http://dbd.game/killswitch
What the logic behind creating surveys?
Well, I think it's some kind of unhealthy tendency happening here, and I was mostly silent regard uninstall survey and sinister grace survey, but after completing 2vs8’s right now I want to discuss how disingenuous, compromised, and just genuinely harmful this are. Which, for one moment, leads to actual changes in this game.
Firstly, first time I was’t able to record or screenshot survey. And if the survey for sinister grace were able to be completed on phone, what suddenly happened with this one? Is it me suddenly “struggled” or they just provided some “confidential” stuff seeing how people reacted on last one?
Secondly… well, about 2vs8 survey
1.Technical implementation of the event.
Considering this factor, they provided 0 options of telling about your opinion, so they conveniently can miss:
— Tiles generations issue (pallet density inconsistent, dead zones or extremely busted spawns still exist)
— Bodyblocking of the uncage prompt (that allowed for trolling/griefing)
— Collision issues for Huntress, DeathSlinger, Executioner
— Spawn issue on Lerry
— A silly bug on Greenwille with locker still exist (just shows how previous issues wasn't addressed)
— Dracula has bug with third bounce
— I wouldn't list every bug I encountered on this event, because simply want to make a short post.
Thanks to “well considerated” survey, all of this problems more likely gonna be ignored for next iteration. Even most critical one, like collisions, prompts, and RNG issue.
2. Survivor feedback
Not gonna lie, I feel they overdone with this. Anything from satisfaction about class player played the most to how they feel frustrated about any potential killer. Well done, BHVR, you even asked how fair is to play against someone! But… what about asking what we feel about absence of SBMM? About players who are staying afk and they don’t receive any punishment later? About what we feel towards own teammates sometimes, so you at least can consider creating a small tutorial or warning that you need to rescue teammates from cages, especially if you are medic class?
3. Killer feedback
Beside opportunity to provide a specific feedback towards specific killer, killer players received… nothing to tell about their frustration. And I noticed this extremely weird tendency among every survey. The only stuff they ask consider this role “how easy it was” and maybe, rarely, sometimes u are given a privilege about complaining on map traversal or something else. But… What the logic behind it? Why BHVR is so obsessed with “do you find it fair to play against x playstyle /killer” for survivors, yet completely neglect with same questions for killer side? Yes, on this survey u have “optional” fill box for both roles, but considering a proportion of answers and considerations two sides get, the only stuff I notice is that this is another survey that leads to completely compromised data. I noticed absolutely same tendency with Sinister Grace chapter, where the half of actual problems people complained regards technical issues of Krasue or gaps was missed. And that's BHVR gonna ask you 10 times how unfair you felt going against x thing as survivor, but on killer side, people on stream gonna scream “pallets” and the answer we get “Unfortunately, my research still didn't show why slugging is suddenly so popular on Gideon”. Maybe, excuse me, u even don’t search for it from other perspective?
4. Killer rate page
This page probably the main reason why I made this post. “What was your killer rate” and “What killer rate you should get” — this question just confused me so much.
What the goal behind such questions? You understand your game asymmetrical one. You should realise that regards such questions you will never get a proper, healthy answer. Survivor mains will lower this rates. Killer mains gonna put them higher. Actual 50/50 is impossible to achieve. Survivor players simply have higher ratio, so I think the answer in such regards gonna be pretty obvious. The ask of personal rates I also find pretty… redundant, because again, we don't have any SBMM in this game mode. And yes. Of course they didn't ask “what do you think about escape rates”. This chase of asking towards every deal killer have to face is actually just showed me devs simply don’t understand their own role in game.
More and more I look at surveys, and more and more I feel afraid that they participate in decision making. Because questions there either missing, extremely one sided, or in opposite, just controversial and not gonna give specific answer. If this is a kind of data BHVR seriously choose for their game, I’m seriously gonna consider uninstall the game and put “devs factor” in my answer why.
Comments
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I hated every survey they put out. With most of the players having to be survivors 80-20 the surveys answers are gonna be heavily biased towards survivors opinions and any killer opinions likely get drowned and lost in the same pile.
