To everyone thinking the Legion changes killed him:
You know that button? Yeah, the big left bumper on your mouse, commonly referred to as “M1”?
Learn to use that, and you’ll realize these changes are absolutely great.
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People love to overreact. Get ready for people saying you're wrong and they're dead
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I think we need to just get over it and find a way to master legion. As most people think Freddy is weak, he is not, and i'm certain the are just scary Freddy mains, that will make you reconsider your thoughts on him. Same can go with legion, we just need to find a way to master him
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The problem is not that they change his/her power but the BUFF to BT i feel like that change was needed but the new deep wound it's just bad and unfair for all the killers special when MOM is in the game the way it is
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Well that’s an MoM problem, not a Legion problem.
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You're right. Those legions will be forced to use M1. M2 will be useless outside of that first "free hit" im hearing so much about.
Afterall frenzy hits dont deplete deep wounds anymore, so using frenzy in a chase will only weaponwipe/ stun the killer without progressing anything. Probably giving survivors a speed burst too, devs know how to please the crowd.
Also no progress while in terror radius, with an embiggened terror radius. Legions wont be even able to use deep wounds like whispers because they cant see it anymore....
Im gonna be skeptical and guess that the combination of less frenzy speed and increased duration will still result in less distance covered.
But hey atleast 115, right?
Im a killer but not part of the legion, thus i guess theyre feeling pretty emotional right now, because their killer of choice is in danger of losing their "death of a thousand cuts"-identity and turning into a trapless trapper / bellless wraith / chainsaw dude without chainsaw.
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MOM add to the problem
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I agree that Legion needed some changes for sure, but with how the changes read, it doesn't seem like his power will be very useful. Since they will be focusing more on M1 hits, what's the advantage to playing Legion over Billy? Or even Trapper? It sounds like multiple Frenzy hits also won't effect the Deep Wounds meter.
I guess I'm just concerned this is going overboard and will make Legion an M1 Killer and damage the variety in the game. I'm reserving full judgement until the changes go live, but certainly don't think my concerns are illegitimate.
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So I guess that:
- Getting a free first hit
- Applying a crippling debilitation to multiple Survivors in rapid succession
- Requiring Survivors to save their own skin by dealing with said debilitation, effectively taking them off the gens for that period
Are all useless abilities then, huh?
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I love how the intended game play for legion after this change would be
- use power and hit a survivor
- no one nearby because people are splitting up against legion like smart people
- instantly cancel your power because hitting them again with it is literally pointless and bad for you.
Oh I hit you while in my frenzy? Lemme just immediately take a chill pill even though I could hit you again easily.
That sounds like logical and fun game play. Not at all weirdly jarring and immersion breaking.
Post edited by PeepingPeacock on5 -
So, from what I'm gathering from everyone and the update is that, Legion is no longer a Bleed Out Killer, now he is a pinball Killer who can travel fast?
I can see several Survivors at a Gen you hit all 3 and chase one, the other two will either be doing the Gen or Mending and then Mend when you leave. I think the Mend timer should be increased for it lack of viability, it won't go down while you're close or when you Mend so it's no threat, therefore it should take longer to be a nuisance.
Also, until the frames are fixed console, Legion will be unplayable. Missing is EASY as Legion because of jukes and 360s which effect us more than the PC players. Missing a hit now cancels Frenzy and this hurts.
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People are overreacting as always. They complain even though they've never tried the new changes.
Even then, if the changes suck they aren't final. A PTB is coming very soon and a lot of things can still be changed before it hits the public build.
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Yeah, except you know what happens to M1 killers without a power? They are garbage. They become Clown.
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Hey, have you fixed your computer fam? :P
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Clown at least has anti-loop capabilities, Legion no longer has the Bleed-out and his FF doesn't do anything so he has no anti-loop powers anymore. His Iridescent Button will be his best and most coveted add-on, unless they finally fixed the thing where when you jump over a pallet there's no room for the Survivor to jump back over it.
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Legion can still vault in FF, which will likely be it's main application now. The fact you need the power to be full does hurt that a bit, but that aspect of his power is still completely viable and useful.
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The new legion seem s like how I play him anyway.
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My main issue isn't with Legion's changes. it's with the deep wound changes. It's gonna really screw anyone going against borrowed time now, the timer stops when you're in the terror radius so if you're looking for someone who's bleeding out and they happen to be stealthy enough (or a claudette standing in plain sight) they can just wait around until you leave with no penalty. it's kinda BS
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Deep wounds now seem like a totally incidental part of the power: A threat to force healing and stall, rather than the main goal.
Overall, it is a buff. Frenzy forces a free hit, and being injured makes stealth play significantly harder, and looping while injured is pretty dangerous if you are good at being an M1 killer.
This makes Legion more generic, which I think is what is bumming folks out the most. Their power IS a power, it is threatening something because M1 killers become extremely deadly vs injured survivors, but it no longer can down people and folks enjoy 'downer' powers. And that is super legitimate! I hope they consider finagling their addons so that you can try to emulate old legion, sorta like how Iri-Myers can totally swap his playstyle.
