http://dbd.game/killswitch
Did everyone stop playing M1 killers?
I played solo queue survivor tonight for 3 hours to get the new survivor's adept and work on the trophies. The only killers I played against were Ghoul, Blight, Nurse, and Billy. I did not play against a single M1 killer. Anyone else have a similar experience?
Comments
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I had the same experience over a couple hours lol. Didnt see a single m1.
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no just got a pig and a twins
and wraith
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I just played against a Ghostface
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Why would anyone play an M1 over Ghoul?
He's easier than both Wesker and Blight and equally as strong as the former, its a no brainer.
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2 of those are m2 killers, but ig they're different than the typical S tiers killers you see almost evwry match
Post edited by OPXtreme_ttv on-10 -
Why would I play a weak killer when I can play a strong killer?
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It's been like this since forever
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I played 3 matches today and it was Wraith, Ghost Face and Onryo.
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Pretty much majority of people are opting for speed killers. Why struggle with M1 killer v fast gen speeds? Harder tunneling gets hit, more people will be abandoning M1 killers as they slowly become relics of the past.
As long as I continue to get 3/4k regularly I intend to continue with Myers 😁 can't beat the tombstone.
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M1 killers are just way too bulliable and in their majority are way too weak. I wouldn't have an issue playing them if losing in this game didn't mean having to eat 3 tons of toxicity from survivors.
Maybe if the community was better we'd all be fine playing weaker killers more.
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False but okay
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M1 killers are just no longer sustainable by themselves they have to have built Mobility and Anti-loop to survive
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Constantly nerfing everything killers have until the only viable killers are those 4? Yeah i don't know what you expected.
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The fact almost (if not literally) every newer killers have both mobility and anti-loop really tells the truth
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The changes in the most recent page have dropped M1 killers into a deep hole, that's why
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I had to play against wraith multiple times yesterday, so no.
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The pace of the game doesn't really accommodate m1 killers... a coordinated group even of non SWF players can really crank gens.
I saw a video from Arinad about how there is no catch up mechanic for killers, and once you're in a losing position (which is not at all hard to find yourself in as an m1 killer), it is very hard to make a comeback, where even the tiniest mistake or just an unfortunate perk can cost you the game in an instant. Because of this, if you intend to win consistently, you ideally need to have a killer that let's you exert dominance right from the get go and then never let go of it... so people often play the m2 killers where the shortcomings of m1 killers aren't really a factor.
EDIT: Clìpped the video here, it's worth watching the whole thing or at least the 10 mins intro, but the foundational point was that to even have a chance win with off meta builds as an m1 Killer you need a fair amount of luck and often have to go uber hard, maximum sweat just to stay alive in the game.
I was playing Houndmaster yesterday on Red Forest, and I was playing kinda chill, had throwaway add-ons, Surge, BBQ and Chilli, All Shaking Thunder and Sloppy Butcher. Not super serious, but I didn't find survivors immediately, maybe 30s in before I found one. I got 2 hooks in on Sable and Leon, and by the time that was done, 3 gens were gone... and I wasn't even taking long in chases, maybe 30s for both health states. Match had only been going like 2 minutes...
After I hooked Leon, I ran left around building and BBQ saw Sable immediately jump off a gen heading right towards the unhook... I went to cut her off and hit her as she unhooked. I then went for her as she ran into main, but Leon body blocked Snug... unfortunately his wiggling with Snug blocked me going through, so I waited out BT and hit him. Picked him up and threw him on hook, if he had OTR or DS I'd have probably lost the game right there.
I went and chased the Ada for 20s, got a hit. Caught her at a window for the second hit 15s later and as I hooked her that 4th gen popped. Leon came off hook and got healed around the same time so I just ran back to the most central gen... it was 70% with Jane and Leon working on it.
I was dumbfounded... I couldn't believe how much they had gotten done in so little time, and tbh the maths still doesnt make sense in my head... Their rotations between gens, unhooking and healing were so clean... made more impressive by the fact I had Sloppy Butcher... and they had done an excellent job completely denying my Surge.
