The players are the problem
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IDK if you missed out on one of the most famous Dev streams, where it was explained that kills = skill = win. Escaping = winning. Do I agree with that mindset? Absolutely not. But sadly the game doesn't reward you for skillful plays, in fact most of the tactics that did require skill have been nerfed over the years.
To give you an example: a survivor that loops the killer for multiple gens, but yet got face-camped to death wouldn't get much BP nor would it count as a 'win', even if all their teammates got out. Then we finally got anti-camp, but that still doesn't work in the end-game (which is really fair) but the fact remains that if that person on hook dies, it will equal to a lose as per the game. Their MMR will drop. If you get hatch, it won't count as a win. If your MMR keeps dropping, you will be paired with players who might've installed the game 2 days ago, and you're just stuck in a vicious cycle. Unless you SWF.
As a killer if you hook every person twice, and get 1 kill. It won't count as a win. And so on and so forth.
The issue is the total sum of what you realistically can do versus all the other elements of the game that you don't control, but can massively impact your gameplay. Be it teammates of different skills / mindset. Be it the map you spawn on. The RNG of the maps. If the game rewarded you for more than escaping/killing (this in regards to MMR), then skillful plays would also factor more into winning conditions, and feel more rewarding because they quite literally would be.
I remember before the increases of lockers and the proper placement of them, it was awful to play Dredge on certain maps. So to put all of it just on the community? No, I don't agree with you on that one.
You reap what you sow. This state of the game might be exactly what the devs want: a scale that is always tipped in one way.
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Agreed. As much as I will stand and die on the hill of 'this is a competitive game' that does, inherently, mean a loss rate is not only expected but healthy. If you sport a 70% rate of 4K, I'd suspect something is dramatically flawed. I myself took to employing things like tunneling as a response to secure 1K or 2K out of a situation, or to force a group engagement. But I don't sport that high of a kill rate, and don't aim to maintain one.
It's not 'I'm playing to win' necessarily though we can package it that way. The actual mentality is 'I am playing to not lose, because losing means I'm not having fun.' Slugging means a person feels they lost. Tunneling, camping, the same as buzzword topics go. But when a Killer gets teabagged at the gates with 0K they feel like they lost. When they eat a series of Head-On + Flashbang combos in a row from a SWF, they feel they are losing.
And the fact of the matter is that in this game someone has to be the loser. BHVR needs there to be a loser, as well. It's part of the driving force that sells the game. If the new Killer comes out who is really strong, people are more likely to buy them. If the new Survivor has amazing perks? More likely to buy them. People aren't doing this because they just want to have the ability to not lose and never use it. 'I just got Ghoul unlocked because he's S-tier and questionably balanced but I don't think I'm gonna play him.' Yeah, that's that )*%% no one ever said.
All this being said - Of course people strive to win alot but complain when it gets sweaty. Your standard player, survivor or Killer, could tell me the sky is blue and I'd go outside to check. I wish it weren't so, but sensibility is rare.1 -
You're partially right - we are a big part of the problem but lets also not pretend BHVR is the staple of gaming studios or that they have been doing good work. The last year was pretty much a dud and waste of time.
Way more bugs, way more things break with each new chapter, their quality patch regarding anti-tunneling & anti-camp went absolutely nowhere and was given MONTHS of attention, all for it to be scrapped. Their report system hasn't been altered since the creation of this game, we still have no real incentives (BP is not a real incentive) to strive for. We have an outdated bloodweb system that received almost no changes and when it did, it was after 7+ years. Killers that haven't been touched or fixed in YEARS.
You can blame the community, I'll blame the dev team for wasting time, amounting to nothing, and then scapegoating the community as a reason to not try things or push the game forward.
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You are of course right too. The devs have a very big role in many DbD fails.
However, I really think some people underestimate the part we, the community play in this whole disaster. We are at fault, too.
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Legends are not forgotten
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The game will never really be balanced is the issue. By its nature as an asymmetric game it won't be balanced. The difference in game balance between low and high mmr makes it totally impossible to create a power balance that is fair and fun for both roles at all mmr levels. This is why i think the ranked/casual playlist split is the best way to make the game enjoyable for the most people.
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The big problem is even when the devs do give us solutions all the YT content creators scream doomsday and say dbd is dead BHVR has killed dbd
BUT when KILLERS get the buffs it’s all radio silence from the YouTubers funny how that works huh???
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The is the real divide in the DBD community. Not the "Killer Vs Survivor" divide, which is typically the focus of most balance discussions, but the divide between casual and competitive players. That's actually the much more important one, imo. My basic view is that DBD was originally designed and marketed by BHVR as a casual gaming experience. But over time, the game has been pushed towards a more competitive balancing direction by years of community feedback (focused and amplified by influential and competitively minded content creators). I wasn't around for much of the game's history, but I know enough history to understand that certain aspects of the old DBD were as far away from "balanced" as you can get. So no, it was obviously never intended to be a serious, well balanced competitive game.
The direction of travel seems to be heading further down the road of competitive balancing for the enjoyment of top MMR players. I can see a more balanced future for the game at the top level (where people play this game as a serious e-sport) but a bland, frustrating and potentially less interesting game for the rest of us. I can only hope we'll finally get permanent casual and competitive queues some day and 1V4 will be free to fully diverge into a more competitive direction. I didn't always believe this was viable, but it looks increasingly likely that 1V4 won't be able to keep both camps happy for much longer.
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The problem with a ranked/casual queue is that alot of the people who want it would have no intention of using it properly. What they really think will happen is their difficult opponents will go to competitive and they get easier games in casual. I think they'll still be surprised when even casual opponents steamroll them on occasion (because skill still matters) and the accusations of people being in 'the wrong queue' will start. The only way it could work in any real capacity is if there was an automated system, but in that case they may as well just fix and tighten matchmaking since you'll pretty much get the same result.
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I'm not so naive to believe that a ranked/casual playlist split will fix everything. Of course you will still get seal clubbers using casual for easy wins. But a lot of the more hardcore players will gravitate towards a ranked playlist. Particularly if the rewards are good. Ranked emblems, killer and survivor skins that can onl earned through ranked progression each season.
It would certainly be better than what we have now. Atm my survivor games are generally 80% hatch games and my killer games, although I do well, are usually sweat fests. I generally have to either play killers I'm really good with and use meta perk builds, or tunnel my heart out to secure a slightly decent game with low tier killers and/or substandard perk builds.
A casual playlist would give me somewhere to experiment with new perk builds/killers and actually have time to see of they work. As I said, i know it won't be perfect but it will be a push in the right direction.
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Both camps aren't happy at the moment. You only need to look at the forums to see that.
I know it's human nature but competitive scene on dbd always confuses me. Like the game is designed to be balanced in the killers favour. Competitive dbd tournaments always need to add specific rules to balance the game. They have to impose so many changes and limitations to gear the game towards a fair tournament play. And lets be honest, dbd is never going to end up with a competitive esports community.
I don't see why the base game can't be balanced to provide a decent experience at low mmrs and then a ranked play list can impose whatever limitations to allow players a balanced experience for high level games. I.e. limiting perks/certain perk combos, limiting items etc. Heck they could even change the base mechanics of a ranked playlist to provide decent balance for that.
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