http://dbd.game/killswitch
Why complain about Genrushing?
It's literally the main/only objective to do in the game for survivors next to unhooking and totems. Having an issue with survivors Gen rushing is like telling them not to play the game. Yes, it sucks to watch 3 gens pop in a singular chase that took you longer than you would have liked to finish, but…..it's….the point of the game….I really don't understand why people get so bitter about it.
This is a legit question. No bitterness, just intrigued.
Survivors and Killers both make some arbitrary rules towards one another and what can constitute as "Toxic behavior". Just curious why this is even one of them.
Answers
-
Because people want time to play the game and (presumably the part left unsaid) time to play the game without feeling pressured to either swap to a different killer with a power they might not enjoy, limit their build to several gen regression perks, or resort to camping/tunneling to secure kills after the exit gates get powered quickly.
I think if you want to understand, you have to think of it as a mindset difference more than an objective difference. Some survivors want to load in the game and have a fair balance of doing gens, altruism, and chasing, with a relatively even hookspread and then they feel good whether they live or die at the end of the game, its whatever. And sometimes that's ruined by a nurse/blight with BBQ, Grim Embrace, Pain Res, and No way out that hard tunnels 3 hooks on the same person at 5 gens. And so whether or not that survivor lives or dies, they are annoyed with the pacing of the match, even if killing survivors is "just the killers objective." For those people, enjoying the match is the end goal, and winning/losing is secondary. For killers with the attitude you described, that means having adequate time to have chases with different people and do a little tug of war rather than getting 1-2 hooks and having the game practically be over.
17 -
i don't mind sweating for a kill but doing it every game is annoying i would honestly stop complaining if there wasn't a gigantic double standard when it comes to survivors tunneling their objective compared to killer since the objective for killer is to kill at the end of the day but killers get punished for tunneling, camping and protecting gens (due to 8 kick limit) so killers end up with a miserable experience unless you don't care about winning or just pick nurse or blight
0 -
Gen rushing is the equivalent of tunnelling, as you say it’s just doing the objective as fast as possible.
15 -
Sure, but if we constantly say "Tunneling is a viable strategy" wouldn't that mean gen rushing is a viable strategy? Both are just playing the game in the end. Unfortunately, with any PvP based game, one side has to ruin the other sides day in order to feel the joy of "winning"
I think it's rarer that we walk away with everyone usually feeling super happy about how they won or lost.3 -
It's super unfun playing against a team that hard splits on gens to get 3 gens done at the first hook then waits the entire 70 second timer before going for the unhook to pound gens. Most killers don't have the mobility to even do anything about that so the game is basically just lost right from the jump. On top of that most players that play that way are incredibly toxic sore winners. Then on top of that you also get barely any points
I was going to give kudos to the devs for changing the spawn rules so survivors spawn together. That would have helped with that issue, but then they made an offering where everyone starts separated so the SWFs can just spam that instead of Comp Key/MacMillan Bone. Utterly pointless
2 -
I don't feel it is or should be a complaint about genrushing itself as you correctly point out that clearing the 5 gens to escape is the survivors objective. I think instead it is more a complaint that the tools killers have to deal with it arent very good, and on the perk side of things, that is true. Slowdown perks and gen defense are the weakest they have ever been by far.
6 -
I 100% agree on this one. I think my biggest issue, especially with the ever expanding survivor perks, are even with the new perks for killers, finding a way to slow gen speed can be difficult without locking yourself to a 4 hex perk build to run ruin, and even then, I think Ruin now is more of a minor inconvenience at best to experienced survivors. There are a lot of perks these days that give way to longer chases, while the perks to lock down gens into regressing are few and far between, and some with specific conditions locked BEHIND being able to down and hook a survivor, which as I mentioned, can sometimes take too long, causing 3 gens to immediately ding.
2 -
it's….the point of the game….I really don't understand why people get so bitter about it.
The generators are the survivor's objective but they're not really the point. The point is to interact with the killer. If anyone queues up for matches solely to play gen repair sim, that's pretty lame.