The only thing that gave me a way back into this game is Leon hadn't hidden, and he was right there when I got back... if he had hidden in Narnia away from the gens I'd certainly have lost this game. I broke them up on gens first hitting the Jane, but I knew I was in trouble and went for Leon, I needed someone to die. Surge finally got some value, as I down him with moments to spare on the last gen as I threw him on hook, and I was able to catch Jane with a pretty lucky Snug dash in main, getting another proc of Surge.
The next 2 minutes was me running back and forth downing and hooking rapidly between Sable, Ada, and Jane, having Surge not let this last gen get done and winding up with a 4k. I think 3 times being within less than 10 seconds of the last gen popping... if this were me on Survivor, this is where I'd have found another gen and try to crank that while everyone hid and tried not to get caught, and I've won many games on Survivor doing this against less mobile killers.
Normally I give hatch... but after such a nail biter of a game I thought no, that's gotta be a 4k... like Jesus dude... Houndmaster isn't even weak, and that game was so close and flew away from me so fast... I literally had to rely on Leon making a pretty bad mistake, and hoping he didn't have a number of perks to completely wreck me... 😲😲😲
Post edited by UndeddJester on8 -
I had a Wraith, Myers and Clown last night. I usually always see at least a couple of M1 killers.
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At least for me m1 killers simply aren't fun. While they have a skillexpression to them in form of macroplay and looping efficiently it is not as fun as learning how to flick with blight, hit dashes with wesker or use the tentacles by ken (the fact you use his ability to hit first and then cancel after that to try to get the hit save him, I know he's m1 technically). Of course I know they all have powers that also give skillexpression, but they don't use it primarly often to get the hits.
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Perhaps BHVR is trying to adjust the ratio with survivors by decreasing the number of killer players. LOL
In fact, with the nerfing of Kaneki and many other adjustments in favor of Survivor, many Killer players around me have left the game.
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If I wish to lower my MMR I do… but I don't, I hardly play killer now it's so bad at high mmr.
I've noticed the level of skill from killers has dropped also… perhaps BHVR need to listen to both sides of the community for a fair and balanced game instead of these long loaded questionaires
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Kaneki is definitely NOT as strong as Blight lol
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Still playing pig and do not intend to stop anytime soon. 🐽
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He said former not latter… So he's equating Ghoul to Wesker not Blight. Easier than A and B, as strong as A (not B).
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Do you know what killers you just listed? 2 of those characters don't need to m1 to injure survivors, they have special attacks. That means they are in fact NOT m1 killers. Wraith is an m1 killer
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I play pretty much only M1s, maybe you're all just up at turbosweat levels but I'm still playing them and doing relatively OK. I don't like any of the speedy Killers or most of the M2s, I've tried them and I dislike them all basically, so I just don't really play them. Plus I don't really care about wins at all anymore, I just go in and see how I do. Trying to care about wins in this game, either side, just isn't worth it and leads to a more negative experience for me, so I stopped caring about Escapes and 3-4ks entirely. I'm much happier now.
At least on my end, M1s are plentiful and Survs seem happy enough even when I do 3-4k them all. But when I play Survivor it's only M2s. Like… only M2s. I only see M2s.
It's a problem for sure.
That's sorta what happens when you keep nerfing all the tools M1s have to control the map, but then never give them anything to compensate like mobility. If BHVR wants to keep these Killers viable, then either Survivors need to admit they are playing WAY too hardball and be encouraged to cool down like A LOT en masse - like, "Maybe I don't need to bring these crazy perks, this syringe, or this stacked toolbox every game with a map offering in my SWF" en masse - or all M1 Killers NEED to be given some kind of strong haste or mobility effect. If this is how the game is going to go from now on, it might be time.The alternative of course is that BHVR is trying like hell to move everyone away from the concept of winning and losing rounds being important at all, by shifting away the idea that a win means anything special through subtle changes that make winning less satisfying and losing give you something anyway - see the quest system changes basically throwing rewards at you for completing the easiest possible tasks. It could be they plan on eventually deposing the emblem and Grade system entirely, or at least trying to de-emphasize MMR as a thing you can "win" or "lose". The game is so random anyway, who actually cares what Killer you pick if you get results? And who really cares what the results are if you set your wincons more flexibly?
