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Sadako buffs + Addon Pass (My hopes for an update)

A little bit of background to me. I started playing around the Knight release. At that time sadako still had her first version, my favorite version. She was really scary and hard to play against. She constantly appeared out of nowhere and had full control over her TVs. Something that I‘m very much missing. To make it clear I‘m not complaining about winning too little. I have a 65% kill rate, but she just isn‘t fun to play. You either stomp survivors pretty easily or you get stomped, because survivors have full control over your power if they decide to use it. There is nothing Sadako can do to keep her TVs turned on and counter survivors turning them off if survivors play well.

With these changes my goal is to make her more fun for both sides (based on her first version), stronger against experienced players (where she desperately needs help) and it would be awesome if she got an addon pass to give her more options to choose from.

Basekit changes

  • She keeps her undetectable for the lingering flickering duration (,which is 4 seconds after manifesting). (New, better version of well water basekit)
  • The pallet stun immunity lingers for 0.5 seconds after manifesting. (New)

Often when I watch someone play her, I rarely see them use her demanifested state even tho it is a cool mechanic and quite useful. These changes would make her invisibility mindgame a little easier and beginner friendlier by not giving away her position with the red stain and by extending the pallet stun immunity a little bit. (I would only make the pallet stun immunity linger for 0.5 seconds because otherwise people would pre drop pallets even more against her).

  • She has her lingering flicker for 4 seconds after crawling out of a TV. (new)

It basically gives her the two above mentioned effects (undetectable and pallets stun immunity) and the flicker after coming out of a TV, which would make her scarier, stealthier and less predictable.

  • Allow her to keep flickering while breaking pallets and vaulting windows.

It would allow for more ways to mindgame and outplay survivors by vaulting windows/breaking pallets invisible, which I always wanted to do.

  • Please remove TV auras.

In her first version I loved trying to outplay survivors by teleporting ahead of them or where I thought they would run to cut them off. Sometimes more successful, sometimes less, but it no longer works when they know exactly where I will be through walls via the TV auras. Her teleport was the most fun part about her and it’s sad to see how ineffective it became. She also relies on bringing bloody fingernails every match because of them. You could probably make it basekit, but removing TV auras again would be the better solution.

  • Increase the tape insertion, grabbing and the speed for turning off TVs to 1,5 seconds.

More opportunities for jumpscares and counterplay to putting in tapes/turning off TVs in her face.

  • QOL: On the second hook all condemned stacks get locked in.

On death hook it wouldn’t make much of a difference between getting moried or hooked. The outcome would be the same. It would just be a nice change.

  • Tapes grant one stack of condemned for every 25 seconds you hold them. 

I really dislike that taking tapes is encouraged/forced and how free it became to deny her mobility (my favorite part of her power). There is no drawback or thought process behind it. You just run to the TV and turn it off. There is nothing the Sadako player can do to prevent it and it leaves you with nothing left to use.

  • Hooking a survivor grants one condemned stack to all other survivors. (Better version of ring drawing basekit)

It would be a healthy change for her. Her power is designed in a way that you are better off not hooking (slugging), which is why there should be a bigger incentive/reward for it and it would be a much better/healthier way to spread condemned than having to spam the teleport, which is not really liked by survivors nor Sadako players, because it is really boring and annoying.

  • When hooking a survivor with 0 lock in-able stacks, they will get 1-2 normal stacks. (New)

Hooking someone without any stacks often feels very bad and discourages me from doing so, because it feels like I‘m playing poorly.

  • You only spread Condemned around the TV you projected to.

I think her all TV condemned design is not good for her. It makes her stronger against beginners and weaker against experienced players (where she needs a lot of help). Shouldn’t it be the other way around? Weaker against less experienced survivors, because they aren’t as good at the game and stronger against experienced players when the Sadako player gets better with her. As of right now less experienced players struggle a lot and die very fast against her while experienced players can take away her whole power. By nerfing the condemned to no longer spread around all TVs, it would allow to give her back a lot of control over TVs and have a little detection system that tells her someone is near you whenever someone receives a stack after the teleport.

  • Original iri videotape basekit: Hitting a survivor within 8 seconds after manifesting turns back on the last 4 TVs turned off by projection.

