Why don't the devs collect data on whether Decisive Strike is overperforming?
Just like how they collect data and nerf a killer when they are considered "overperforming", why don't the devs collect data on Decisive Strike to see whether it is overperforming? I would like to see the survival rates of a survivor at red ranks with Decisive Strike compared to one without it. Though, killers have to assume every survivor is running Decisive Strike even if only 1 survivor is using it, which could affect the data.
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do they even do that with perks? like is that how they get nerfed
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I would like to see this because there's no way DS actually lets you survive more.
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this post title doesnt match what you wrote
whats similar between DS overperforming and tunneling without obsession? (i know killers are more likely to tunnel if there is no obsession)
i would like to see that kind of data but im more than confident its impossible to gather so precise data(ok we can find games with no obsession, but how can do show surv was tunneled? (bp? there is a lot of survs that dont do damn thing, or afk or kill themselfs on 1st hook)
but if youre talking about overperforming
aside from abusing DS (locker DS) (because we cant separate that in data)
if you count uses of DS most of the time its vs tunnelers (i know now 100000ppl will tell me i got DSed but i didnt tunneled, its you but there is crap ton of killers that tunnel of the hook ....)
so most of the time usage of DS would tell you how many killers is tunneling but if you want to check survival rate it will increase even if you only count lategame DS when gates are open and you were freshly unhooked
DS helps you escape (maybe not from game but to make chase longer so your teammates have more time to do gens and maybe more of them will escape), noed helps you down, ruin helps you win overall (gatekeeper) meta perks are meta because they have strongest influence on gameplay, im not fan of meta perks but what can i do, only play around those
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O_O
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Have something to say?
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Although I don't think DS is an anti-tunnel perk because so many times in my matches the user with DS active MAKES themselves a high priority target by working on a gen or going for a save and then according to the perk and survivors I tunneled.
If they started to work on their main objective for at least 10 seconds then I haven't tunneled. Anyway without going too much off-topic, this will be hard to track because DS CAN be used as an anti-tunnel perk and it will be hard to tell if the numbers are high due to it being an invincibility perk for 60 second perk or if a lot of killers tunneled that survivor.
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For sure.
I'm just curious as to how you came to the conclusion that a perk that allows an extra health state, plus a 5-second head-start (which ends up being ~15s if the survivor runs in just a straight line) doesn't help with survival rates. Even when the perk doesn't activate (slugging), it still provides an extra health state if someone picks you up afterwards as you're still avoiding the hook.
Doubly so given that "good" players like Otz are now intentionally eating it early in order to avoid dealing with it endgame.
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O_O
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Simple solution to ds is to deactivate it if you hook someone else.
This is detrimental to survivors "FUN" so it will NEVER happen. The dev's nerf to decisive was a buff, let that sink in.
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You assume DS activates, which, in red ranks, it does not. Even if it does clutch out a niche situation or so that won't affect the outcome of the match more than any other A+ tier perk. But we will both see the numbers if they come and see who was right.
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"Even when the perk doesn't activate (slugging), it still provides an extra health state if someone picks you up afterwards as you're still avoiding the hook."
This, in turn, also delays progress on the killer's objective, providing more time/opportunity to survive.
It can also cover bad/risky unhooks.
If you want to advocate that a meta perk is being selected across most high rank games despite it NOT boosting survival rates, I'm all ears.
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I just got D-striked for the first time in months yesterday because I was trying to get archive challenges done. If anything the perk is essentially useless if you dont tunnel anyone.
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*looks at plethora of videos found on this very forum showing people getting DS'ed in non-tunneling scenarios*
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So you're sitting there doing nothing? Welcome to the dbd survivor experience :)
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This thread is just silly
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What are you trying to say?
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It's obvious so I won't say it again.
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It's unfortunate that you feel the need to behave as such in civil conversation, but given the strength of your argument, I can see why you'd feel the need to :(
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Thank you for understanding that you have no hope of stopping my argument. Jokes aside, do you really not see what I'm talking about?
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The healthiest option for decisive is making it be disabled after another survivor is hooked. But the downside to DS is that if the you manage to distract the killer for more than 60 seconds, you wind up not able to use your "anti tunneling" perk.
I think increasing the timer would be healthier, but also disabling it if another survivor is hooked.
I know killers will hate that, but the answer is simple. APPLY MAP PRESSURE ELSEWHERE. If the obsession is trying to get your attention so you can focus them while they have DS, just realize that they aren't doing gens if they are standing there clicking their flashlight.
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I'm not sure how you would prove that. I could be running DS in a match where someone else DCs right off the bat.
I could have been 1 hooked and never had a chance to use it.
Maybe the killer had a Mori or is simply slugging to death.
Maybe I'm a potato who was afk all game or (and this last one fits me VERY well) I was the only one not getting chased and only get hooked at the end of the game where the perk does nothing (last survivor).
I feel it would be difficult because this game has such a large variance as to why player-X survived/died. Its also why I don't like the survive/kill stats we get now, they are far to vague as to perk builds/DC and you don't know if people where just messing around.
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Exactly what I mean
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Regardless of whether it is an anti-tunnel perk or an invincibility perk, if it is overperforming, it should be nerfed. To elaborate, if they hypothetically made a perk that said, "become immune for the rest of the game after being unhooked", it would be an anti-tunnel perk but definitely overperform.
