The status of the Demogorgon
Comments
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I like demo. I think he's pretty viable. Once you know how to use his lunge it makes many strong loops with straight walls like shack and jungle gyms much weaker
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Hey guys, sorry it took my so long to check back in with the thread. I've read all the replies, of which I was surprised there were so many! And heard everyone. I'm not going to try to debate anyone here or change anyone's mind, a lot of the ideas I put into my original analysis were just a combination of my own thoughts from playing Demo, and a little bit of throwing stuff at the walls to see what stuck. I'm glad to see there's a lot of people that agree with me, and I hope Demo gets changed in the future. If anyone has any questions for me I'd love to answer them, or if they do wanna debate me you can add me on steam. See you guys in the fog!
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I found that, now I might just be crazy, but the cooldown for hitting a Pallet with Demo's Shred just feels too long. Billy and Bubba can break them in an instant and get moving, and currently Oni just slaps it and starts moving like the Pallet was never there to begin with. But then Demo's Shred recovery is as long as just breaking it regularly. Why is it that the worse attack option (Shred vs Chainsaw or Oni club) also has the slowest Pallet break along with the least directional control AND doesn't instant-down like the other 3? The Shred lunge distance isn't even comparable to Billy's Sprint speed or Oni's Demon Dash (which mind you, he can use like Billy saw and also attack out of it).
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On PS4 in the UK I see Hags multiple times every night, I’ve played 3 or 4 Demogorgons since he was released, and I’ve played more Survivor than I ever have before since the Archive.
I see Steve and Nancy almost every game they are so popular
I wonder why your experience is so different to the rest of us?
What format do the rest of you guys play on?
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its funny to see the community manager saying that demo is not that rare. he is one of the least played killer. i haven't seen him in weeks and i play almost every day. i see hags now and then they are not that rare. maybe its a region thing or rank thing.
Demo needs a lot of changes as the OP rightfully noticed. But from the comments of Peanuts we can already say this is not gonna happen any time soon
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Demo does not suck whatsoever. His lunge can be hard to know when to use which is why I assume his kill rate is low. Not to mention, I see next to no people actually using his portals which is what makes him an A tier killer. He's a very good killer in the right hands, but isn't the easiest killer in the world and takes practice to really understand fully.
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As someone who loves stealth\ambush killers, his loud sounds when coming out a pirtal ruin him.
Also you cant delete portals and hea SO LOUD TO PLAY AS
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My only big issue with Demo is that there isn't really a significant downside for destroying the portals. I get that survivors become Oblivious, but the portals often get broken once you've teleported away. And Mr. Stompy-stomp isn't sneaking up on anyone. He kind of has mobility with the portals and he kind of has chase power with the Shred, but he's just ok at both.
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This looks like a step in the right direction for Demogorgon, but the add-ons having two effects seems too much to me.
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Yes in the PTB it seemed pretty strong: now it's really not.
Also.....
STOMP STOMP STOMP STOMP STOMP
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@Cetren I have to disagree. I pretty much face at least one Demo every night I play. Also, I disagree survivors dislike playing against strong killers. I like playing against Billy for instance. They dislike playing against killers that have (or are perceived to have) no counter play. And generally annoying killers Legion, Doctor, and Plague to name a few.
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unpopular opinion:
demogorgon is fine.
he is just hard to play and relatively new, so many dont fully understand his power yet / cant play him very good yet.
at least i am doing pretty good when i play him...
i totally agree on the Add Ons though... they are waaay too much focussed on the portals. we need more shred Add Ons, as thats his primary power.
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I see him at least once a gaming session. I'm also on PS4.
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So if the numbers are meaningless, why release them at all? And if we ignore the statistics, then why can’t swf be nerfed? People can just “feel” that swf is broken (as they did for Nurse) so why not just nerf it now?
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Drawing hard conclusions from such broad stats is indeed silly. But this is not what its about. I hope you'll eventually read the whole thing through.