As for why people are bitter…
Generators function as a sort of timer that can be influenced by the actions of the players. Gen rushing means four people queued up to play a five-player game with the sole intention of speeding up that timer and ending the match as quick as possible. That leaves the fifth player feeling like four people don't want to interact with him and specifically worked to make sure he got to do very little in the match they queued up to play together. They may be on opposing sides, but they're still playing the same game together.
It's similar to tunneling. Instead of the killer feeling they were excluded from the game, one survivor feels they were targeted to be prevented from playing. For survivors, a fun match is well rounded with chases, saves, and gen repair, so if a survivor is prevented from doing two of those three things and yanked out of the match as fast as possible, it feels pretty crappy.
We can talk about "illogical" and "but gameplay reasons" and all that, but in the end players are just humans, and humans don't enjoy playing a game where they're prevented from playing and/or feel like no one else wants to play with them. DbD is a game where playing efficiently is often unfun as hell for the opposing side, and it understandably causes a lot of friction. No amount of talking it through is going to change that gut reaction and frustration many people are going to feel in those situations.
6 -
The issue with genrushing is the lack of engagement with the actual game. Sitting on a Gen for the whole match doesnt mean you really *did* all that much aside from just holding down a button and pressing another when a skill check occurs, but that doesn't engage with the killer, cleanse totems or even open the exit gates. I can elaborate on many different angles for this but keeping it simple for the prompt: genrushing does not equate to playing the game
3 -
like to see someone understanding the middle ground no one else can see.
sucks doing gens and killing are the main objective both come with genrushing and tunneling either way someone going have bad game on one of the sides.
3 -
I've mainly seen people bring up gen rushing to justify tunneling. If the game is going to go fast, then they are not going to care if someone was just unhooked or not.
2 -
No idea. Term came out of excuses from what I can tell. Survivors have nothing else to do. Asking them what they are supposed to be doing would pretty much nulify any complaints about it.
Tunneling though. As many seem to, hilariously, attempt to compare it to. Killers can choose who they want to chase. Survivors dont get to choose anything but doing a generator.
They are simply incomparable. Embarrassing for anyone trying to make a similarity between the two.-6 -
Time, I'd say.
Generally speaking, DBD is not made for fast-paced trials. Players, myself included, prefer to have enough time to fully enjoy the match.
As "genrushing" defeats the whole point of this. Honestly one of the reasons why I still think the original Hex: Ruin was one of the best perks in the game's history: because it slowed the game down… just a little bit.
9 -
You're 100% right.
2 -
Most survivors complain about killers killing too fast/efficient, you know its their objective.
Either allow killers to complain or shut up about tunneling.
1 -
Gens are effectively a timer on the trial. The longer the match goes, the better it is for the killer.
Survivor resources are limited and consumable, so the longer the match is, the more pallets are consumed, items deplete, hook stages and bleed out are permanently consumed resources. Even gens themselves create smaller playable areas as they are completed. All of those core game mechanics favor the killer the longer the match is.
People complain about gen rushing because they want to win more, that's all. Even when killers had nearly complete control of the game during the 3 gen and gen kick metas, people still camped and tunneled more because they want to win.
All of those core game factors I mentioned are various, base kit comeback mechanics for the killer. Comeback mechanics like those do not exist for survivors. If one survivor dies before about 3 or 4 gens are done, the game is over. So, a hard tunneling killer turns the match into a race to finish gens before one person is eliminated. If you didn't complete gens early, when survivors are strongest, it's just gg.
1 -
A bunch of possibilities I've seen:
Quick Matches Aren't Fun: Even if the killer wins because the survivors are easy to snowball, a few minute match doesn't have the back and forth that makes DbD enjoyable.
Absolutely fine complaint, though enjoyment issues always vary from player to player.
Full Gen Rushes Builds are Too Strong: The argument that if survivors load out on just everything to focus on gens, they are unbeatable.
Subjective complaint that I don't think is correct, but an important thing to have in mind.