They may become much stronger if the alleged mid patch loop changes are significant rather than placebos.
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Deep Wound is a formality mechanic, it's not as threatening as it was before. I would compare it to the Pig's trap now. It's too easy to remove and the only way it will down a survivor now is if the survivor wants to go down.
Legion is now a Wraith without invisibility and an M1 speed burst after using their power.
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This is why I think the time to Mend should be increased slightly, if the power is no longer an actual threat then it needs to be a nuisance and stall them longer.
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Legion is worst than wraith cos as wraith you can use your power and bait the survivors but with legion no just wait 15 + sec for bloodlust to come.
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Well that's why all those smart Legions have been running M&A because they get a smaller terror radius thus causing said Deep Wound timer to countdown. It's the ones running Distressing all the time that're gonna get screwed.
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Formality Mechanic is actually a good term for what it is, but you are implying the concept of a mechanic that will almost never actually trigger its worst event is universally bad. While I think Deep Wounds are going to become so non-threatening that they are essentially only a time speed bump, I do want to point out that the concept of a trivial to avoid punishment that is disproportionately deadly compared to how trivial it is to avoid isn't a bad mechanic inherently.
What it does is allow a player to have a fluid amount of time to address the problem the mechanic presents. The Pig's head traps are a perfect example of this: You WILL have time to get it off... but it is forcing you to (eventually) bother with it in a way that meaningfully affects your player behavior.
I think the issue with deep wounds and the head trap are more that too little actually interacts with them, so they end up purely being player timesinks rather than a temporarily changed game-state: There is no real difference between removing mending now or later, as long as you mend. The point of these 'easily disarmed timebomb' mechanics is to drive some form of player behavior but because the threat is SO non-existent and trivial you don't actually need to change behavior that much. That doesn't mean players need to potentially die to these even if they try to avoid them, but it means these mechanics need more oomph in some way.
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I am not understanding what you are trying to say. M&A Legions run it because of potential sneak attacks and increased TR after Frenzy hitting a Survivor (therefore tracking). How big your TR is doesnt affect whether you are in a chase or not, which is what determined that the Deep Wounds bar dropped. I have never seen any Legions run Distressing.
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I like most of the changes, but with this mindset, all the DCing survivors have been overreacting this whole time.
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@No_Mither_No_Problem gosh they should fix those notifications, not used to getting quoted or not being ignored in a discussion.
Back on topic.
Free hits are a "survivor main" meme because there is nothing stopping you from dodging those frenzy hits like normal attacks. Imagine gretting injured by static field, that'd be a free hit.
Also: deep wounds bleedouts could become rarer than rbt kills. It stops inside the newly enlarged terror radius and while mending it, survivors can simply just get rid of it after juking the killer.... If they didnt conditioned themselves to only loop. Deep wounds also doesnt do anything while its applied, cannot have it's effect accelerated without addons, thus creating immunity to additional frenzy hits unless the devs changed that, which is unlikely. You cant tell me that deep wounds is dangerous if theres no risk of it running out. Its turning into nonactivated rbt you can remove by standing still for a short duration.
Aside from making it slightly easier to get the first hit in, legion simply has nothing over a trapless trapper.
As i mentioned before, i dont own or actually like legion much. Additionally i know the killer community is overreacting whenever a killer is touched. There simply is that fear of gutting all killers into uselessness.
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For the last tine no survivour worth there salt groups together against legion. Its basics to split up and you are gonna chain maybe 2 hits if your lucky and thats usually near 2 or 3 gen mark. Delay tactics dont work if they did doctor and freddy would be tier 1 killers. Note how the most powerful killers all have anti loop tech and are mobile legion has mobility which will help a lot but his lack of anti loop is inexcuably poor game design. Give him collision on pallets and windows so he at least has some basic wraith blocking capabilites.
Say it with me boys and girls delay tactics are utter useless crap a lethal power that helps in the chase and shortcuts a down with instadown potential is the makings of a good killer. Untill a meta shift occurs killers like legion, doctor and freddy will be low tier. If behaviour was to extend the length of the game or add more powerful delay mechanics in regards to gens then maybe we would see the power of these killers.
But by all mean go on challenge my viewpoint with how your legion or doctor is better then hillbilly.
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so basically borrowed time and deep wound have the same basic effect. if you're in a deep wound status by legion, or get hit while you have borrowed time active, you'll have the countdown bar underneath to mend yourself before you bleed out and end up in the dying status. borrowed time used to be if you were hit you'd have a bleed out and need either self care, a med pack with enough charges, or someone else to heal you before you bled out and then you'd have to heal from the injured state to be full health again, but I guess they saw the similarities and made thing easier for survivors once more
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new way too play Legion pretty much - Hit once, use feral frenzy to catch back up, hit again survivor downed and heading too forums too complain legion is still OP and unfun too play against.
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That’s how I played him anyway.
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Just because people say Freddy is the worst killer doesn't mean he can't get kills. Freddy is no where near as time efficient as every killer, and he would be better off without having the dream realm in the first place. He's like Trapper but instead has to wait 7 seconds to get to you.
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I did'nt know Freddy had beartraps...
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