http://dbd.game/killswitch
This game is becoming so survivor sided
So what happens if you hook survivor A
You then cannot find survivors B, C and D but survivor A makes a mistake and you hook them again, this is only two hooks and you may have the intention of not tunnelling them out of the game. they get mad and let themselves die on hook, you now can’t kick gens and the remaining survivors get a gen boost.
How is this fair?
Also what about blood point and medal progression for regressing gens if you can’t regress them at all?
Comments
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There are a good amount of mechanics proposed to help you find a different Survivor to hook and keep track of who was previously hooked to avoid that. You only get locked out of regressing gens if you hard tunnel the same Survivor in spite of those mechanics. Which means that you are being held accountable for deliberately forcing someone out of the trial.
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It really isn't but I guess we will see how these changes will change the balance of the game.
Either way, I am all for anti tunnelling measures as the tunnelling is ridiculous at this point. A minority of killers ruined it for everyone, as they simply tunnel someone out every single match, which makes the match almost unwinnable for survivors and just creates all round misery for the majority of the players in the match.
This took longer than I hoped it would but better late than never.
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I say the same thing every time this comes up, which is that the killers role at its core is to find, hunt/chase, and sacrifice survivors.
There are dozens of information perks, and even killer kits and add-ons that help you locate survivors. Distortion was deleted for exactly this purpose.
If you can't find people, that is 100% a skill/game sense/game knowledge problem on your end at this point.
(I'm also going to add that this feature brings base kit BBQ, you don't even need a perk with this update).
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Ok so my mechanic to help me find other survivors is undone by using lockers… and the only thing that shows me who I have hooked before is a hud symbol that indicates the previous survivor I have hooked. So I will query this.
Survivor A gets hooked
Survivor B gets hooked
Survivor A screws up and gets hooked again (not tunnelling because it was their mistake and you hooked someone in between), They get annoyed and give up, now there are 4-5 gens that I cannot kick at all.
Also why do miserable survivor games get developer intervention, but there is a trend at the moment (bully builds on new killers) and they aren’t doing anything about this to solve miserable killer games.
-10 -
ok I don’t disagree there should be extra anti-tunnelling mechanics (there is already the deep wound affect for unhooked survs) but then what are the devs going to do about all of the “bully builds”.
Miserable survivor games get developer intervention but miserable killer games do not?
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If every survivor goes into a locker every time you hook someone then no one is on a gen are they? Use that haste buff you got from your hook and start patrolling. I think you're overestimating the number of survivors that will notice you're hooking someone, think to hide in a locker, and have easy access to a locker right when they need it though.
If you 'unintentionally' tunnel someone out early on you've still turned the match into a 1v3. The match isn't exactly going in the survivor's favor.
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the funniest part is, the main reason the game is survivor sided is because the survivor to killer ratio is 4:1, 80% of the games player base will see changes that make the game ridiculously hard for killers and think “these are good changes and devs will think the changes are overwhelmingly positive. The 20% of the base that are killers are out numbered and get their opinion ######### on.
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you can’t tell me the game was pretty balanced as it was, you could make valid arguments as to whether it was killer sided or survivor sided, this has by far been a massive buff to the survivors. My sister (a survivor main) even agrees either my brother, my friend and I that this update is survivor sided.
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that is only like 10-15 seconds that people aren’t on gens, and there are some gens that have lockers RIGHT next to them. That haste will not make up that much of a difference compared to the benefits survivors gets, they essentially get a free 2 additional perks for free now.
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Ok so my mechanic to help me find other survivors is undone by using lockers
Speaking as someone who played before 6.1 and the meta was to hop in a locker to avoid BBQ, this is good for the game.
Aura read is not the only indicator of survivor existence (you have gen progress, scratch marks, breathing, loud vaults, or just general "I've been everywhere except shack and haven't seen sable yet").
But even so, having to get off a gen to hide in a locker for 8-10 seconds and go back is all time spent not on gens. This slows down the game for free.
Also why do miserable survivor games get developer intervention, but there is a trend at the moment (bully builds on new killers) and they aren’t doing anything about this to solve miserable killer games.