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This is exactly it. If dbd players would learn to both lose but especially WIN gracefully (crazy that this is the problem) people would be a lot more comfortable queuing up with things that are weaker or that they're more unfamiliar with. There are so unbelievably many sore winners, it really sucks the joy out of just playing something unorthodox or chill when you're going to harassed about how bad you are for it.
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I'm not sure why they're so hesitant to give heavy buffs to all the low tier m1's to get more people to play them.
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I'd kill for your lobbies tbh
The only Nurses I face are babies because I only really play survivor when queued with a friend of mine that has under 50 hours. It's easy wins but stupidly boring.
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The thing is lower tier M1 killers won't have as much performance fluctuation as other mechanical skill based killers, so buffing them can make them suddenly unwinnable (not exactly but think about skull merchant), they are kinda hard to balance
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Well, nerfs to STBFL, Sloppy and overall slowdown perks definetly did not help giving players reason to bother with M1 killers.
Right now you have survivors playing with Duty of Care, which is going to hurt M1 killers most, so it's simply better to play killer who doesn't care about it like Blight.
With M1 killers you can still win majority of your games, but once in while you will have a game, where loss will simply feel outside of your control and that just feels bad.
You don't have that with Blight/Nurse etc., if you lose with Blight, you will always find some mistake on your gameplay, which can be fixed with practice.10 -
That's the thing, it's all in how you buff them. Yeah just straight here's % increases would cause the problem you're referencing. However, buffs that require skill to utilize would not.
For just one example:
Knights guards gain extra move speed based on proximity of survivor to where you placed the guard when the Hunt begins. This doesn't do much for most Knight players, especially low mmr ones. However high skilled players that can use their hearing to gauge survivor location to try and place the guard right on top of them get rewarded. It's basically Spirit skill in hearing.
Now this doesn't have to be an exact idea, more to get the point across. Power increases that aren't just given to everyone but require a skill component in the killer. This is how we circumvent that issue.
There are tons more skill based buffs like this you could do for all the weak roster.
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I feel like some of you guys must be playing a different game to me sometimes. You guys must be pretty good at the game, because I feel like I see a decent mix of high and low tier Killers in most of my play sessions (I Solo Q only).
That said, players who SWF up, play with comms, loop well, play altruistically (but don't throw), load up on best perks and items and escape a lot, should not expect to see anything other than top tier Killers. My Legion would be lucky to get more than two hooks against a team with an ultra competitive mindset like that. It's almost as if DBD isn't really designed to account for stacking the deck that far in your favour. I would have to play in a such a ruthless way just be in with a chance (I don't enjoy playing this way and I know most Survivors don't enjoy it either).
I feel like the time that I play has a big effect on which Killers I see. If I play in the daytime when less people are playing, I might see a lot more low tier Killers like Ghostie, Pig or Myers. If I play at a time when only the SWFs are still online, I'll see more top tier Killers. When I play at a time I suspect most people are playing, I see a pretty good balance. So yeah, people are still playing M1 Killers in my experience.
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I’m trying my best to play as much M1 but big Vecna is a lot of fun. I can only play so much ghostface, Myers, and Doctor before I get tired on the basic Chase formula. Ghost shotguns are surprisingly powerful.
but in reality M1 killers are normally harder to play due to them not having a ranged ability to counter more skilled players. The Ghoul and other M2 are harder to learn but you don’t require much in game knowledge to use them.