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I mean it’s fine catering to majority. But minority in their surveys even don’t have opportunity to voice as same as others. So this is double compromise simply and it seems many people are genuinely like it, because it lets them validate their opinion. Of course if other side is more silent
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1000 questions for survivors but none were DO YOU WANT NEW CLASSES?????
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”I found impactful playing x class for ensuring others had good experience” — or something like this. Questions are so vague by formulations it’s easy to fail in proper citation.
Yeah sure BHVR, killer classes meant to be pleasant for others, sure.
If someone could provide more of their “pearl” questions with proofs under this post I would be grateful, because my Steam rejected to record survey, as much as I wasn’t able to take any screenshots for some reason.1 -
The issue rn isn't that the killer experience isn't in demand anyways, as much as the points are valid it's that the survivor role needs to be more enticing lol
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This is assym game. If not bugs and improper matchmaking + terrible learning curve you can easily close eyes on frustration factor.
But it feels BHVR just like victimising one role and put a blame on other, when factually they should look on core of the game firstly (what they still refuse because it’s too “wasteful” for them by resources). I don’t find any role victims here. Survivors are way far away from being weak, same with killers. So the obsession with asking about “fairness” should go. BHVR shouldn’t ask such questions for assym game because answers gonna be extremely obvious, yet they don’t give instruction how actually to deal with it. They still asking community about such stuff completely neglecting that their community has polarised sides. This is some kind of joke…
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I do think they are addressing them though gradually, Wesker's breaking bug was fixed and they are reworking Legion too, which I personally think the new version sounds really fun potentially.
Killer players tend to vocalise themselves a lot more I find, the feedback is heard, just need to look here on the forums. That said they could do better on the survey front to ask questions tailored to the killer experience.
I don't think they blame any role, they have some choice words from time to time, but I find recent years they've made solid changes to either side. Could they do more? Yes I feel they could, especially for the killer casual experience, which is what i was hoping the fresh hook incentives would do. I've seen your opinion on those and I have to agree base perks should be the answer but I do feel some kind of back and forth needs introduced.
I don't think they could ever make meaningful changes to the game without causing us vs them but at least they keep trying. I'm not gonna defend them, but I'll take what I can get from these QoL, I just want both sides to be fun.-1 -
The only thing I care for is Escapist to be nerfed. Its such a powerful survivor class, it completely denies pressure from every killer and it feels like a 'instant win' button for the survivor. Nerfing Shadow and buffing Escapist is the biggest slap in the face when it comes to balance. Until they do that, I believe they're covering their ears and trying their hardest to not listen to the killer side.
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Yeah the on activation SB is crazy lol
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Once again, there's a massive problem of survivors NOT enjoying the game and killers waiting and waiting to play. Why are we mad they are trying to find out what survivors dislike? We really can't be this out of touch.
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No one is mad at Behavior trying to find solutions to problems in the game. The issue is how they do it and what comes out of it. With skewed surveys that don't offer proper data, while completely ignoring other aspects about it and even leaving out things like bugs untouched.
More importantly, them having a creator program full of people with thousands of hours into this game willing to give their opinions, and never actually listening.-1 -
My main was neglected in this event, while gameplay on survivor is simply boring. So now I just play 1 vs 4.
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My friends who play DBD don't actually want to play 2v8 killer with me because killer feels terrible. And I don't insist because I know I could be putting them in a worst experience than 1v4.
And some people like to say that's a good thing, claiming that those who are not playing will shorten the queue. The only people who say this are survivors, I don't know any killer who wants their experience to be worse just for the queues to be faster. I'd rather wait 30 mins to play a fun match than to wait 10 and have to deal with 5 rows of pallets and multiple Escapists.
Only reason I play 2v8 in soloq is because its the only way to interact with the killer community in-game. I don't mind if I get a newbie Trapper or Ghostface.1 -
Why do people keep using "but the queues" excuse. They have been the same for every version. We had two bots at some point which made survivor miserable but were still as long as today on average. Some killer complaints are valid and should be addressed.
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I think we have higher killer queue ratio, but only before evening, where more players able to play with friends.