Gens in General Go to Fast: Now the killer is replacing the survivors with who the real target of their ire is, BHVR.
I think the complaint is wrong both on the facts and who it is addressed at, but the first is the reason for discussion forums.
Tunneling Comparison: 'I'll stop tunneling survivors when they stop tunneling gens!' A bad argument for multiple reasons, but mainly because killers have various strategies they can employ, other than being chased survivors have very little else to do.
Just Trolling: Matches were all the survivors are running MFT, or DH, or Distortion are much rarer, so what else is there to complain about when the killer loses?
8 -
To sum up the replies, you shouldn't genrush because killers don't have fun when you do it. 🤷
4 -
"DBD is not made for fast-paced trials" The game itself is LITERALLY a time-trial. The longer the game goes on, the higher chance a killer has of winning. Just because you want more time in each match to do stuff doesn't mean that the game isn't made for fast-paced trials. Playing quick and efficiently is the best way for survivors and killers both to win. Lots of people play this game to win, because they enjoy winning. Don't mix your preferred playstyle with "the game is not made for being fast-paced"
-2 -
To be fair, friend, that is not exactly the case.
In fact, an extremely quick match isn't a guarantee of victory nor, overall, what the game is designed for. Hence the sheer difference in points between a quick match and a longer match. Or the many perks we have that take time within a match to activate, such as a Devour Hope.
Yes, some people play the game to win, which they can do even after some time has passed. And in fact, that is where the gameplay actually shines. DBD isn't made for fast-paced gameplay, it is designed for longer trials.
1 -
I say Gen Rushing is a issue mainly for the newer Players who are just starting out on the game. Yes it's ur objective but it's like saying a Killer Camping and Tunneling or Slugging is an issue. Morely Killers want to Interact with every single survivor. Gen Rushing leads to Killers ending a match with so few Bloodpoints earned. Killer Mains complain because it's literally a issue that will become a bigger issue later mainly with the Anti, Slugging, Camping, Tunneling coming to promote Gen Rushing even more. My thing is that if the Killer Can't end the game in minutes why should the survivors.
This is also bad for some Killers like Myers, Ghosty, Skull Marchant, Trapper and other Killers who can't get across the map in seconds and I mean then extremely large maps that make it impossible to get to one side of the map to the other without a Gen Popping
I honestly thing Gen Rushing is a Issue that isn't talked about very much
-2 -
Okay, imagine you are playing killer and you get into a game (sometimes after a long queue time). Then in the first 5-10 minutes all gens are done and they are ready to escape. You just chased one or two survivors, perhaps got one hook. You see how frustrating it is? You are left with no time to do anything besides sit and watch how gens fly. Especially in some cases when a killer does not have insane mobility (stealth killers suffer from this the most).
You say these complaints, if heard, would force survivors not to play the game.
But the risk of genrushing compells the killers to use certain slowdown perks so that they can actually play and not just be impotent. Don't you see that in high MMR there are certain killers that are not used? This is one of the reasons. Take a Ghostface to a high MMR and prepare to be genrushed. Take a Scratched Mirror Myers and congratulations, you will be able to do nothing while having no pressure at all despite trying.
And survivors can do other things rather than just repair. Totems for example, NOED prevention. Loot chests. Preparing for the ordeal basically. Killers on the other hand are the ones who can just do one thing. Look for and kill. And they need time for that, a time they don't get when a genrush occurs.
So yeah, one could say that a genrush is not only telling a killer that he can't play the game. Is basically making them unable to play the game by force.
2 -
They’re not exactly comparable, but they are absolutely related. Let’s say someone is playing a setup-style killer with low mobility. Survivor team splits up and gets 2-3 gens done by the time killer gets first hook. Rinse and repeat during the next chases and the gens are done after 3-4 hooks, and of course we have to be super careful to make sure nobody has been hooked twice yet or else that is considered tunneling. What else is killer supposed to do to apply pressure to the survivor team to try to secure at least one kill? You live in a fantasy world where killers have unlimited time to play super nice even when survivor teams are playing very efficiently and gens are flying.