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Take freddy and dredge as exemple, both m1 with some antiloop and mobility. Freddy is solid with mobility but his antiloop isnt that good on top of that he is m1 and dream pallets are jus a dream that rarely works( there are map where almoust no dream pallets can be spawned, good one is rpd strong lopps where pallets can be spawned) and freddys counterplay just grab clock and he cant touch you with his power he is jus m1 with teleport.
Dredge best mobility by numbers in game but suffers from rng aspect of locker spawns and maps. His antiloop is only good on few loops mostly in place where survivor cant hold w, if he can that w is super strong and easy counter and his ability rarely helps to catch up( becouse of rng locker spawns) survivors can totaly counter him and help each other in chase/ when he uses his power he spans remnant, when survivor walks into remnant will break jusl like artist crows but unlike artis it has no debuffs for surviovo) so his antiloop has easy counter. Nightfall is good but doesnt hellp you when you need it most. Lockers can be locked, breaking it is heard very far. What else he has? On top of that he is jus m1 and body blocks are super nasty agains him(like angains all m1).
Yeah freddy can counter bodyblocks i think when you hold your power for snares but is super buggy and slow, wont help moust times.
Wraith has mobility and is easy but on higher mmr agains survs without meta and strong addons he is ding dong joke. Some m1 have antiloop as their strongest or only part of power( doctor, clown) but in my opinion it requires lot of skill and knolege compeared to how xenos, nemis and pyramids heads antiloop powers are effective.
Than there are m1s like trapper, mayers, goustface supper weak(all of them needs strongest gear to do agains solid survs). There isnt much reason to play m1 it isnt that enjoying and rewarding.
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And dont tell me freddy is op because of BHVR stats (his high kill rates), that were release around his rework. Every time theres new killer or reworked one more players will play that killer and survivors are finding best counter play that means kill rates will be higher than usually.
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What annoys most about knight is ai of the guard, like guard cahses survivor on shack survivor drops pallet and guard for some reason doesnt chase him directly trought pallet( like he does on windows) but walls around all shack. Then you have moments angains solid survivors they are looping both knight and guard on shack, on top of that there isnt much you can do with knight because if you are in guards circle( near guard thats chasing survivor) he will disapear 3 times faster so yeah solid chase power not to mention good w holders can give you hard times as well costing you lot of your precious time.
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All the killer nerfs BHVR has given out has affected M1 killers more than killers with mobility or strong damaging powers. If a killer gets a good start, then the tools that were nerfed largely didn't matter. The killers with the best shot to snowball early are those with strong powers.
There's also the fact that while survivors are given many basekit defenses against killer tactics and have multiple "second chance" perks, killers are lacking anything on that level for comeback making.
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I agree, this is a real problem and IMHO a form of griefing that BHVR has gotta do something about. I totally gave up learning Knight, Oni, AND Xenomorph because of this, and none of those are all that weak. It just feels really, really bad to try your best, obviously trying to learn not even to win, and then end up getting slapped around and having your loss rubbed in your face by people who are more interested in humiliating you than playing the game because they think "Killers deserve it for being OP". But there's a whole half of the roster that is balanced to not OP. We call them "weak Killers".
That's the only real issue with Killer as a whole left to resolve IMHO - how do we solve Sore Winner Survivors who run in, slam all the gens in five seconds while you're learning a Killer, harass you as a baby on that Killer all round, and then teabag at the exit gate like they earned something trying to force you to hit them out? Why did we all decide it's the Killer's job to force Survivors out but Survivors don't have to endure the similar embarrassment of being humped on the ground for four minutes because they lost? Because Killers are stronger? That doesn't track, being humiliated and griefed still hurts regardless.
