Slight nerf to DS to promote skillful play
In its current form Decisive Strike can punish a killer for playing too well.
It is possible for this scenario to occur and increasingly likely to happen as the game becomes more frenzied during the collapse.
The killer hooks a DS survivor and moves on to the next survivor playing the game without tunneling or camping.
The killer then manages to either locate the DS survivor or that survivor deliberately gets themselves downed within 60 seconds so the killer is then punished for it.
Most of the time if I down a recently rescued survivor and get DS'd I chide myself and move on.
If I move on after hooking a survivor and somehow run into them again within 60 seconds of them being rescued I'm punished for it which is pretty frustrating.
The 60 second timer is too long and I think that even a change to 45-50 seconds would be enough to solve this problem, while a change to 30-40 seconds would be most fair.
DS still remains a strong tool to punish tunneling, but the timer isn't too long to punish an efficient killer.
What are your thoughts on this?
Comments
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I think it is completely fine how it is.
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I don't think DS needs to be changed for a minor edge-case that boils down to little more than a minor annoyance. People are far exaggerating how often this happens and its impact. The argument is mindlessly parroted and the outrage is merely symbolic.
Furthermore, they are mis-characterizing successful plays. A successful play is downing multiple survivors, yes. But a successful play is also intentionally countering a perk. DS is counterable, in multiple, explicitly known ways. Downing other survivors in rapid succession is not one of its counters. If you are hit by DS, it means you did not counter it, and thus should not be rewarded with its deactivation.
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Seems like a fine perk already
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Seconded.
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Minor edge-case? Multiple survivors do this. They use DS as a get out of jail free card and make increasingly risky/stupid plays knowing fully well they basically have immunity for 60s. Also 5s stun is absurd, especially considering it was nerfed due to Enduring, but not changed back to 3-4s after Enduring's nerf.
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Perfect. So now you know they have DS and you can slug them to prevent its activation. You described a situation where they give themselves up to you on a platter and get to be useless until picked up.
Again, it simply annoys you. Something annoying you is not a reason to nerf it.
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Maybe just make DS deactivate if another survivor is hooked within the 60 seconds but only of the survivor is not downed if they are the timer is stopped instead.
Then it's a true anti tunnel perk.
I do think DS should also should not activate when they have BT on them once the egc is active for end game purposes.
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Well said. The complaining about DS will never stop.
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5 seconds is "absurd" but you're cool with 4. Lol ok. Stop exaggerating.
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You probably think survivor is hard and Freddy is op too huh? Do you want video? I can get plenty. DS shouldn't exist. Why should you get rewarded for being found? Why is it ok to make stupid plays and get a free 5s stun? Survivor mains are special. Same people that said MoM was ok and this nerf wasn't needed.
We lose perks all the time, but we don't get to complain. One minor thing happens to survivors. All hell ######### breaks loose and the devs need to be dragged out back. Play both sides. Tell me how much you enjoy getting stunned cuz you happened to be snowballing or playing well. Game is a joke.
Your entire gameplay loop holds your hands the entire time, you got friends to help you, perks to fix any mistakes you make. Downvote me into oblivion cuz someone dares speak against the holy DS.
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Everyone gets to and does complain. DS is fine and should exist.
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What other game rewards you for being saved/making stupid decisions? Also no, we can't complain. When we do we're salty whiny killer mains that just want easy 4ks. Which is super ironic given I see the same 6 or so perks from survivors every patch. DS gets nerfed, they all laugh about getting MoM. MoM gets nerfed suddenly devs are killer sided. It never changes.
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What would you think about a change like this?
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/69865/possible-change-to-decisive-strike#latest
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Why should survivors be most vulnerable right after being immobilized? Why should survivors cease to be able to play a match solely based on another player's actions? Why is it far more profitable for killers to tunnel and camp than to seek out a different player who hasn't made any contact yet?
