since it counts as a draw so I'll just admit I'll just abandon everytime now and other survivors will definitely do it too.
We already do that to skip the the Mori, now we got even more reason and incentive since we can just wipe our loss besides keeping everything, abandoning is now a guaranteed hatch escape now no reason to look for that.
I think they need to really reconsider these changes and properly display when you draw or lose when you abandon.
Comments
-
I only abandon to skip being slugged or skip the mori. And MMR change isn't a win or loss in my mind, so as both survivor and killer, I don't take any of that into account. Instead, I just use it to skip things I find annoying.
Besides, just because someone's MMR goes up or down doesn't mean they won the game. If I had the lower score at the end of a game of basketball than my opponent, but I advanced to the next round of a tournament through some quirk, that doesn't mean I won the game (unless my opponent got disqualified for cheating or something).
14 -
It’s pretty clear that whoever thought this was a good way to make the abandon system work doesn’t actually play the game.
7 -
That's exactly how I see it and I say that as a main survivor
6 -
I agree no more being humped and bleed to 99% before mori has been such bliss.🤭
10 -
You sound like a Killer Main pretending to be a Survivor. Why would a Survivor complain about this.
-8 -
abandoning is now a guaranteed hatch escape now no reason to look for that
Unless abandoning gives the survivor player the Bloodpoints they would've gotten for a hatch escape, that's just wrong.
I'm not saying the MMR thing isn't an issue, just that your statement "no reason to look for [the hatch]" is incorrect unless it's rewarding the escape BP. And you can't convince me players don't care about BP after we just had a BP event with everyone going on and on about needing more BP, the event should continue on longer, we should always be getting this much BP, etc. etc.
Edit: I have a question: since the last survivor abandoning counts as a draw… what does that mean for the killer? I mean, does the killer get the score event "No one escaped" and the BP that goes with it? They do get the BP, right? It's just the MMR that's all screwed up here, with the survivor not going down despite dying and the killer not going as high as they should despite getting a 4k?
God, I love how unclear everything BHVR does is. You can't even go by what they put in their game, since survivors drop dead when the killer abandons but apparently it's a loss for the killer and not the survivors. It's the opposite of how BHVR programmed it to appear. Brilliant.
1 -
you might be right that abandon doesn't give hatch BP but based on the evidence so far, people don't care enough about a small amount of BP for a hatch. Can't compare blood moon event that gave 500% bonus total BP to like 1k or 1.5k BP (I'm not sure the exact amount) for hatch. BP is always nice but I'm not going to go out my way to smash a pallet across the other side of the map for a pittance of BP it gives when I can just Mori last survivor and be done with the match. I think it would be more accurate to say there is not enough of a reason to get hatch rather than there is or isn't a reason to get hatch. Since abandon has been an option I haven't seen hatch spawn at all, people would rather take the free abandon just based on what I have seen in my matches so far and what others have said here.
-2 -
I play 60% killer 40% survivor (though lately mostly survivor). The whole concept is silly - if you objectively lose the game, you can on demand declare a draw. In what way would this logically be acceptable in any game, ever?
6 -
I dunno, I haven't played killer much. I didn't personally witness this issue when I was playing survivor, I never saw the final survivor abandon instead of look for the hatch (I often spectate simply out of curiosity). And when I'm the last survivor, I look for the hatch. But if I got downed looking for it (read the rest of my post before judging), I did abandon. Back when I was still playing (I'm taking a break now that the event's over) and before we knew about the MMR stuff, if my friend or I got downed, we abandoned. Not maliciously or anything, and obviously not because of the MMR (we didn't know about it), but because we discovered abandoning loads the end screen instantly. We've had issues with the game stalling out and giving a "server not responding" error between a match ending organically and the end screen loading (both on PS4 and Switch). The end screen doesn't stall when loading after abandoning, and so far we haven't gotten the "server not responding" error when we do it; it's worth abandoning if it avoids losing everything we earned during the length of the match.
If BHVR would look into that issue when I report it instead of answering my ticket with a "Sorry that happened to you?", I wouldn't mind watching the mori, but I've lost hundreds of thousands of BP (and I mean just in a single match) to that error and, while I don't mind watching the mori, I have seen each of them a hundred times at least by now.
I'm not going to go out my way to smash a pallet across the other side of the map for a pittance of BP it gives when I can just Mori last survivor and be done with the match
I don't understand this statement, it seems like the opposite of what I was saying. Killing a survivor is both a win condition and it rewards way more BP than breaking a pallet, especially if you include the 2.5k Deviousness bonus for killing all 4 survivors
based on the evidence so far, people don't care enough about a small amount of BP for a hatch
I've had so many matches where at least one teammate did nothing but hide and played for the hatch from the start of the trial that it's one of the things I've complained most about on these forums, probably just behind console issues. The hatch has, from my experience, been what a lot of my teammates care about most, hiding, sandbagging, and hiding some more to ensure they get it, even if there are four people left and we managed to get it down to one gen without their help.