Why do Survivors get to gracefully concede if they lost, but not Killers? It really kills the mood.2 -
Killers should have the option to abandon when they realize they're up against something they're outmatched against or a bully squad and don't want to feel bullied. During chaos shuffle I had multiple games against teams hard splitting on gens and waiting almost the entire unhook time to rescue to pound gens. I'd rather just abandon and queue up for an appropriately matched lobby than have to hard tunnel just to hope for a draw
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as we learned with kaneki any killer who's remotely strong will get nerfed into the ground because survivors on mass will complain
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But you're High MMR. If MMR is working than you are also matched against other High MMR Survivors. Where is the outmatched?
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pig is not an m2 killer you would be absolutely crazy to suggest it is.
You can make the argument for twins for sure.
So again, twins pig wraith.
Saw a ghostface as well later in the night.
One more time, pig is not an m2 killer.-1 -
Ok, what do you consider an m2 killer then Hm? I guess that makes Plague an m1 killer too huh? Cus what it sounds like to me is you don't know what an m2 killer is. They're essentially killers who can damage survivors directly using non basic attacks. Example: Twins' victor pounce and Pig's ambush dash. Wraith is m1 because he has no special attack
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Yea, Nurse and Blight's nerfs definitely made them F tier. 🙄
It's not that he's strong. It's that he: 1) Is piss easy to play for how strong he is; 2) has a free first hit that feels janky as hell, locks you in place, and provides passive slowdown with deep wound; 3) Has very little counterplay if any at all.
Like, even Nurse and Blight have some counterplay (lose LOS and play around edges of the map for Nurse; use bump logic against Blight, keep track of Blight's rushes to know how much time you have to get to safety) but for Ghoul you just have to hope they're bad, I guess?
With the most recent nerfs, trying to force pallet breaks seems to be what BHVR wants the counterplay to be, but considering his enraged vault speed, I have a feeling Ghouls will just ignore breaking pallets…
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The distinction between an M1 and M2 killer is informal but widely used in the community to describe how a killer typically applies pressure and gets downs
Pig does not typically get m2 downs. Or m2 hits at all.
One last time. Pig is not a m2 killer
Plague is somewhat hybrid, mostly m1. Situational m2 killer. You would descirbe her as m1,, or m2 argumentatively.
Community would call plague m1 though. Red puke is situational/variable.-2 -
I was too busy playing Orela to play Pinhead, I'm sorry
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Idk, yesterday I played four solo Q matches and I faced Deathslinger, Huntress, Nurse and Spirit. But honestly both Nurse and Spirit don't show up very often in my matches. I played only one survivor match during the latest Chaos Shuffle, in which I faced Sadako. But back when Blood Moon was on, the killers I faced the most were Kaneki (31% of my games were against him lol), Blight (11%), Huntress and Myers (7% each). From a grand total of 55 matches, which isn't really that many to be representative of anything… but it is representative of my own experience. That 31% is crystal clear on why I barely bothered to play survivor during Blood Moon, lol.
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M1 Killers are outdated and also are the most susceptible to all the cheating going on, there's so much cheating, so most people don't play them anymore as what would be the reason? Either you encounter cheating or SWF squads that ruin the match with the occasional SoloQ match.
lmao I've been playing Tombstone/Tuff Myers with enduring and spirit fury, there's been many many instances where a Surv will be right in front of the pallet and enduring cuts that time by 50% so I'll be moving through the broken pallet 1 second later with the surv directly on my groin, but then I get to watch as they use their speed hacks to boost them to the next pallet or window, often more than 15m away lol I usually DC and ofc in endgame, not one Surv has anything in their Kit to facilitate that, like smash hit.
I just had a match like that. Someone was playing that new surv, they were my first chase, they pallet stun me twice. I eat those two pallets and earn my spirit fury and on the third pallet stun after spirit fury took it and enduring cut that time to 1 second, I was directly behind the Surv and watched them get faster to outreach me and then go back down to getting slower and then faster again, like pulsating speed, all the way 15-20m to the next pallet. I dc'd and their SWF tried to flame me in the chat as if they were legit.
It's no surprise given the game climate, Killers pick the easiest and strongest Killers.
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