I'm not even going to bother dealing with the whataboutism here.
Tunneling and camping have been complaints since the beginning of the game: 9+ years. Dead hard was nerfed twice after 6 years. It's been long since due for them to do something meaningful about these day 1 issues.
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Same can be said about survivors. One of tasks that survivors have is to run away from the killer for as long as possible. Why killer should be punished for finding the weakest link in the survivor team? Survivor's inability to last longer than 10 seconds in chase should be on them, there are plenty of perks to ''extend'' chases and remain relevant in the match too.
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half of those listed ways to find survivors are temperamental, or are only used to keep a chase rather than find someone outright. Also if your way of finding someone is “I have been everywhere but killer shack and haven’t seen her” then the chances are she’s popping that gen before you get there.
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You are 100% right about that
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The problem that does rise here is when does this happen. It isn't regulated at what amount of gens are done before survivor is killed. This rule essentially forces killer to go for a potentially stronger target who may have chase extension perks equipped, making catching them extremely tedious and time consuming.
All this talk about not commit to the bad chase now effectively can be thrown out of window now because for some ''genius'' reason killers shouldn't kill anyone until there are 6 hooks performed.
What if we introduce the similar rule for survivor then? No gen can be completed until at least 1 hook is made by a killer? Make it a forced 1 gen per hook rule?
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exactly, their whole argument is that that it’s a skill issue if you can’t find anyone. Well it’s also a skill issue if you get caught then, it’s also a skill issue if you don’t last longer than 10 seconds.
-3 -
Because the game ceases to function as intended when the Killer purposefully denies a player the ability to play the game.
Tunneling is FAR too strong for how easy it is.
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YES SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE BACK
-3 -
Because searching for the "weakest link" isn't a part of this process in any way. You're just chasing the first person you see into they die.
You're trying to imply there's some calculated strategy here, where the reality is it's literally a "shut off your brain" and "chase the first thing that moves until it dies".
If you get lucky and get fast chases, then that results in a steamroll win. If you get unlucky and find the strong link, you can still lose (although the "good" survivor is still likely to die).
Maps have been nerfed, pallets weakened, loops nerfed, tile spawn logic required to avoid chaining. This isn't 2018 with literal infinites, it's 2025 with entire maps of dead zones. Getting chased and downed isn't a "skill issue" when the last few years have all been pushing to make those chases shorter (demonstrably, with stats to show that was successful). Not by skill, by literally stacking the deck in the killers favor.
So even with this "strategy" killers can still manage to win games quite often because the mechanics to stop it simply didn't exist in live yet. The band aid perks are merely suggestions the killer can freely ignore.
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Thing is many survivor players can't and won't accept this statement. For some reason they feel like something is wrong with game balance that they got badly positioned or simply outplayed in any way and expect such cases to be addressed by the devs, usually in their favor.
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ill wait for ptb but in my mind you can basically force the penalty on the K basically because if they slug you there is the get up feature and if they finish you there is the debuff on them. Bodyblocking will be interesting, lets watch what the comp players will do with the changes..
Funny how a "scary" game will have mechanics for you to feel safe
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no because it limits what killers can do, there are games where you don’t intend to tunnel a survivor but they just fall into your lap because of their own mistakes, I’m now supposed to leave that person even though HE made a blunder? Will they return the same courtesy if I blundered?
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I know right let me hold their hand as a survivor make them feel safe with a hot blanket and Choco haha
-2 -
he’s not saying he targets the weakest link he is saying they did because they are the weakest link
-3 -
Gens aren't the killers objective, survivors are.
Gens are, at best, a consumable resource for the killer like pallets.
But you're shifting the goal post. You started by saying that you couldn't find anyone, and now it's "but the gen had progress". But this is a viable way to find survivors, base kit, for all killers. It's also called game sense, and a player skill.
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I've only skimmed the later responses to this thread so I may be repeating others' points, but I want to point out that your scenario here makes two massive assumptions.
First, "You hook survivor A but can't find B, C, or D". Let's talk about this- why can't you find them? I did read far enough to know someone pointed out that these proposed changes also include basekit information to help you out here, and they also brought up that there are a lot of other tools.