Why is there the need for perks to modify player behavior (DS, BT, BBQC, MYC, H:DH, PGTW), when it could directly be dealt with through game design?
Ironically, you are the one that is obsessing over sides and asking all the wrong questions.
Instead of blaming the player, you could blame the game.
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Rofl can't believe you turned my two sentence reply into an essay, including a whole bunch of assumptions you're making based on absolutely nothing. Dial it back a bit.
Also plenty of perks on both sides reward not playing well. Like NOED for example.
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The irony of a noed avatar asking for a ds nerf.....
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@SpaceCoconut I agree on a lot of things you say, I'm an active watcher of your yt channel.
However, I don't agree with this one. DS is in a good spot, changes will make it either garbage or brokenly strong as before. It's fair, it's not like you can't counter it. I know people don't like to hear that, but I will say it anyway because I know you are very reasonable person and can deal with criticism like a real man: DS becomes only an issue when your playstyle allows it.
Intentional tunneling -> yeah you deserve to eat DS
Unintentional tunneling (because you are dominating the survivor and are downing them left and right) -> well, you are dominating anyway, it's most likely not going to change the outcome of the match and you will still win.
Don't get me wrong tho, it's not hate or something similar. It's just my experience and I really can't understand why DS is a problem nowadays.
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Bro you literally stole my thread lmao
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Whenever I say something positive about killers I don’t get called a whiny killer main.
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Invuln frames after being unhooked. We'll Make It to heal. Don't unhook inside the TR. Borrowed Time if they're camping. Why is it more profitable to go after the weaker target that I can remove so I can put an ounce of pressure on the game? Are you serious? Did you really just ask why making a 4v1 a 3v1 is a good idea?
Let's take my last game. I spawn in, find someone, start chase. Mark, down, gen pops. Ok, that was pretty fast. Cut to end game, 3 slugs, one gets off with BT, runs to unhook, they get adren and run across the map and leave. How is that fun or skill based? Are you gonna tell me that that survivor deserved that win? Cuz a perk? They didn't play well, they just held m1 ran to safe pallets, and relied on their crutches. There was 0 looping. Not a single person actually tried.
They just ran to a pallet, sat at it, moved to the next one. Then when I caught them they dead harded into the pallet, and repeated it. Why is this fun for survivors? Do you think you're special? Why are perks made to stop behavior, easy, people cried.
They made mistakes, they bitched, they got perks to fix their boo boos. It's what BHVR does. Instead of addressing actual issues, or gamebreaking bugs, they shuffle out a garbage perk and say they fixed it with bandaid soaked in drool. Let's go through your list.
DS: I got unhooked, now I'm immune for 60s. Just slug them right? Well slugging got nerfed, and every survivor cries about slugging so.
BT: Cuz making stupid saves/saves end-game with gates open when of course the killer will camp needed to be made fool-proof. Just needed to buff it what 3 times after it was finally addressed? Oh no, a rank 17 camped me, better add a perk to fix that up. Who cares that people will use it to cheese end-game and extend chases that shouldn't be extended.
BBC: Is for points. That's it. Also you have how many counters to it? If a killer has BBC and doesn't see an aura, why leave? If you're in a locker, they don't know. So yea, they'll stick around.
MYC: encourages killers to give you a chance and get away from the hook cuz they have actual pressure when they do. It's one of the few decent perks we have that encourage healthy gameplay and has a good counter/benefit.
H:DH: Blows before they can usually power it up, and let's face it the devs don't really have many more ideas for perks. Also, rank 17 camping you isn't a cause for alarm for players that don't tunnel or camp.
PGTW: Is a bad perk even after the change. 25% is fine, but you have to find a gen with that much done, have hooked someone, not be in a chase, and hope they don't just hop right back onto it.
