Please stop telling survivors to learn how to loop!

Tunneling is one the most effective ways to pressure gens, so your point doesn't make sense.

People make this statement because it’s 100% true. If a survivor can take the killer on an extended chase (ie THEY ARE GOOD AT LOOPING), it makes tunneling far less of an effective strategy. If you want to show us how well tunneling works against really good loopers, please go ahead and post some of video and I will gladly admit that you are right.

Do you want singulari/chess merchant games that end up with the killer winning after an hour because the server shuts down?

https://www.youtube.com/@dbdleague

Are these bad survivors? Season 10 had 2.9 kills/game average. These matches typically revolve around tunneling.

You cannot be using that as an example. those guys have their own rules and restrictions. For example afaik myers plays only on hawkins in their sets. If anything it shows that tunneling is a necessity at that level

Also they switch sides so it’s not even comparable to normal dbd. Dbdleague had a no restrictions night where survivors just bsolutely demolished with slippery meat build.

What? You shouldnt be a better player to beat the bad player? You dont need to be the best looper in the world to loop a newb for 5 gens, just better.

Yea the skill floor is lower for killer than survivor but that’s not a problem except regarding matchmaking.

The most important aspect of playing survivor is understanding your agency, its limits, and how best to utilize it. You cannot control your teammates any more than you can control the killer, but you CAN improve in ways that offset any deficit in the impact their agency has on your own. If someone is getting tunneled and you aren't in a position where you could force the killer away from them, you CAN slam gens to punish said tunneling. If you are the one being tunneled, you CAN waste the killer's time and pressure to the point where their hyperfocus costs them the game, with an added bonus of potentially escaping as well.

I think that 1v1v1v1v1 comment irreparably damaged how people look at the survivor role, and the way MMR was implemented basically amplified it. There are next to no rewards to playing as an actual team player outside of an improved likelihood of survival. Therefore, when people feel there is no chance for survival, they just want to get into a match where they do more than they do even finish the match they're still in. Playing a losing match removes a lot of the incentivization that is required for teamwork to even function in this format, so it becomes defeatism.

In many other games and their respective genres, playing with no hope of success is much more normal. In fact, it actually creates a perfect environment to work on solutions: If you're playing a fighting game as a grappler and someone is clowning on you as a zoner, you can accept that defeat is likely while learning the predictability/patterns to their projectiles to test and explore ways to gain ground and overcome the lopsided matchup. There's an actual term for it called downloading, where you essentially accept a defeat and utilize as much of it as you can to learn about your opponent to help in future rounds.

In a MOBA you might be a champion who has a hard counter in something like lockdown, while going against an opponent with very high crowd control. While they are perfectly fit to neutralize you if they land a hit, the adaptation then literally becomes don't get hit, and you learn how to better position and space yourself to maximize your impact while minimizing your risks. Even if you lose the lane, that temperament and adaptation will be what stops you from being underbuilt after the lane phase ends.

Hell think of stuff like the SoulsBourne games, where the entire premise is for the game to be unfair and unforgiving until you develop the skills and experience to be able to breeze through things that would hardlock you for hours/days/weeks/etc. You can't go in and tinker with the rules of the game, move encounters around, or curate elements of the games to make them more reasonable: Your only recourse is to improve and utilize everything you can, rely on the agency of others to offset your own failures (co-op,) or to just give up and move on. Yet those games still resonate with people in an age where most games are mostly just delivery devices for feel good chemicals in your brain anymore.

Its a universal concept in competition that our own agency is quite literally the only thing we have direct control over, and anything outside of our agency requires compensation to either dilute or amplify the impact of the things outside of our control. Yelling at people on the forum won't make them play the way we want, nor will guilting them. The MVP on a sports team isn't always the person who scores the winning points, its often the ones who turn assured defeat into potential victory. Its not an easy thing to do, especially knowing there is an aspect of likely futility to it. But in improving how you adapt to the situation, and how you maximize your own agency in order to offset what agency you lack, you give yourself the best chances you can directly influence.

People often assume skill is about results, and relies on things like mechanical prowess. Strategy and adaptation are just as much facets of skill, arguably moreso as they are essentially fundamentals. NONE OF THIS IS TO SAY THAT COMPLAINTS ABOUT THINGS LIKE BEING TUNNELED ARE INVALID, but more that as players self improvement is a very important consideration when discussing concepts like balancing in a PVP environment, let alone one with as many variables as this game does. If you aren't able to utilize the tools you have, you can't expect a PVP game to acquiesce to your lack of growth at the detriment of others who are willing to do so.

So while I agree that extreme tunneling (which the definition of what actually is tunneling is a whole other discussion) is bad for the game's health, and encourage the devs to address it specifically in a way that doesn't favor either side, I know that those words are just that. Encouragement. I can't walk into BHVR's HQ and impose my will on them, nor should I be able to. All you can do is give your honest feedback, and then work on what you can do personally to minimize the impact of that issue on your game. Its similar to the foundation of concepts like radical acceptance, aka "It is what it is." But the most important thing is to realize that suggestions like that aren't necessarily meant to be taunts, in fact, they're often genuine advice.

Is there a video of that unrestricted night? I would love to see it.

it was streamed live on dbdleague twitch

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/2598497529 thats the first vod

Thank you

I think a lot of survivor players are under the mistaken assumption that the point of looping is a guaranteed escape from the chase/trial, when the point is to buy the team more time to work on the generators and open the gates.

You're not playing an action adventure game. You aren't the invincible hero.

So yeah.

Learn to loop.

You are right, if killer tunnels its mostly survivor that is normal or mostly easie to get because its fast kill and most preasure in shortes time that doesnt kill killers momentum and increases his chance on win but when survivor is great looper than the tunnel is mostly just loose for killer so technicaly the harder the tunneled survivor can stay alive and hold killer on him so his teammates can push through gens the less tunneling effective is.

lol i do enjoy these "tunneling is bad" posts… the means to counter it are there. learn to loop, learn to lose line of sight, learn to stealth, learn to make better decisons (when in chase run away from the gens), generally learn to play. so many people have this 1 track mindset of survivor role of loop loop loop and when that fails they throw a tantrum and say "there is no counter".

let me fill you in on a little secret….. there is more to playing survivor than looping. you dont have to get chased at all if you play it right.