I’d love to see some of your killer gameplay so you can show us all the proper way that killers should be handling these situations.4 -
Isn’t that literally the exact same argument for why killers shouldn’t tunnel?
4 -
Exact same reason why survivors complain about tunneling, they can't play the game if generators are finished within 5 minutes
3 -
I’d love to see some of your killer gameplay so you can show us all the proper way that killers should be handling these situations.
No tunneling. Low mobility killer. Even got sent to Eyrie
1 gen left 3 hook stages still won.Dont move any goalposts now.
Would like to see your killer gameplay as it seems the problem is not me here.7 -
Gens already feel like they take ages to complete, i feel like a lot of the time when killers complain about "Gen rushing" it leans towards lack of pressure on gens and over chasing.
1 -
First of all, I very much respect that you actually posted video of your gameplay. So many on this forum like to have strong opinions about things with zero experience to back up those opinions. You are one of the few who doesn’t do this.
I watched the start of the video (don’t have time to finish it now, but will do so later), and I can already see that this match doesn’t apply to the situations I was addressing with my post. The first survivors you found were clearly F-ing around, not gen-rushing. It’s easy to see very early on why you didn’t need to tunnel given the lack of coordination or urgency to complete the objectives from the survivor team. I am not arguing that tunneling is required in matches like this. I’ve had plenty of matches play out the way this one did.
I’m talking about tunneling being required in games where survivors are coordinating, splitting up on gens (right from the beginning, which clearly did not happen in your match) and taking full advantage of the mathematical advantage they have which allows them to get all the gens done around the 4th or 5th hook as long as all the survivors are decent at looping and evading the killer. Sure, this doesn’t apply to every game, but I’ve had plenty of games go this way.
My whole point is that nobody should feel bad about playing the way they feel they need to play in order to win. Some matches require tunneling to secure a kill/win because of the skill level and coordination of the survivors, and some matches maybe the survivors aren’t as good but hey maybe the killer isn’t very good either and tunneling might be needed to secure a kill/win for those less-skilled players. It’s very easy for those who have never played killer (there are plenty of them around here) to criticize when they themselves have never been in these situations.-2 -
Survivors have two more categories for points/emblems aside Objetives and Survival, which are Boldness and Altruism. Saying that the only objetive in the game for survivor is repairing gens and escaping is simplifying the things a lot. Sure, you can equip Prove Thyself and Toolboxes if you want, but saying that being attached to a generator like a limpet and escaping with 16k points and bronce or no emblems at all for Boldness and Altruism is not correct. I can understand new survivors trying to hide and repair ASAP, but after a given mumber of hours I don't get why some people think that holding left clic and pressing space only is the peak gameplay.
Chases are hands down the most fun parte of the game for both sides.
4 -
Ive posted gameplay nonstop on this forum for awhile. So I dont know why it was even necessary. The least you can do is reciprocate for really any further discussion* as this post of yours is just goal post shifting.
*(A match where you think you were required to tunnel)
First it was
"Show us how you play without tunneling"
Now its
"Show us how you play without tunneling, whilst you going afk at the start of the round, while spinning in place for 5 minutes, while the survivors are coordinating, while the stars aligning…"
You are creating a scenario where ITS THE BEST scenario for survivors, and THE WORST scenario for the killer to fit your narrative.
Hypotheticals dont support anything im afraid.
But worst and best scenario if you watched the full match, happens towards the end. Where I am not in any position to be strong or comfortable. And during the match I was never really in a strong position to begin with it was pretty even until the end where it shifted completely to them with 1 gen remaining and 3 hook stages.I watched the start of the video (don’t have time to finish it now, but will do so later), and I can already see that this match doesn’t apply to the situations I was addressing with my post. The first survivors you found were clearly F-ing around, not gen-rushing. It’s easy to see very early on why you didn’t need to tunnel given the lack of coordination or urgency to complete the objectives from the survivor team. I am not arguing that tunneling is required in matches like this. I’ve had plenty of matches play out the way this one did.
