People who complain about DS
are just tunnelers.
If you don't tunnel, you never encounter DS every coming into play. It's only a 4 second stun because for the 1st second the survivor is locked, the stun only activates after being tunneled off the hook, and the activation is only 60 seconds anyway. It's not like enduring wasn't a great perk anyway and is used by most killers, now you can just use it and tunnel to your heart's content.
I don't mean this ironically; if you complain about DS, then just get good. Don't tunnel, learn how to apply pressure to the team and not just focus down one guy.
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Going after the easier target is playing smart, no matter how many times you try to shame killers for doing so.
Stop tunneling gens if you think tunneling survivors is so bad.
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And going after gens with more than 1 person is playing smart :/
Tunneling and gen rushing are excused for survivors and killers to play cheap. They both need to go. No if ands or buts.
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SO to sum it up, DS is a 60 sec invulnerability perk.
I got it
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I tunneling every game survivors when they make gen-rush
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Its not invulnerability because you can still pick up and hook people.
It only activates after you tunnel, so if you hate DS so much because you go against it so many times, then chances are you wouldn't get any kills anyway as a tunneler.
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It needed the buff.
Enduring made it useless.
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I didn't say it wasn't playing smart. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy in pretending that tunneling survivors is reprehensible, while happily tunneling away generators.
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Tunneling is a choice of playstyle - DS punishes tunneling.
Gen rushing is a problem of mechanics because there is literally nothing else to ######### do as a survivor. I'm not going to wait around and have a picnic in the killer shack while I wait for you. Gen rushing is a problem, yes, so we need another objective. Tunneling is just a tactic players use to secure a kill, which can now be countered.
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Oh my bad. Thought you were calling out survivors for gen rushing like survivors call out killers for tunneling
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It's invulnerability when you're, in practice, saying that killers should just do nothing to unhooked survivors for a full minute.
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No hypocrisy here because you compared two different issues.
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People who complain about tunneling are just bad. They should learn how to win chases and stealth better.
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I don't prefer tunneling, so i don't really care anyway.
But i'd prefer for them to not make Enduring better.
It's already a great all-around Perk, and is fantastic combined with Spirit Fury.
We're not there yet, but i just don't want to see "Brutal Strength is almost required" 2.0
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How do I win a chase if the killer never leaves the hook? How do I win a chase if the killer is only ever chasing me? In the 5 gens I run the killer around and only make a mistake twice, am I the bad player or the killer?
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Oh never mind, my old killer main shined through there.
But why is the survivor only free to move after 1 sec? they should remove that hoenstly
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Winning the chase means actually escaping the killer. If you're on the hook, you already lost. If you're being chased for that long, then you're bad at winning chases. Survivors have a ######### ton of leeway in chases. It takes two mistakes for you to go down. A single mistake by the killer can pile on so much chase time that he loses.
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It just isn't though. It makes it worse to go for the same person for 60 seconds. Firstly you can still get them it will just be harder, secondly 60 seconds is like no time at all so what you on about
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But that's not what OP wants. OP wants 60 seconds of invulnerability.
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I totally agree. No one can really last that long, and there is definitely no counter to tunnelling, as the way the game works makes it very difficult for anyone whose not an expert to escape a chase undetected, and that's against a bad killer
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So if I make two mistakes in 5 gens worth of progress, then in your eyes I am a bad player and not the killer who couldn't catch me for 5 gens? Okay mate.
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You are bad at winning the chase, yes, which is why you end up on the hook and come here to complain that your crutch doesn't let you get off scot free.
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Imagine if all of the people saying "stop tunneling" actually knew how the perk is being used in high rank endgame meta builds (w/ BT + Adrenaline) where it literally guarantees free escapes (from the trial).
Imagine.
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If they rely on this perk, chances are they don't make it to high ranks anyway.
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Sorry, just to verify this because I can't believe what I am seeing.
If I was to end up in your lobby, and I manage to loop you for 5 gens then go down at the end, am I the bad player?
Or you?
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Why are you pretending you didn't read the "at winning the chase" bit? Do you think it makes your argument stronger or even valid if you pretend I didn't specify which part you're bad at?
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No one said anything about relying on it.
Using it optimally is, unfortunately, just smart play.
I do it myself, but I shower daily :3
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I've ignored it because my original question didn't include it.
If I loop you for 5 ENTIRE GENS then I get knocked down, am I bad or you?
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Can't speak for other survivors, there are definitely some boosted noobs at high ranks who rely on DS (I've been paired up with many Claudettes), but I got to R1 without actually having DS unlocked. I only got it from the shrine a few weeks ago when I saw the rework and I love it. It's a huge ######### you to tunnelers.
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Your question is unspecific. Bad at what? Bad at eating corn chips? Bad at breaking wooden boards with a single punch? Bad at basketball? Even just taking into account aspects of DbD, the game is more than just looping, believe it or not, so "bad" doesn't really say much. That's why I specified what is demonstrably true that you're bad at - winning the chase.
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Okay let me reverse the question to expose your bias.
Is the killer good at winning chases if he downs someone after being looped for 5 gens?
Your logic against my first question would answer yes to my second question, which specifies what is demonstrably true; you're bad at winning chases.
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Okay let me reverse the question to expose your clear bias.
If it takes 10 years for a killer to catch a survivor who is looping him, but at the end of 10 literal years of looping, the killer downs the survivor, is the killer good at winning chases?
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No, but the killer is better at winning chases than the survivor who lost the chase, by definition.
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But how can the killer be better than the survivor at chases?
For a killer, the way to win a chase is to hit them twice. For a survivor, the way to win a chase is to not be hit twice.
If it takes 10 years for the killer to reach his goal, then how in the world can you say he is better than the survivor? The survivor doesn't have a goal to reach, they just have to last as long as they can against the killer.
If they managed to last 10 years against the killer, then how can you say they are not exponentially better than them?
If I loop you for 10 years right now in KYF match, nobody would say you are better at chases than me. I've seen stupid killer and survivor mains before, but this level of Killer extremism is scary.
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Someone has their views locked into the stall meta and willfully ignoring the definition of a Survivor winning the chase.
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If the survivor's goal is not to win the chase, then this discussion is pointless. You could just as easily say that the killer's goal isn't to win the chase either.
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They tunnel because they think the objective is considered toxic.
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If you have a killer chase you for 5 gens then yes you are better. Ignore Orion he's clearly just another entitled killer.
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I generally don't tunnel but I've still been hit by DS a couple times. Usually because multiple people are the same survivor and I wasn't sure which I was chasing. One time was because I was trying Member Me on Plague and had to tunnel my obsession off her last hook to make sure she was dead before the gates got powered. But I'm totally fine with that because 1) she's a RM obsession and I was intent on killing her so she needs a way to defend herself, and 2) I got 1 more token out of it LOL.
DS really isn't that bad anymore. OP is totally right, if you find yourself getting hit by DS often you are just a tunnely killer.
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