This is about a tendency that peoples playing Demogorgon, have noticed and discussed before on this forum. Why does it feel like he struggle so much when everything in his kit say he should be a top tier killer ? And theses stats, as rough as they are, tend to give a bit of credit to that idea.
I don't think shred is anywhere near as difficult as accurate blinks or hatchet throws. And the discussion has not just been about shred anyway. The portals are a huge part of the conversation too.
Now we could all be wrong and blind to the true potential of the Demogorgon and he actually has a high skill cap and we just need to git gud™. Or... It could be a Clown scenario. A killer wildly acknowledged as having issues and not doing very well in red ranks wich the stats accuratly reflect.
EDIT: typos.
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Should really work on his addons.
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You can't use stats while ignoring the warning right on the page.
"Please keep in mind that numbers are not everything; there are a whole bunch of factors that could influence these numbers."
Numbers aren't everything. They don't rework just based on numbers.
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My today's list:
- 2 Demorgon's
- 2 Huntresses
- 2 Trappers
- 1 Spirit, Bubba, Legion, Billy, Freddy and Pig.
2 Demogorgon's more than usual. I was also quite shocked seeing no Ghostface or only 1 Spirit.
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Yeah I really dislike playing Demogorgon. He just isn't fun.
He has SO MANY different effects and uses, but it feels like the devs were scared to make any one of them GOOD.
He has a chase power that's relatively easy to evade, and it costs a lot of ground to whiff it.
He has mobility, but the time it takes to move around and place them is way too costly, they take almost no time to destroy and it's crippling to him.
He has "tracking," but only if you've already used the portal, and survivors can see them to avoid them. If you're wasting your time running around holding M2 instead of just being in a chase, then you have bigger problems than knowing where people are.
He also has stealth, but it comes with a big honking "I AM STEALTHY NOW" alarm to the whole map.
Anything that feels good about him feels better on another killer.
Like you said, his add ons for the most part suck. Most recent killer add ons SUUUUCK. We know there's old killers with problematic high rarity add ons, but in the last year or so they've just released killer after killer that has ONLY minor stat changing add ons and they play the same every match, it's boring.
It's also similar to Pig, where you have a potential chase ability that you'd like to improve, but there's only 2-3 add ons that do ANYTHING for it and 20 that affect a much worse aspect.
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Ah here we go again, ignoring a good post that could help a mediocre killer.
OP said add your thoughts onto this and such and have this taken around your team and what did you do? focused on that data chart and made everything else the OP said completely irrelevant. Good job, you guys are great devs.
His shred has no learning curves at all nor learning curves when going against it, if someone has turned a corner, that's it, that's the skill right there, wow so skillful I turned a corner. Even when a Demo has you out in the open all you have to do is make a left juke or right juke, nothing skillful there, no learning curves cause everyone can do that, and there is no timing involved with it either.
Demo literally only punishes people lightly if they run in a straight line, that's it.
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Honestly I agree with you! I really think alot of the lower tier Killers need alot of help! Like Clown, Wraith and of course Legion!
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Personally, it's not his shred I have so much of an issue with. It can act as bait. A lot of my hits come with me baiting the shred into a M1. Though, using an ability just as bait does sound funny.
My biggest issue with his power is the portals. They 'can' be a great way to build map pressure. But to get there, you need to transverse the map a few times in order to lay out that network. By then, two gens have popped. Then, he has to let everybody know that network is up and going with that global scream. Third, everybody can see the portals. They're quick to destroy, and it's usually done when a survivor sees you scurrying into one. Lose one, and you lose a section of the map to pressure.
Once you use up your portal allotment, that's it. If you have them in a bad spot, or a spot becomes bad when the gen pops, that's it. You can't destroy them, and that really hurts. I agree that they shouldn't be recycled like Hags, but at least give Demo the ability to destroy them when near or on the portals.