You're just dead wrong here.
They werent doing gens immediately to avoid disease. Its part of plague slowdown. The equivalent of this is stealthing out nurse at the start of the match. You dont just go onto gens immediately.
Plus they were in corrupt.
And you need to be reminded again, or you just didnt watch the video:
1 gen left, 3 hook stages.
I wasnt exactly in a strong position, ignoring that I am on Eyrie of crows to begin with.
No tunnel, no camp, no slug;
Just macro play. You see hints of this every time that little Yui went main.
My guess is most killers who think "tunneling is necessary" would continue chase with that person. Which would lose them the match. And then be like "SEE IF I DIDNT TUNNEL…"
Heres another one as well this time its pigeroni.
Your response can basically be summed up as this common dismissal:
"Well those are low mmr survivors"
No matter what I posted you would have said this.Post edited by ChuckingWong on1 -
As always, not one suggestion in this thread as to what else survivors are supposed to do. What are 3 survivors supposed to do when the killer is already in chase with the 4th? Killers do not want the third player hanging around for the flashlight save or sabo play correct? That’s annoying correct? So please, for once- instead of complaining about this dumbass term of “gen rushing,” give some suggestions what else survivors can do within current game mechanics so it “lasts longer” for killer. I’m waiting.
P.S Totems and Chests take mere seconds and survivors are already doing them every match. We see each other interacting with them in the HUD.
-1 -
Genrushing is just survivors copleating their objective the most effective and faster way possible in u nutshell. Thats the same as killer tunneling, sluging and proxycamping occasionally when its supper effective for him to hinder survivors progress and kill them fastest way possible. Its effective strategy and not liked by your opponent.
3 -
Thats just the most short-sighted anwer to go with.
-6 -
Why complain about Tunneling ? Killing and hooking Survivor is the only Objective the Killer have 🤷🏻♀️
4 -
Because many of the Killers some people like to play as HEAVILY struggle to even pressure gens effectively because they do not have mobility.
Because it feels really bad to have the game be half over in one chase even if you do REALLY well in chase, all because the team brought gen efficiency items and perks.
Because it's simply a lie that, if you are decent at Killer and trying, really trying to go for chases - the fun part - that it's a skill issue if you lose a few gens in one chase. It's expected on some Killers to have this happen.
Because I would like time to play the round and interact with everyone - I can't do that when half the gens are gone in under two minutes.
Because there is only one Killer and most people aren't playing the super mobility ones like Blight.
Because I do not even enjoy Blight, Nurse, Kaneki, or speedy Killers; they make me nauseous to play, I have to play the slower ones, it's an accessibility issue and I am being punished for it.
Because it's not fair to M1s like Myers, Ghostface, Trapper, Pig, etc. to have to sweat MORE than someone mobile or who doesn't need to set up. Don't they deserve a game too?
Because well… do Survivors like it when they have their game over too quickly from the Killer going hard with tunnels from the word go? I don't. I sure hate this as Survivor, I would like to play the game…
Because I don't like to run a lot of stronger regression and I shouldn't have to do that on ANY Killer just to have a shot at my goal on some Killers - nobody should have to run gen regression to play a decent round if they don't want to, just like Survs shouldn't have to equip chase perks to play a decent round. Often, Killers may feel they HAVE to use perks like these because of past losses, because they feel unconfident, or because they want time to play with other perks. I promise we don't bring them because we hate Survivors and want them to suffer on gens.1 -
Chucking, don't bother arguing about this. I posted multiple times across a few threads here about how Ghostface, considered a Low Tier Killer if not incredibly weak (he isn't), could hold up in 2v8 with a similarly skilled Blight and Wesker in a round against equally good Survivors, and I got downvoted to hell for it because nobody wants to hear that lower tier Killers can be decent if the player is good or you run the right perks. They need to hold onto this idea they're "just bad" for their ego's sake.