To reinforce that point, not being able to find survivors is pretty much just a skill issue. You should have a good idea of at least where some survivors are, and if you know that's something you struggle with, you should bring perks that complement this to better track survivors.I don't say this to denigrate you, it's encouraging - this is in your control, you can fix this problem.
Second, "Survivor A wanders into you and you hook them again". This glosses over that you don't have to do this, you can choose to down them and then leave them there on the ground to avoid penalties. Sure, they won't stay on the ground forever, but that's still to your benefit.
You have more agency in this process than you might think. Spreading pressure is already good, and it's set to get buffs- you're gonna do fine, and there's no shame in crowdsourcing advice if you're not sure what you're doing wrong.
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Literally, if you were to ever complain about getting gen rushed people would always say “don’t stay in a chase if you’re just gonna get looped” but now they are forcing you to chase the stronger survivors allowing the others to gen rush you
-2 -
This isn't a hard concept:
How do you know if they're the weakest link if you only chase one person?
If you've chased all 4 survivors, then I could buy this argument, but then... You aren't tunneling and this new system is literally only buffing the killer, since none of the "tunneling deterrents" come into play.
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Guys listen to the @UnicornMedal
And also make sure to read through the lines.
There will be BBQ & Chilli allowing you to briefly see your next victims as a killer aka survivors.
This will allow you to locate survivor B C D
I am sure that devs are aware and they stated in the dev notes there are perk adjustments coming as well to this too as a follow up so survivors cant rely on Distortion, shadow step, and other similar perks to hide aura from BBQ.
This will be a baseline alright that means baseline is something that is there and you cant really do anything except hide in locker.
Out of all outcomes the only method i can see players use is find a locker in time which is again something that in solo q players wont be using much not all 3 at least.
There will still be SWFs that will be cordinated and can talk and time hiding in locker to avoid being spotted.
Now thats where other perks come in play such as DMS and other slow downs that punish players for all hiding and not doing objective or letting go off the gen.
Dont forget there are variety of killer perks in the game.
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what are you talking about, gens are a killers objective, the whole point is to slow down how fast survivors are doing them to stop people getting out, there are whole builds about slowing them down. Have you even ever played killer before.
-4 -
I don't think I'm some amazing killer player or anything but the vast majority of my matches are either 3K + hatch, or 4Ks. I intentionally don't tunnel and don't really resort to slugging unless I've got a swarm of flashlight wielding bees around me. This patch is nothing but killer buffs for me.
- Free BBQ & Chili
- Free haste after hooking someone
- Free Pop goes the Weasel
Survivors get nothing because I don't tunnel or slug them.
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Is it killer's fault to begin with?
Also what is the ability to play the game in DBD in the first place? How do we measure when player has ''played'' enough and it's now ok to ''end'' their session in the competitive game?
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HE IS SAYING THEY ARE THE WEAKEST LINK BECAUSE HE KEEPS MAKING MISTAKES AND GETTING FOUND, are you ok?
-4 -
Then how is killer supposed to find the weakest link in the fist place?
Doesn't getting someone hooked and killed early already indicate the presence of weakest link in the game?
The way I see it killer should purposely ignore weaker survivors and go for the strongest one because weaker survivors also want to play. Yet if it's a killer who is weaker then it's fine to give survivors full reign of the match.
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Being found at the base of the your hook because the killer never left, doesn't make you a weak link. Survivors can't just teleport away, and the killer knows exactly where the hook is.
You're still ignoring that post of killer skill is identifying where the entire survivor team is, and trying to track all of them. You know, like the ones doing gens.
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not finding survivors is as much of a skill issue as losing a chase quickly so why do survivors need a buff because they can’t win their chases?
Also you understand this update also has anti slugging changes. Your method to not get screwed by the anti tunnelling changes is to slug them instead? So what do you want us to do slug or not to slug?
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You are so confused.
It's the killer, not the saboteur.
Killing survivors is the objective, gens are a resource that you can expend in the process of that goal. In fact, killers can still complete their objective of killing survivors even if all gens are done.