And of course, his addons. Like it has been said, they suck.Rounding back to how loud he is, why wasn't there an ultra rare that muted the global roar? Seems like a no brainer. Yes, he does have a few decent addons, but the majority are just pointless. If anything could use a rework, it's those.
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You have to remember, you CANNOT lower the missed shred fatigue. They already increased it slightly because it was faster to just chain-shred instead of walking, and they specifically don't want that. I like most of what you cover otherwise, though.
I oppose being able to turn in shred and calling it an "increase in his skill cap", shred being locked to a real-life lunge is one of the biggest parts of his skill-based play. I would hate for it to just turn into freddy's regular lunge lol
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As other have said, they really missed the mark with his portals. He was marketed as a "portal-based" killer. "Shred" is mentioned almost as an afterthought in his killer description page and not mentioned at all in his description on his Steam DLC page. Nearly every single one of his addons affect his Portals. Yet they feel cumbersome and underwhelming, and frankly often just a waste of time regardless of the addons you take.
He CAN BE decent in the hands of a good player. The issue is he takes quite a bit of effort for comparatively little reward. The time you spend learning him can be spent playing a better killer who takes less effort / one that is more forgiving / gives stronger consistent results.
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Legion is clearly the worst killer in the game...
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Yeeeeeah about that, Nurse and Huntress are also shown to have some of the worst killrates - and why? Because they take some of the most skill to play very well.
Personally I think Demo is harder to play than people give him credit for, the amount of mindgames on both sides for his Shred is nuts. You REALLY have to know when to use it, when to fake it, and around certain loops you have to make these decisions incredibly fast.
I think he's a good killer that people are bad with.
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Tbf, Surge is his best perk undoubtedly. Saves the time of kicking gens that were effected unless there was a stickler survivor still working on one of them.
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There's honestly bigger issues then gorden. The game needs advertise more and needs a operation health.
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Sure. Out of the 3 Surge is the best. And its a great concept for a perk, I use it on some killer who really can' afford to lose time kicking gens. But its held back by having limited range, very small regression and an overly long cooldown.
The devs appear to be way to cautious with new perk design latelty, especially killer perks. They are dead on arrival because they have way too many constraints attached to them and can never hope to shake the meta.
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as a Demogorgon main "a pretty good one i must say" i simply ask this :
1- an active portal should have a default / base effect of some kind (mangled / exhaustion et..)
2- portal detection radius should be 6 meter instead of (4 as far as i know)
3- traversing speed should be a lot faster . i mean what's THE POINT of a really slow travel speed when survivors already get's a full map warning when you begin traversing? it doesn't make any sense at all .
other than that it's my favorite chapter in the entire game .
i hope any DBD Developer that reads this would consider the small mentioned tweaks .Many Thanks Guys
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I really need to say this here, but if this statistic is correct i take everything back about this game beeing ballanced.
Again, IF this is correct, killer REALLY need to be quiet... about everything incl SWF.
60-80% Killrate on Red rank? This is nuts... i was not expecting that at all.
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Keep in mind its an average. The only thing that range indicates is that on average only slightly more than half of survivors die. The fixed points for kill rate every game is either going to be 0%, 25%, 50%, 75%, or 100%. Getting a 3k every other game is basically all that rumber range indicates.
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Demo is good imo. Just needs better add ons and better frame rate.
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I would say that Demo is fine but...He is too loud. The undetectable status is useless when you can hear his stepfoots from miles away. Also, shred has a ridiculous cooldown. He needs changes but not drastic changes
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I've come to notice that his slash is far too easy to dodge. Easier than any other killer power. Maybe even easier than Oni, lol
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I can't believe he doesn't have an add on to increase the garbage shred speed. It doesn't even instadown so why is it so awfully slow to charge and easy to dodge? Literally just move sideways as soon as he is about to lunge and I swear anytime I would hit someone, they are somehow just outside the reach! lol, he's a joke as is...
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