If those saying that ever had the realization they're wrong, and these Killers actually DO require you to be more skilled than just spamming a power as say… Kaneki, or Blight, or Nurse? They'd feel bad. We can't have someone prove them wrong on the internet, now can we? Nope, downvoting and trying to argue the opposite is so much easier…
And no. You're not required to tunnel, slug, or camp on Ghostface either. Or Pig. Or Sadako. Or Myers… Or… insert "weak low tier Killer" here.
Post edited by LockerLurk on6 -
I couldn't have said this any better myself, bravo! This is exactly why Killer players still complain about genrushing. When gens go fast, they don't get to play and it feels bad. That's why so many bring these unfun gen perks. They want a chance to play, and these perks are their best chance.
Don't you like feeling good when you show off your skill as Survivor? I do! I like looping, it's fun. Similarly, I want to show off my skill with a Killer I dedicated time and energy to learning well, I want to have fun chases with Nemesis and Dredge and Pig and Ghostface and Dracula and Pinhead and more. I want to show you my skill at the game and test it on you. I cannot do this when the timer - generators - goes so fast I can barely focus on one person.
Being stomped on sucks. Losing in a 0k or a quick Out sucks. Being made to feel like you BARELY got to do anything or have any effect on the round sucks. And that's why Killers complain about gen speeds.
3 -
Well, my example is probably their worst nightmare, the kind of result their hypotheticals can’t explain away.
I had everything stacked against me:
- Eyrie of crows: most survivor sided map.
- Playing Vommy Mommy; tall, easily spotted from far away.
- Low mobility killer.
- Mostly an M1 killer with a conditional M2.
- One gen left, only three hook states, and all gens with progress.
No tunneling. Still pulled a 3K win.
According to them, that’s “impossible.” But it happened.
And that’s the point, tangible gameplay beats endless what-if spirals. Hypotheticals aren’t being used to explore ideas or balance. They’re being used to deflect, to protect their belief system, and worse, to avoid the work of actually analyzing games.
What ifs and hypotheticals can go both ways, endlessly. All they are doing is trying to win an argument on the internet. Nothing to do with dead by daylight or balance. Much like the "like" and "dislikes" they are looking for confirmation bias reinforcement.
So yeah, it’s ironic. They say "I’m in a fantasy for not tunneling", while they build their argument on a fantasy version of matches, and ones that I post as well. Dismissing them and picking them apart to fit their narrative, and ignoring the things posted above.
We need to push back, because if all the forums ever hear are emotional complaints dressed up as logic, developers, and players; never get the full picture.
1 -
I once managed to outplay a group as Dredge on Ormond, where next to no lockers spawn and they had stacked toolboxes. Dredge is not favored to win. I did not slug, camp, or tunnel on purpose. I did not bring anything too crazy for gen hold. I 4ked.
I also once had a Ghostface round on Eyrie - I was sent there, they had two sabo people AND the other two had generator progress perks AND they were efficient, and I was not on my A-game. I still 3ked, but only because I let an Ada go because she charmed me with Bardic Inspo. I'm a sucker for Bardic Inspo. :)2 -
This is why tunneling is a thing. The killer’s version of gen rush.
That’s what survivors don’t get. They only think such a way about tunneling because they don’t play killer consistently enough. If they played both sides long enough they’d see why killers do it. The same reason killers should understand why survivors gen rush if given the chance.The weaker killers must rely heavily on what is considered unsportsmanlike to win. As that feeds into the role of that specific killer’s persona too. Like if you decide to main Clown... Keep in mind that his power applies zero pressure onto the more skilled and competent survivors. If you don’t intend to bully and play unfairly don’t use killers like him.
2 -
And this is another reason I don't put stock in tierlists anymore either. I could care less what some bigwig online says about how good or bad a Killer is. How do they perform when someone who knows what they are doing and how to play Killer, or play THAT Killer, is in the round?