Making this addon basekit was what most Sadako players hoped for back then. It was her best, most fun (to this date) and one of her most used addons for a reason. It should have been made fully or partially basekit like you did with many other killers. It would make this killer a lot more fun to play if it came back (especially basekit).

Addon changes

My goal is to give every addon an unique and interesting purpose. These ideas would work with and without the above mentioned basekit changes. Some of the addons are either too weak, would become basekit and need a new effect or aren‘t needed as an effect anymore, which is why I suggest these changes.

Chase addons

🔴 Iri videotape (rework) - for map traversal and chasing with TVs

  • Sadako can teleport to a turned off TV, which doesn‘t spread condemned 📺. Add a cool flickering effect to the turned off TV when she crawls out of it. (New)

🔵Telephone (made blue)

  • Survivors suffer from a -7% (was -3%) hindered Status Effect for 3 seconds, when Manifesting within 7 meters of them.
  • Reduces the required time to manifest and demanifest by 0.2 seconds (to 1.3 seconds). (new)

🟣 Tape editing deck - for jumpscaring people

  • All Survivors start the Trial with a tape and have to bring it to the furthest TV.
  • Survivors who are in a 3 meter radius to an active TV get twice as many stacks of condemned and are revealed by killer instinct. (new)

🟣 VCR

  • Causes all TVs to make sounds when using projection.
  • Generators near an active TV start regressing again when you project somewhere. (New)

🟢 Well stone (rework) - for the early game

  • At the start of a match she crawls out of a TV next to a survivor and the TVs are not on a 30s long cooldown. (new)

🟢 Sea-soaked cloth (rework)

  • While demanifested and during the lingering flicker duration break pallets/walls, vault windows and recover from successful basic attacks 15% faster. (New)

⚪️ Newspaper (merged with reikos watch)

  • Increases the duration of your full Invisibility after Manifesting and while being demanifasted by +33 %.

We don't need two addons for basically the same thing.

🟢Reikos watch (rework) (meme addon)

  • The haste from protection gets turned into hindered and given to survivors and the killer for the duration of the speed when someone is within 16 meters of the TV you projected to.

The victims wouldn’t be able to move like in the movies, while Sadako slowly comes closer to them.

Condemned addons

🟣Ring drawing (rework and made purple)

  • Condemned Survivors spread their Condemnation to other Survivors, who complete a Healing action on an injured Survivor. (revert)
  • Hooking a survivor with tape, grants all other survivors one stack of condemned. (If it doesn‘t become basekit)

🔵Well water (rework)

  • Every time a generator gets completed every survivor receives a stack of condemned. (New)

⚪️ Cabin sign (rework)

  • Hitting a survivor breaks their tape. (New)

Hit and run addon

🟢Yoichis fishing net

  • Survivors with 2 stacks get mangled (new), with 4 stacks blindness and with 6 stacks hemorrhage (new).

Stealth Adoons

🔵Rickety pinwheel

  • Survivors suffer from the silence (was oblivious) and fog status effect when within 12 (was 8) meters of a turned on TV and within 3 (was 0)meters of a turned off TV. This effect lingers for 1-2 seconds after leaving its radius (new).

New status effect: Silence

  • You become deaf and don't hear anything (the lullaby). The visual heartbeat deactivates.

New status effect: Fog

  • There is a (white) wall of fog which blocks your view and auras outside of a 18 meter radius.

Oblivious isn‘t useful for her because of the lullaby. The new silence effect has the advantage of removing the lullaby as well as the terror radius. The fog effect would create a better atmosphere while limiting aura effects and the view. The radius changes are there because TVs are turned off most times.

🟢 Clump of hair

  • Reduces the threshold for full Invisibility while Demanifested to 14 (was 18) meters and the full invisibility lingers for 0.5 seconds (new).

In the end all I hope for are changes that focus on making her a fun character again. I don‘t care whether she gets buffed or nerfed, just make her fun to play again. It didn‘t matter to me back then when she was considered weak. She was a blast to play. I enjoyed the hard but rewarding matches where I had to work for every win without getting it handed to me. Not every killer needs to be blight level strong. Give them some cool, fun and unique mechanics that only they have and you have a blueprint for success.

Comments

  • Skitten56
    Skitten56 Member Posts: 555

    At this point I can't see BHVR returning Onryo bad to single target condemn, even though returning to release Onryo with the QoL buffs and part basekit Iri-tape would be fine.