My god, if I return to the game and my teammates are suddenly not prioritizing the hatch above all else, I will be so happy I'll freaking kiss the TV in my elation.
1 -
Just to clarify you said about hatch giving BP as a reason to go for it. I'm saying BP as a reason for going back to break a left over pallet before getting the Mori also applies. The kill is pretty much guaranteed, do I want to go back and get extra BP to go with what I have (I'm including the BP for the Mori in that) or do I want to just think "meh too little BP for the time and hassle". This is why I look at similarly to hatch. "Do I want to go for the extra BP for the hatch to go with what I already have? Or do I want to just bank whatever BP I currently have?"
As far as people hiding for the hatch, they no longer hide for hatch, they hide in hope killer will abandon after 10min. some don't but many start hiding a lot earlier than usual because of the 10min killer abandon feature. That's why hatch doesn't spawn anywhere near as much as it used to, instead of 3rd survivor intentional getting killed so last has a chance of hatch, both will hide because there is a chance both will get equivalent of hatch (minus the BP reward) via killer abandon. Or both will stay together to get downed together and both abandon to get equivalent of hatch (minus the BP). Over time more and more people will do this while current abandon remains so I'm speculating that the hiding for hatch issue will get worse not better and it won't be for hatch it will be for the abandon option instead.
-1 -
It may surprise you, but there are people that really want to play a challenging and balanced PvP game, not a one-sided power trip.
1 -
What does that have to do with the Abandonment feature? Have we really reached peak DBD where we want fairness and balance in a stupid feature? I can't wait until all the new players from FNAF experience a taste of this playerbase.
-1 -
they no longer hide for hatch, they hide in hope killer will abandon after 10min
I'm speculating that the hiding for hatch issue will get worse not better and it won't be for hatch it will be for the abandon option instead.
As I've complained about so many times, this is the only game where for some reason players think that not participating is a legitimate playstyle. And despite BHVR claiming that's not true, they continue to reward players who do it.
Who thinks it's fun to sit in a queue, sit in a lobby, wait for a match to load, and then crouch around for 10+ minutes until a match ends and then do it all over again? Do they get the BP for escaping if the killer abandons? Are they going through all that boring nonsense for 7k? Or do they earn no BP for escaping if the killer abandons and are crouching around for 10+ minutes for 0 BP?
Before the abandon feature, I had a lot of matches as killer where the final 2 survivors did nothing but hide. I often found them hiding together. That always ticked me off, and I'll admit I was not nice when I'd find them doing that.
Just to clarify you said about hatch giving BP as a reason to go for it. I'm saying BP as a reason for going back to break a left over pallet before getting the Mori also applies. The kill is pretty much guaranteed, do I want to go back and get extra BP to go with what I have (I'm including the BP for the Mori in that) or do I want to just think "meh too little BP for the time and hassle".
Ah, I think that's a matter of hassle vs value. Like if I know there are a bunch of blood cans on the ground, those are profitable to kick over, I'm absolutely going to go kick them and get thousands of BP for it. Everyone's determination of hassle vs value is different, though. Breaking a pallet or kicking a gen is a strange example to me: doing those is 100 BP, that should be a waste of time to anyone, even if there's a 5x multiplier. And keeping it in perspective, the hatch is no little thing. When it comes to BP, escaping through the hatch is worth a lot more for the survivor than the mori + "no one escaped" bonus is for the killer. I think it's 7k for the escape and another 2.5k for it being the hatch. A mori is what, 1k? And I think the "no one escaped" bonus is 2.5k.
Edit: What the hell, where did my quote go? This was a direct response to @Prometheus1092 and their response to me.
Post edited by TragicSolitude on-1 -
Has there ever been reports of Survivor doing this? Seems like the playerbase likes to pearl clutch over what if's than it happening. And I don't know why people think Killers are forced to Abandon at 10 minutes. If Survivors are getting away with this than it is all on Killer for conceding and allowing it.
-1 -
Do you even know what you are talking about? the win, lose, and draw absolutely WILL affect how MMR works, because the term "win, loss and a tie" only matters in context of MMR
If people who lost would be able to keep/raise the MMR ( which is current abandon feature), it will make their games harder and harder indefinitely and generates complaints, and if people who win can somehow lower MMR, they absolutely will abuse those to repeatedly hard-stomp most casual playerbases
Like what's up with all those people misunderstanding simple concept like this? I don't get it
-3 -
Mandy has already said MMR is separate from it.
2 -
There is a graph somewhere that shows survivor abandoning makes it a tie, go find it
mandy confirmed an issue about endgame screen, I highly doubt we are talking about it
-3 -
3 -
Oh wait, really? my bad, sorry about that
still don't really understand the point of showing "win lose draw" in that if that's the case
0 -
Players definitely do this, thats why there will be anti hiding implemented later in the year. True it is in the killers hands to abandon but then the situation becomes who gets bored quicker? Survivors hiding hoping for the killer to abandon? Or killer hoping to find 2 survivors hidden somewhere on the map? Before abandon feature I've had matches last an hour then servers end because that's how long people are prepared to hide. That's the issue currently. Both sides effectively trying to make the other side so bored they give up, that's not what the game is about and not what the Devs intended. Hence why everything has exploded recently with this flawed abandon system. Before that killers were using it to gain a "win" whatever that may be if it doesn't effect MMR.. 🤷♂️ No one knows because the Devs are being deliberately vague on the subject.