Ghostface and Plague STILL win 60% of their Kills. 60%! They are tying or better 60% of the damn time. This is true of every. Single. Killer in this game.I am so tired of hearing "But Dredge C tier because locker spawns!" and "But Ghostface D tier because no mobility and Reveal and he has to hope Survs make mistakes!" and "But Houndmaster A tier because she has haste and antiloop!" Buddy. BUDDY. Every Killer has a basic antiloop called mindgaming, and every Killer can learn to work around a lack of resources, and every Killer takes advantage of Survivor mistakes. A Killer is not good or bad based on their kit's potential, if you judge a fish on how well it can climb a tree of COURSE it looks like it's a "weak" animal. But if you judge it on swimming, or on being good at camouflage…
Now apply this to Killers. Apply it to say, Dredge. Dredge may be map dependent, but what does it do well? Mobility, antiloop, and a little stealth. That's a workable kit. How about Pig? What does she do well? She has basekit slowdown - BASEKIT. SLOWDOWN, so few Killers even have basekit slowdown! - and she has stealth and a dash. There you go, antiloop, something stealthy, and a basekit thing almost no Killers get. What does Ghostface do well? He's really really good at stealth, and he gets a lot of info basekit from both stalk and Reveal - he also instant downs, something not a lot of Killers get basekit. Many Killers need addons for that. Played right, that is basekit info, stealth, AND antiloop. What doe Plague do? Map pressure, injury pressure, and she has some range that can damage conditionally plus she gets some info. That can be really strong, and often can create catch-22s for Survivors - not a lot of Killers capitalize on keeping Survivors injured like that.
And what does Nurse do in comparison? She… has mobility and can break loops entirely. What about Blight? He has mobility and… breaks loops entirely. Boring. Yawn. Give me these "weaker" Killers with a lot more depth to their kits that require learning the game any day.1 -
we also need to push back the ideology of "it's so ez to get 3k/4k without tunneling/camping/slugging" or simply just not playing meta builds in a world where state of matchmaking doesn't let you actually play against people with higher macro understanding.
It's like judging the state of league of legends based on how a Challenger smurf went into silver lobbies and managed to hard 1v9 every match
2 -
Tbh the reason I think Survivors truly hated The Ghoul was nothing to do with his ability. It was his mobility. They couldn't handle a killer with such great map pressure because some Killers suffer on Very Large Maps that take 2 deck ages to get to one side to another. And The Ghoul was perfect for those types of maps.
I understand Survivors Gen Rushing on matches to get a upper hand which is the same as For Tunneling and Slugging its literally for the same reason. There's some Survivors that wanted there strategies to be uncountable to most killers. That's why I love Going Next prevention is going to be thr Best change in a long time.
I say this if the Killer can Tunnel or slug or even Camp or even Gen Kick Spam on a Gen then the survivors shouldn't be able to Sabotage hooks infinity, Blind the Killer infinity or even make it so the Killer Literally can't do anything infinity. Because that's where the unfair crap of DBD comes in. The Survivors can Gen Rush and pound there Objective in 1min but the killer can't Regress a Gen more then 8 or 10 times and can't Tunnel a Survivor out to fork pressure they desperately need to play catch up.
Not saying a survivor shouldn't do there Objective but not make it game breakingly fast that it's like the exits powered on before you even moved from spawn.
1 -
Firstly, why do survivors complain about tunneling? Its pretty much the same reason for killers. I don't like calling it "gen rushing" more so, "gen efficiency"
The game is obviously designed in such a way that assumes that survivors aren't all going to be efficient on gens, but when they are, gens fly and the game is basically over within the first 2-3 minutes. The first chase should not dictate the entire game, and unfortunately, due to how the game is balanced, unless you are playing one of the top tier killers against a team that knows what to do you are probably going to lose.
Mathematically speaking, if your team is, you know, actually doing gens, all you have to do is shift + w around the map while being chased, predrop a couple of god pallets, and 3 gens will pop.
Yeah you could argue that the killer should drop chase and try to go somewhere else, but we are assuming good players who are probably communicating. So, you tell your team the killer dropped chase, and immediately hop on the nearest gen. And given that, unless the survivors make 2 bad mistakes, you are gonna lose 3 gens before you get that first down. And from there the game is effectively unwinnable if the survivors know what they are doing due to so many systems in place to prevent the killer from catching up:
- You can't tunnel someone out easily because of so much basekit and perk based protection
- You can't camp someone out because the game will let them unhook themselves
- You can't regress the gens because you gave a limit of 8 regression events and survivors eventually win the long game.