We still don’t know actual reason behind long queue times. Can’t refer to video of one content creator because it’s not English one, but he proposed that new “play while you wait” feature + the fact that 2vs8 lobbies are actually two 1vs4 lobbies “stitched” together affecting times. This, if not counting chaos of the mode and that killer with friends in more demand.
1 vs 4 also struggle with queues, but only on specific regions during specific times. When I lived in my home country and played on Asian servers, killers wasn’t in demand there. German and Russian players prefer survs on evenings times, they are more likely to play sfw. For London servers I find now more people playing survivors than killers, if not counting morning and early day.
Killers also might have busted MMR because win conditions are trash in this game, so it’s hard to find proper lobby for them. Maybe that’s why abandon not affecting MMR btw… they try somehow balance this broken stuff, or I’m just trying to find some logic.
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I've been here long enough to remember when this community used to criticise the devs for not releasing enough surveys.
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How do you know there is a massive problem of survivors not enjoying the game? Maybe it’s just you?
I have played solo queue survivor most of the time in this edition of 2v8 and I’ve had a lot of fun. Killer queue times are still way too long, but this has been the easiest and most fun I’ve had on the survivor side in 2v8.
What issues do you have with the survivor side in 2v8?
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I don't think I'm the only one. There's literally a 300% incentive and there's still not enough survivors.
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I've said this in another thread but I think it bares repeating here: I don't think any buffs to survivor or nerf to killer could impact killer queue times in 2v8. 2v8 offers something for killer that they can't get anywhere else in the game, whilst for survivors it's just an easy escape simulator with little to no gameplay changes.
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The impression that I continue to get is that the developers by and large do not particularly care about the gameplay experience of killer players.
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More likely, but it doesn’t cancel the fact that surveys simply weird now
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Looking at amount of downvotes under your comment it seems some people are just enjoy busted stuff on their side and simply afraid to lose it. And that’s why some people tried to justify uninstall survey as well, because it let them support their position that they are special by playing unenjoyable survivor role and that they deserve even more, XD.
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- A small clarification: I'm referring EXCLUSIVELY to this survey. I think it's normal for the questions to be more focused on the survivor, simply because everyone (at least I definitely do) prefer playing the killer. It's simply not normal to wait half an hour for a match; there's a clear "fun" issue. Why does everyone want to play killer, and few want to be a survivor? I think this is a bigger problem for the Devs to solve right now. Because over time, as the killer roster increases, the situation will only get worse, certainly not better. I'm surprised some people don't realize this (big) problem.
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I don’t find it normal, when you focuses on one sided experience. And as I told in comments above, I don’t believe in survivor shortage on this event, as much in game overall. Most likely caused by technical issues.
When devs will officially release “we don’t have enough survivors” not from surveys, but their in game tool, and they will show ratio, then I’m gonna believe in it. Until then, it stay as speculation for me purely. Since my first days on this forum, the only argument I’ve seen is “queue times”. Yet majority just ignores that broken MMR and servers affecting on this too.
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So killers aren't players, and their experience doesn't matter. Is that what you're thinking?
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Ok, but you still didn’t answer my question about what specific issue you have with the survivor side. Why are you not having fun with it?
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Once again a terribly designed survey. As soon as I saw the question about which killers you find frustrating in 2v8 I thought "Yup, guess they looking to put another killer in the sin bin".
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Killer just lost content overall compared to survivor. Like removing killer exclusive co-op powers for inferior classes, then nerfing the only good class and then just removing a killer from the mode outright because Behavior could bother to balance it.
But speak about balancing anything in the survivor side, nuh-uh. You're in the wrong. Medic duos healing people mid-chase when its meant to help on resets, or Escapist having an ability even more powerful than old Dead Hard with a 30 second cooldown? No, they'll get mad they didn't get to use these things alongside the genrush power of the Guide in the v1.1 -
There is a huge flaw in this incentive. Blood isn't required to play 2v8. NONE. There is no grind for 2v8. NONE. So incentivizing us with a small amount of less than the main game can offer bonuses, that's not going to entice most of us.