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You can argue that this update is survivor sided (and I don't think I've ever seen a balanced patch), but the game overall is the least survivor sided it has been in the six years I have been playing. It would have to go much further to even approach the level of surv-sidedness the game had when I first started playing.
But as far as the patch goes, I'm reserving total judgment until the numbers for many of these effects are revealed.
If you can't find other survivors in this aura reading/reveal meta, it is a skill issue.
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If you wanted to get really technical about it, it's BHVR's fault. Nobody is forcing Killer's to tunnel though.
Dunno, you'd have to ask them. Facecamping was removed twice for blocking normal gameplay.
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How about survivors let killer chase every one of them first before even touching a gen? Apparently this won't happen in a normal game, only in some fantasy dream one.
Killers need to capitalize on every mistake survivors make, just like killers are currently punished for every mistake they do. This seem to be a norm when applied to a killer role but when same principle is given to survivor role, suddenly things stop being fair or equal.
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Survivors aren't getting buffs related to losing chases quickly…? Not sure what you're talking about there. You're also treading a little into whataboutism here - what would you say if I agreed with that? It wouldn't work as refuting my point, and you'd in fact be agreeing that I'm right in that case.
For your second point, "anti slug" isn't all or nothing. It's not "slugging has no restrictions" or "you cannot slug at all", and the proposed changes still would allow you to leave someone on the ground if you want or need to. You just can't rely on them being there until they bleed out, especially if you're trying to do it to multiple survivors at once.
If you're in the scenario where you've misplayed to the point of only having the person fresh off hook nearby, you can still slug. It'll give you less than it would on the live servers right now, but it still does work to your benefit.5 -
Yeah generally speaking if we look at it that way its a big plus for promoting killer play like intended and rewarded for it.
Simply put if there is no one highlighted from BBQ it means they are nearby waiting for save or hiding in locker but that will be the minority of players since in most matches you will most likely get a guaranted 1 survivor caught by doing gen further away than 40m radius.
We are talking about BHVR giving killers ability to Rotate really fast and do proper gen zoning before its too late even againts SWFs.
I cant tell how many matches i had to draw at my high mmr lobbies because i simply didnt run bbq and found them fast to snowball them when i played myers.
Haste will be really good too that always helps and if it lasts for about 30 seconds or less and deactivates upon finding a survivor in LOS that will be a huge huge reward.
And free Pop is like a cherry on top lol
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If you are getting basekit BBQ & Chili, it's a huge skill issue if you can't find people.
Stealth is dead in DBD. Most Killers, it would seem, rely on going back to hook and tunneling immediately.
Shame that the quality of Killer has dropped so quickly after 6.1.0
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you are more likely to kill all survivors if all gens are still up that is just a fact you are arguing a point that is completely countered by the fact people run anti gen progress builds
-3 -
So? How many times have you actually lost after sacrificing someone early at 3 4 or 5 gens? Trust me youll be fine not being able to kick gens from that. God forbid the survivors have a chance if someone gets tunneled out. Also, God forbid the killer queue be below 10 minutes!
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All this is pretty much giving a survivor a free ''hall pass''.
If we gonna talk about not finding survivor being a skill issue, then we should also talk about being bad at hiding, looping and running being a skill issue too.
-3 -
Well if your sister thinks so, then that changes everything.
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Considering the current state of maps and stealth versus the abundance of aura perks, not sure that's equivalent.
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Can you make a proper post and teaming up with other ogs explaining how free BBQ, Haste & Pop will be huge rewards for killers.
Since i think many players just focus on word anti tunnel and slug and think its gg game over.
I think we wont get any explanation by the staff on forums here lol
Also @jesterkind can you also post a more simplfiied explanation how this actually will play out in a scenario and help Pulsar?
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To be honest with you, after seeing in which direction does this game go, I'd say I should save my time by not asking them anything than expecting any sensible response. I do appreciate the advice though.
-1 -
You're the second person to say that to me, but survivors aren't getting any buffs in those areas, so I don't really understand the point.
Hell, survivors are arguably going to be made very slightly worse at hiding because of the killer buffs proposed in this patch. Only slightly, but it's there.
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