0 -
A killer smurfing as a Survivor is NOT what i had in mind for the day, but here we are.
Literally NO ONE is seeing the abandon feature as an automatic win/Draw because you "escaped the match", That's not how that works, and that's not how any sane survivor will see it as.
I don't know about you, but I know I don't get any BP from abandoning, but at the very least I get to keep all the BP I earned during the match and walk away instead of being forced to watch a Mori, being forced to bleed out during a match or being forced to play a 3v1 because someone went next.
And, pretty sure, if you abandon a match, you leave behind those terrible bots for the killer to mori or slugs, meaning they still get what they want… and they still get more BP than you, so, please remind me— How is that a draw?1 -
I've personally never experienced survivors hiding hoping for the killer to abandon. But if someone else says they've experienced it, I wouldn't doubt it, because before the abandon feature was implemented I did experience survivors hiding from the killer hoping the killer would disconnect. I personally was too stubborn to disconnect, I'd wait them out or I'd finally find them behind a rock in a corner of the map.
Okay, I'm more confused than ever. What in the world does the WIN/LOSE/DRAW condition apply to? If it's not applicable to MMR, then what is it relevant to? Is it determining Bloodpoint rewards? Because that's the only other thing that matters. The text/icons on the end screens are decorative.
And hell, if the WIN/LOSE/DRAW condition only applies to the end screens, then I'm still confused because the survivor's end screens are binary, they either escape or die, there is no draw.
Has BHVR actually cleared this up or has every response been a vague "no, that's not what it means" thing where they don't clarify what it means?
Edit: Wait, are these conditions just for BHVR's own internal data that they use for balancing purposes? Data which doesn't matter to us at all and so shouldn't even be relayed to us in the first place because it could only cause confusion? Is that what's happened here?
0 -
What does THIS have to do with the abandonment feature? There's nothing one-sided or overpowered about it, it's literally something implemented for both Killers and Survivors to leave a match earlier under specific conditions. And in the case of Killers, this hardly even affects them, considering they still get what they want???
2 -
The only thing that has been said is all circumstances of abandon is "draw" other than when killer abandons after 10min of not gens being completed it's a "loss" which currently the end game results screen doesn't reflect this yet but will be changed at some point. and apparently these don't effect MMR. That's all that's been said as far as I'm aware. Anyone's guess at to what that means, doesn't effect MMR due it being a void match so MMR remains the same? MMR can go up even tho the player lost? Go down even though they won? No one knows lol. We are all going by the win lose draw thing.
0 -
1k for hatch escape is pennies and not worth it just abandon.
My real concern is will this majorly alter kill rates? Do devs throw out abandoned matches? Do they keep it? If so then 4k kill rates will drop to 0% and kill rates for individual killers maybe the slug heavy killers will drop stats and so do we really want this to stay and give them more reasons to buff twins?
0 -
1k for hatch escape is pennies and not worth it just abandon.
It's 7k for escaping and another 2.5k for getting the hatch. 9.5k total. Unless it's changed, BHVR does keep messing with the BP rewards for survivors.
My real concern is will this majorly alter kill rates? Do devs throw out abandoned matches? Do they keep it? If so then 4k kill rates will drop to 0% and kill rates for individual killers maybe the slug heavy killers will drop stats and so do we really want this to stay and give them more reasons to buff twins?
BHVR said a survivor abandoning counts as a draw, so that implies it's neutral, having no effect on kill rates one way or another. Which makes no sense, because the killer won. I guess if survivors want to make sure they keep Twins kill rates high so the killer doesn't get buffed, they should sit through that mori rather than abandon.
Seriously, though, the abandon feature just seems horribly executed and BHVR's unclear responses are making it worse rather than better. We're all debating what the win/lose/draw conditions even mean and arguing the implications of what we think they mean, but we don't actually know so it's all pointless. There's a library's worth of confused complaints about this because BHVR implemented things incorrectly and is giving out info without clarity. They need to explain what the abandon feature means for Bloodpoint rewards, for MMR, and for their internal balancing data. That way we can tell BHVR with full confidence that they've done this wrong.
0 -
It had nothing to do with the abandonment feature, but with @Lixadonna arguing that if you main one side, you can't be critical with something that benefits them, apparently.
But answering your question, I don't know how you can say that it "hardly affects killers" when in all those "specific conditions" it punishes the killer for abandoning even when he has won while allowing the other side to leave a lost match with a draw.
Post edited by Batusalen on-1 -
with these changes, killer can basically abandon the match after establishing 4-men slug and basically never raise their MMar so that they can constantly play against full fresh install teams
0