    BHVR will also likely never revert to hiding TV auras across the board, The auras help newer players and the white auras for killer objects being visible is consistent with their new standardization. I just don't see a point in fighting a losing battle. Better to fight for hiding the auras conditionally when it won't hurt new players but will help Onryo against skilled players, such as when holding a tape.

    Best compromise for addressing TV auras and strong survivor counterplay while not hurting newer players would be to hide TV auras from survivors already holding tapes and either increasing the amount of stacks for turning off a TV when holding a tape, or giving survivors ticking condemn if turning off a TV while holding a tape.

    Same with returning to ticking condemn without restrictions. For similar reasons as to TV auras, I don't see BHVR doing this so its best to argue for it conditionally such as when survivors hold onto a tape for longer than 120 seconds or something, and then they get ticking condemn as mentioned above.

    I do like your suggestion of the flickering buffs as they would allow for more mindgames which she could use as an m1 killer. Also strongly agree with increasing the TV interaction from 1 second to 1.5 seconds.

    Add-ons:

    It is hard to comment on the add-on changes since your suggestions for them assume your new power idea is in effect, however there are a few that are worth pointing out.

    The add-ons changes you suggested that I really liked were the following:

    • Cabin sign - Allowing Onryo to break survivor tapes on m1 would help a lot with punishing suriviors that feel safe enough to ignore condemn until chase and then insert the tape in the killers face.
    • Well Water - Giving survivors a stack on gen completion would be a nice effect, nothing major but could catch survivors off guard if they rush gens over condemn management.
    • Tape Editing Deck - Adding a new effect to Tape Editing Deck where survivors within 3 meters of a TV get extra additions stacks would be great. This effect could replace the current primary effect of survivors starting with tapes, as that effect of survivors starting with tapes is actively detrimental to Onryo.

    I would also like to take a moment to tell BHVR that Sea-Soaked Cloth and Ricky Pinwheel need to work when TVs are NOT powered on, instead of how they currently work around active TVs. The counterplay for this killer with the reworks pretty much assures survivors will never be within the radius of an active TV for more than a few seconds, rendering these add-ons virtually useless.

  • Langweilig
    Langweilig Member Posts: 3,125
    edited September 27

    Thanks for the feedback my friend. I will never give up on the best Onryo version we had. Even if it might be a lost cause.

    I don‘t like the white aura for teleport points (also not for unknown, xeno …). It kinda defeats the purpose of calling this game a horror game when survivors have more information than they need. I also highly doubt the auras do that much for new players. The only players I see falling for my TV mindgames are new or casual players afterall, so showing TV auras only really helps the more experienced survivors. Aside from that, TVs were never difficult to find and always at obvious spots next to gens, which is why I never understood the Introduction of them. Survivors even get an audio que when she teleports.

    Best compromise for addressing TV auras and strong survivor counterplay while not hurting newer players would be to hide TV auras from survivors already holding tapes

    It would be a nice start and a major step in the right direction, but I rather see them completely removed. They just remove all the fun from the killer and make her teleport mostly pointless while removing her fearfulness.

    increasing the amount of stacks for turning off a TV when holding a tape, or giving survivors ticking condemn if turning off a TV while holding a tape.

    Both would be really good.

    Same with returning to ticking condemn without restrictions. For similar reasons as to TV auras, I don't see BHVR doing this so its best to argue for it conditionally such as when survivors hold onto a tape for longer than 120 seconds or something, and then they get ticking condemn as mentioned above.

    When we talk about the current version I would agree with you. There a strong passive condemned is too much. When we talk about my version, she needs it, because my concept and the concept of 1.0 was that survivors should only take tapes to remove condemned or if they are afraid of TVs. Making it 120 seconds while only allowing her to spread condemned around one TV, would make her a joke. With these changes I‘m trying to make tapes something you don‘t want to touch again if you don‘t need to of corse.

    Tape editing deck: I would actually keep the starting with a tape, because it would encourage survivors to go near TVs at the start and with the killer instinct + double condemned near active TVs, it would synergies really well.

    Sea-Soaked Cloth an Ricky Pinwheel need to work when TVs are NOT powered on,

    So true.

    Thanks for the comment again. It‘s always nice to discuss stuff in the forums. Sadly no people reply to posts that are long.

    Post edited by Langweilig on