If you pick a survivor with DS up, you get DSed. If you do not, you are forced to slug. It does something in both cases. It does not need to activate to be useful. I should mention if you pick the slugging route, the survivor essentially gets 120 seconds of uninterrupted time because DS would be available the next time they are hooked again. Now if 4 survivors ran DS, that is up to 8 minutes of uninterrupted time in the best case scenario.
For the people saying DS only comes into play if you tunnel, I do not really think so. Otz regularly complains about DS and he is one of the nicest killers that often goes out of his way to avoid tunneling.
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I'm not sure what i said matches what I "quoted". In the situations above you may never have had a chance to use the perk and therefore you cannot determine the power of the perk.
My point is it would be difficult to determine if the perk actually had any effect on the match because it may have never been usable. So it isn't the perk that could be increasing/decreasing your suitability but the circumstances of the match itself.
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What are you blabbering on about? I just agreed with you mate.
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I see your point. The survivor that had DS may never have been hooked and therefore the perk had no impact. Including such a game would probably dillute the data. Maybe only games where the DS ability became available at any point in the game should be included.
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That would dillute the data more. Of course if only include games where the survivor lives through all 5 gens will you see Adrenaline making a big impact. If the data is heavily "diluted" this way maybe the perk isn't over performing at all.
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Can you actually argue your point instead of acting like your opinion is inherently superior? A team with 4 Decisive strikes will survive much more frequently than a team with 0. That's just a fact. If you think DS doesn't have a profound effect on the match, you are either ignoring blatant facts or are out of touch with reality.
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They've been consistently rude to several people in different topics throughout the past hour.
I'm just going to disregard their posts from now on.
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When was I rude? If you can't read that's your problem. If you can read that's even worse because you're ignoring what I'm saying just because you disagree because of your ridiculous bias.
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Who says they arn't?
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If you think me stating that DS is a meta perk because it increases survivability displays some sort of bias, I'm sorry - It's a fact.
Once again, I'm all ears if you can offer up an explanation as to why it's one of the most used perks in the game, particularly at high ranks (where "it doesn't even activate"), if it's not helping the people selecting it stay alive/escape in their actual matches.
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I would if it was. It's not.
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How you wanna collect data? U can't know if someone escaping was because of a perk or can you?
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I would like to see the this data, because DS definitly highers my survival rate.
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I'm sure you play survivor all the time too. That ought to raise them numbers
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This adds nothing to the conversation :-/
Since you've said DS isn't widely used/used a lot, how often do you see people equip DS in the games you play?
I'm genuinely curious.
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Less than half the time. Solos must not be very smart if what you're saying is true.
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I don't recall mentioning solos at all, but feel free to continue to disparage them :(
I usually see at least 2 DS per game.
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Assuming things about others. Just like myself, when i'm in a bad mood.
Same.
Same bro.
Same.
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Yeah I'm pretty tired but that doesn't prevent me from seeing you play a lot of survivor.
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You say the Ds team will survive more. But we don't have any proof of that. I'm not saying you aren't probably right. But to claim it to be a fact is a stretch.
I've thought about ways to change Ds so it is closer to being a pure anti tunnel perk. I think maybe a shorter timer that pauses while in chase might be better.
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Don't let it get you down <3
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It blows my mind that they even thought of making the timer 2 minutes, initially :P
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Wait they did? Jesus.
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If perks were considered overperforming ruin and BBQ and chili would have probably been Nerfed a million years ago
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The Locker Aura reading change was basically a BBQ nerf - Not directly, but it's one of the most commonly affected perks.
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While I understand your point, I don't think the data you're looking at would be accurate when looking at a survivor's survival rate when based on a single perk and possibly not taking any other data points under consideration.
Player skill, killer, map, teammates, other perk choices are all things that will impact survival rate.
When looking at a single perk that doesn't stack with others, I think it's important to consider how well it's doing it's job.
If we say that DS is an anti-tunneling perk then we can easily see that it's overperforming by impacting higher skilled killers more than lower skilled ones.
The common example is a survivor with DS being rescued and within the time limit the killer is able to down and hook a different survivor and then find, down, and hook the first survivor and still get hit with DS.
The killer didn't tunnel, but was punished for being a good killer while the survivor didn't "earn" the free escape.
I believe the time limit should be shortened by 10 seconds or that it should be disabled when another survivor is hooked.
If DS isn't meant to be an anti-tunnel perk then it should have a downside associated with it. Being the obsession isn't inherently dangerous.
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Ds needs to stay, without it tunnelling will become even more problematic
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Basically this. This is also the reason why I believe that DS is needed as it is. I tried to use up BP Offerings from two characters who did not have DS. And I got tunneled for several games in a row, because after I did not have any DS at the first Unhook, they knew that I will most likely not have DS at all and tunneled me after the second Unhook.
And usually, when I am able to use my DS, the Killer deserved it. I am not that guy who runs to the Killer, just to get an DS Stun. Yesterday I got an escape because of DS, but the Killer would have been fine with just leaving me slugged. I would not have made it to an Exit Gate in 1 minute, but they directly picked me up. (Not blaming the Killer for going after me again, Exit Gates were open, no reason to let me go. But he could have waited that 60 seconds and he would have had the Kill)
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