It needs to be 10x or higher to get me to queue survivor.
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I agree that playing as them here is boring as hell, because nothing has really changed. It would have been interesting to see this mode if the criteria for winning here was different. Then perhaps the content creators were more interested in playing here, because it's something truly new to understand. Killers already have a unique experience that's not available in the normal mode
I doubt that adding classes/maps/more farming will attract a huge number of people, because the core of the game for survivors will not really change, it will be a temporary stopgap
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Likely because getting Survivors to queue for 2v8 is already difficult.
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This is a tendency of their surveys, from uninstall to last sinister grace and this one.
It's a weird perspective about asking what you should deprive killer from instead of asking valid questions about classes and maps. Not “what you would like to add”, not “what do you want to change in your own role”, but “what other side should do to please you”. No valid reasons to defend such stuff without looking offended by killer presence in game.
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I can't see the survey, so I wouldn't know.
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I genuinely tried to record to put screenshots here, but it didn't let me to do this.
I don't mean BHVR shouldn't ask such questions. But they are extremely picky in this term. I was’t making post about uninstall survey, sinister grace and others I’ve done. But this one was my last drop of patience. Apart from drop of hate to killer side (whatever), you even can’t point on technical issues. While they actually are in this mode. Me personally encountered with Executioner power not going through textures on RPD, Lerry, Borgo… and that when I played survivor some griefer bodyblocked prompt for unhooking of teammate until other person showed this to the killer. Or, like, how Executioner can see aura of survivors being send to the cages, that allows immediately locate players. Doubt survivors gonna be happy about such stuff. And I gave up bug reporting on forum, because every of my post this regard was ignored.
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That's not what I said at all, I do think our feedback matters when it comes to killer.
What doesn't matter is Us Vs Them lol1 -
What waiting? In 1v4 for on EU servers in day time survivor que is faster and in evening opposite. In 2v8 killer que times are just same as two 2v8 before first was shortest and gameplay wise survivor is way easier and stronger role if your teammates arent bunch of potatoes that dont touch gens then you can still rush gens even when killers are overpteforming (meaning killers are getting fast downs early on) other thing all survivor classes are viable and weakest is guide but killer classes arent their main strenght but then we have wesker,dracula with third dash and many reduced cooldowns but then phead with few small buffs or slinger with two addons into basekit and those arent even his best or nemesis without marvins but his infection is two times easier to get rid off dam when he is with wesker then survivors have like what 24 sprays that cure both which is hardcore for nemi so only half of killers are worth the que times and weaker ones are still weak even in 1v4 their 2v8 would be still not way better exept trapper (ghostface has 30 to get instadown which is nerf so his 1v4 version with drop leg knife addon is still better).
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Unlike the drama over the exit survey, this survey was definitely more geared toward Survivor. And I think it makes perfect sense. BHVR is not able to generate enough interest for Survivor with 2v8, despite it being so in-demand. I'm not BHVR so I don't know their intentions, but I would guess they're trying to find a middle ground there. I think getting angry that it isn't focused on Killer is really missing the point (in my opinion).
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It makes perfect sense for the 2v8 survey as desperately trying everything from sky-high bp incentives to having killers able to play survivor in queue still doesn't even out queue times at all. Hopefully the conclusion they make is to add actually fun content like new classes and/or maybe interesting mechanics based on the "theming" of any given iteration of 2v8 and such, as at least that might have a little chance of actually doing something.
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there is no logic. They literally ask you about things they HAVEN'T changed
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I feel some people who trying to justify survey even didn’t try it themselves, yet they rush to say how it’s logical and fine :/
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How does the uninstall survey show this? Unless I’m mistaken there’s only one option regarding a specific side, that being the tunneling/slugging option, every other choice can be used by either survivor or killer players.
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It’s a new version. Old was more biased and had three options being one sided, but still.
“Used by either side” is also bad. If formulations are too vague you even don’t understand what exactly to fix. Calling something unbalanced can be interpreted in many various ways. Unbalanced surv or killer perks? In what terms? What exactly? Without specificity is just bad.
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