My last match was miserable. I didn't tunnel, I didn't camp, and you know what happened? I lost a gen immediately. Then another, then another, then all gens were done, 2 adren'd, and one adren'd off my hook. Wow, I really feel good about completely losing a match cuz I wanted to play fair and care about the other side. That teabags me at the gate, and talks ######### cuz they lived due to a perk. Not skill, a perk that's been an issue for years, but it's ok, cuz, "It's only if all 5 gens pop!!!!" Which let's face it happens pretty often unless survivors screw up.
No offense, but i wanna be rewarded for making a good play. Not lose cuz I didn't want to be an ######### and facecamp the special person teabagging at every pallet pretending it'll somehow win their parents affection if they do.
Also, I play both sides. I've advocated for trash perks to be buffed and I'm happy they address older perks. I know how that side plays. I know it's frustrating to die immediately, but I also get the killer probably isn't gonna wanna let me go after I looped him for 3 gens with minimal effort.
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I'll let you know when that happens to me. I've said I've 100% the game and got called a whiny killer main that just wants easy 4ks for saying the red stun vfx gives people headaches.
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I'm gonna let you in on a secret. I've only told two people about this, so don't tell anyone. Ready?
Do the totems. Run Small Game if you struggle with remembering the tile spawns that are set and don't change. Don't tell anyone though, or I'll get kicked out of the Cool Killer's Club.
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This is like saying "run ruin if you dont like gens being done", or "use pgtw", or "run noed if you cant catch people", or "use a mori if its to haard for you to get kills", or "use thrill of the hunt, so you can know if someones on your totem". You see where i'm going with this? Its not a valid argument
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Except you have 4 people that can do totems. They only take 14s, you have a perk to find them for you. They spawn in the EXACT SAME SPOTS EVERY GAME. Same tile, just learn them. Also, everyone literally makes those arguments? Except your argument is just really bad.
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Wow, you cant have a discussion without saying everyone else but you is wrong?
I didnt say you were wrong... i said i dont think your argument was valid because it can be said both ways.. And no, there are more that 5 totem spawns on every map, so they dont spawn in the same locations every game. But yes we have a perk for it. How about rancor? "ah killer didnt get to kill the obsession?, we'll here you go, you did poorly so here. take a free kill".... can we make valid and actual good argument if were going to argue?
But i actually agree that ds needs a change, if you wanna know what i suggest. Just read here
https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/69865/possible-change-to-decisive-strike#latest
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I don't think you understand who my questions were directed toward. I am not asking you why or how YOU would do something, I am asking why things stay the way they are and why we have to end up complaining about perks that are bandaids to bad design.
You should stop thinking about survivor vs killer and more about how the game manipulates the player.
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In that sense, yes, I can agree. If I misunderstood, that's on me. I just got off work a bit ago and I'm tired, so sorry.
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Ok and I'm gonna let you in on a secret. Pay attention to the time and you'll never be hit by DS again.
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don’t tunnel k bye
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don't die k bye
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Ah yes. Just remember to count down 60s. Good thing there's two blendettes and I'm focused more on playing than remembering each individual action. Just don't go down to a rank 15 killer 4head. You won't need it. Good thing they had that OBS claw around their name so I knew, I-oh wait. They didn't, so I have no clue if they have it and slugging them is super risky.
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Blendette got nerfed.
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Yea, they said that, but I had an invisible Adam earlier. Also, it's not about not seeing them, it's that they look alike. It's the easiest way to track which player is which. Especially if you're trying to avoid killing someone before you hook the others.
As for the other guy. Keep downvoting me cuz your panties are in a bunch.
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Blendette isn’t Adam.
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They nerfed all of the clothing, and read what I said.
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Be reactive to what you're seeing. Sometimes people will run to you like boosted animals, but often if they do something suspect, it's for a reason. You can wait out the timer or use their slug for additional pressure (especially if more are nearby). The perk was remade to help people who get tunneled or found again right away. And even with that, there's counters floor it even with Enduring not affecting or anymore. The timer is fine where it is.
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The timer was only increased, because of Enduring affecting it. Enduring no longer does, so why should the timer stay increased?