- You can't deal with it in the endgame because gates open too quickly, and never regress even if you push survivors off of them
- You can't even easily secure that final kill in the endgame because for some reason basekit BT still works in the endgame.
Survivors get many many many MANY second, third, fourth and even fifth chances through basekit mechanics, perks, and having teammates to help them. Killers never get any second chances, and when they do through things like, arguably, NOED, they get complaied about and nerfed.
And on top of all that, look at the roadmap, and see whats coming:
- More anti-tunnel things
- More anti-slug things
- More anti-camp things
So i ask you simply, where are killers second chances? Where is the basekit corrupt, or the basekit corrupt on totems that makes it so i don't lose my hex immediately because RNG spawned survivors on top of it? Where is my basekit pain res that encourages me to spread hooks? Where is my basekit regression that makes kicking gens without gen defense perks worth it? Where are my basekit gen defense tools that make it so i'm not forced to take some kind of slowdown perk(s)?
They don't exist, and thus, i just play nurse, because that's the only option really left to me anymore.
5 -
Its not impossible, but it basically requires the survivors to make a mistake. Survivors have to make mistakes for killers to actually win (outside of nurse and such, but nurse doens't play dead by daylight, she plays the nurse game).
If you had a game for example, where both sides were mechanically perfect, and made every decision perfectly accurately, the survivors would likely win, because the game requires killers to capitalize on the survivor's mistakes.
4 -
My suggestion isn't that survivors do something else, it is that the game is designed in such a way that you won't lose 3 gens in the first chase and/or there is some kind of comeback mechanic in place for killers.
An example idea i had for example, is to make the time it takes to complete a gen scale with the number of gens done. So, for example, right now, each gen takes 90 seconds. So as you do gens:
- 1st gen: 90 seconds
- 2nd gen: 90 seconds
- 3rd gen: 90 seconds
- 4th gen: 90 seconds
- 5th gen: 90 seconds
- Total: 450 seconds.
Now for example what if it scaled in such a way that you had like:
- 1st gen 130 seconds
- 2nd gen 110 seconds
- 3rd gen 90 seconds
- 4th gen 70 seconds
- 5th gen 50 seconds
- Total: 450 seconds
Same amount of total time, but means that the game starts off a bit slower. Also it helps out with 3-genning, because that last gen can go super quick so 3-genning becomes weaker.
3 -
Yes, but my answer is that the game would be better for everyone if tunneling was not only not "required" to play efficiently, but not possible from a gameplay perspective, and the game was balanced in such a way that killers could actually go for getting 12 hooks.
Killers generally don't have that much more fun tunneling than the survivors who get tunneled. I'd rather win by going for 12 hooks, unfortunately its just not an option unless you are playing nurse or something.
5 -
Now its"Show us how you play without tunneling, whilst you going afk at the start of the round, while spinning in place for 5 minutes, while the survivors are coordinating, while the stars aligning…"I think that's a great point.
It basically boils down to: '[insert strategy here] is unbeatable, ergo if you beat the survivors, they must not have been using [insert strategy here], because its unbeatable.'
It is related the example of 'Good survivors are unbeatable, ergo if the killer won, the survivors must not have been good'.
People have established their conclusion and are working backwards from that instead of looking at evidence and working toward a conclusion.
0 -
Ok and ? You can also 3-4 out Nurses, Blights, Billies, Ghouls or tunnelling killers in general, I did it plenty of times even in Solo Q matches, so I guess by your logic you shouldn't complain about these killers or their tactics either cause they're still very much beatable.
6 -
It's the same with "tunneling" and "camping".
People going for their objective in an efficient way is often viewed by their opponent as "not fun".
It's just the nature of PvP games, it is how it is. Just play how you want.
-3