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Lol i see killers who think someone has ds and slugs them n moves on for the 60 secs surviours dont bleed out within a minute and as said before dont tunnel lol its made to punish tunneling and that's what it did to you 🤷
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Did you read where people say they didn't tunnel or did you just want to post the same thing everyone already refuted? If I catch you within 30s of you getting off a hook, and I've hooked someone else I didn't tunnel you.
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Same thing as NOED punishing a survivor for skillful play. Actually survivorS
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If you couldn't do 5 totems you're not exactly what I call a skilled player.
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We're talking about the down timer and not the stun one, right?
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Make ds last 2 or 3 mins I dont care, but make it so that if other person get hooked the ds gets disabled.
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Weren't we talking about the timer for the ground and not the stun time?
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That sounds like a troll tbh, most survivor mains are actually reasonable but survivor main is an insult on this forum so they don't speak I actually know survivor mains that won't come on these forums because they know the insults that will be hurled at them for simply choosing to main survivor.
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since we're promoting skillfull gameplay how about nerf one of the 4 most used killer perks; Ruin, noed,nurses calling or bbq, when some of those get nerfed we can talk about nerfing AGAIN Ds or you just want to nerf the survivor side???
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I do feel this perk requires work i gave had games when you get momentum and its just a feast and its not a purposely activated thing its just due to momentum that ds activates.I found hag is a huge victim to this honestly i am not gonna to pop out of a trap and think oh i just hooked this guy 30 seconds ago best give him a while... sorry *walks away slowly* lol
Honesly i feel terrible when i experience ds i dont tunnel and i always try to be fair to the best of my ability. But certin killers will naturally be to fast pace once momentum kicks its impossible to advoid.
Ok the fix needed i will say it sorry survivors i known not all of you are like this but this is the problem right here...
I have had ds users run at me purposely to ds me and that is just the worst to be honest.. im fair as a killer but if you run at me i will smack you but then you ds and teabag then call me a tunnelling bleep bleep come on you ran at me lol this is something i would love a change and i think is needed.
🐷
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With the nerf made to Enduring, 3 seconds stun from DS should be more than enough
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I don't think adjusting the timer is the way to go. It's main issue is that encourages survivors to do a lot of YOLO actions and I think the only way to counter that is to make some "Back in Action" event, which deactivates DS, triggered by stuff like unhooking, gen/totem working for 1 sec e.g.
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Ruin is a joke, even in the community it is known as a joke. You talk about skill but you can't hit a great skillcheck? The thing with skill in the name? Also Ruin can be destroyed immediately. I've got a video where 4 survivors spawned on my totem, Ruin is a meme stop pretending it does anything. If it does, you're not that stellar sorry.
NOED? Do. The. #########. Totems. It's so easy. There is a perk that tells you where they are, they all spawn in the same spots, on the same select tiles. Survivors don't even need perks to do well, so don't pretend like you can't slot in Small Game to learn spawns.
Nurse's Calling...You're actually complaining about Nurse's Calling? Hear TR? Don't heal. NC got nerfed so only killers with a lower TR/M&A will be able to catch you off guard. You even have Distortion if that's too hard for you to stop holding m1.
BBQ? You mean the perk that was already pretty much just used for extra BP, that was given multiple counters that you whiners STILL aren't happy with and don't use? Hide behind a gen, wait 4s and go a different direction, get in the killer's TR, run Distortion, or hide in a locker. You have that many counters, and you don't want killers to tunnel, but no BBC is a problem.
This is why a lot of killer mains don't take survivors seriously. It's not hard to play and you act like EVERYTHING a killer has is somehow insanely op cuz you refuse to adapt or do the simple things the devs gave you to deal with it. DS was bumped to 5s due to Enduring working on it which is hilarious cuz god forbid we actually have a counter for ANYTHING survivors do. Now Enduring doesn't work on it, so it shouldn't be 5s anymore. That's as the devs put it, "A logical change."
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