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Why not buff Small Game instead of nerfing Ruin?
I'm not a very active forum user and have only been playing dbd since it came out on the Switch, but why is Small Game never brought up in discussions about Ruin? If hitting those skill checks is so hard for new players, why why not use a perk that seems almost like a counter to Ruin and run Small Game, a general Survivor perk so even the newest of new players will have it?
Once Ruin became regular on the Switch version I just started using Small Game and even well placed hex totems became a breeze to find. Then I could go back to gens and get lots of practice hitting skill checks. So if new survivors are having such a hard time, then make Small Game have an even easier time finding the totems. Will still actually pull the survivors off the gens even for a little bit. Red rank survivors won't run the perk cause there are better perks and they will already know how to look for the totems anyway.
This all seems unnecessary, if a hex perk is causing you problems as a new or old survivor, then you have the option of searching for it and remove it from play and there is an easy perk to get that makes doing so really easy, so why all the kerfuffle?
And if the legions (not Legion :P) of Doctor killers (HA!) are making the game so hard so survivors, run Calm Spirit? I know its a pretty bad perk, but the wording in the developer update made it seem like the screaming was making it hard for players. So run a perk that makes that ability null and void? Doctors are among the rarest killers I see on the Switch version so I don't run the perk and relish the challenge of dealing with a different killer.
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If Small Game was more accessible, I could see this working out a bit. However on the 3 survivors I have at max level (PS4) I didn’t see Small Game until I refreshed the bloodweb at least 10 times past the level cap. Its extremely difficult to find for me and haven’t seen it pop up on any of my other survivors.
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I have it on 11 of the 13 survivors that I've lvl'd up to lvl 40, some even have it at tier 3. Have you been looking for it until this point? I assume most people gloss over it for other perks
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Don't worry, I bet they'll buff small game AND nerf ruin :) BHVR are good at multitasking
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But why is it never brought up? It made finding the totem as a total new player easy enough, it can't be just me so why don't more new survivors use it?
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Because survivors want to afk on gens. They don't want to make any effort at all. The most vocal complainers about NOED are the same people who refuse to run small game or detective's hunch or a map to find totems because it breaks their gen repair immersion. It's ######### stupid.
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I always run Small Game because Ruin is incredibly difficult on console and no one else is willing to run it or even do totems when they see them. It's way underrated, especially with all the Trappers lately because of the Tome. Not to mention Hag, and Freddy's pallets and snares. It just comes down to people being selfish or lazy and not wanting to run it. It doesn't need a buff at all, it's fine as it is if people choose to run it. I cant tell you how many games I've only had time to do four totems and we still get smacked with NOED because me other three teammates couldn't do one. It's still usually fine because I know where I've been and where the totem will be if I haven't cleansed it, but please, survivors, cleanse just ONE totem. Makes a world of difference.
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I'm not a fan of the Ruin change, but your argument isn't very good. First of all, small game works fine the way it is. The only thing I would change is to put an indicator if the totem is above or below you. But that is a minor thing. Secondly, it doesn't actually fix the problem as the devs have phrased it. Every player shouldn't have to run a specific perk to balance the game in case someone else is running a specific perk. That's bad game design.
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It's as accessible as any other perk. You could also use maps or Detective's Hunch.
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I agree that it works fine as is, but if a change is to be made because new survivors find it hard to deal with then I'd rather small game get something rather then the change we are getting to Ruin.
I gotta disagree on your second point though. Perks change the game and alter how people can play it. Having a counter strategy is a part of any competition. If all hockey players had the same role and play style the game would be boring to watch. But that's why we have different roles, skills, players, etc, to shake things up and force the other team to adapt.
If there is a clear and easy way to counter a play style that a lot of killers run (ruin) then run Small Game, make the Ruin strategy useless and killers will find something else to counter and the game will evolve.
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Gen times were a problem, Ruin is brought out to fix it, everyone has to run ruin, ruin is a problem, small game needs to be used to fix it...
You see the problem was the gen times, ruin was the band-aid. Small game was effectively a band aid for ruin.
Nobody WANTS ruin in the game (except red rank survivors - it sisn't a problem to them). Killers hated feeling like they were forced to use it. Non-red rank survivors hated playing against it too. Trying to hit greats is unsatisfying, searching for Ruin is wasting time (and boring). If so many people despise a single perk, it needs addressing.
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*Sad Detective's Hunch noises*
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As a Survivor player, I’d rather Small game & Stake Out get buffed instead of nerfing ruin.
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Honestly, if they just reverted the change to Small Game, it’d be great. If you don’t know/remember, it used to highlight the aura within a small radius rather than ping it’s direction. I way prefer the original imo.
It’s not entirely gen times. I play Identity V, and Gen times for the first 3 minutes are 80 seconds, afterwards 60 seconds. The difference is:
A: map size. Other than one of their newer maps, they’re all relatively easy to traverse and get from gen to gen.
B: low TTK. Killers are very capable of killing quickly, along with dealing with pallets. Due to this, if you want to stall the killer as a Survivor, skill expression is now massively important.
C: low Rocket timers. Rocket Chairs (hooks) kill their victims 30 seconds faster, which adds more stress into the Survivor team.
D: Survivor Weaknesses. Each Survivor has a built in weakness that makes them suck at something. Some are simply that Rocket chairs tick down faster, others repair slower, some can’t fast vault.
Identity V doesn’t have either form of Ruin, yet they don’t need it.
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Except you can only speak for yourself when you say hitting great skill checks isn't satisfying or searching for totems is boring.
I am perfectly content searching out totems, I'll take that 1000 blood points for each totem please and thank you. And I do find hitting great skill checks satisfying. So those points vary per person but don't really have any bearing on the situation at hand.
And given what you brought up, people despise the perk because of its necessity to have decent matches. That means the core gameplay needs to be addressed, not the perk.
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- True but I don't believe I am on my own on this, and I suspect you agree with me that searching for Ruin is a waste of time.
- The core gameplay still needs to be addressed, no question. But a single perk considered to be mandatory even though it is a DLC should not be the answer. If the core mechanics are about to be fixed, old Ruin would break it. I am very optimistic something is going to follow.
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I think I was editing my post while you wrote this last one.
But no I don't think searching for totems is a waste of time. If there is a chance of NOED or a crafty killer with devour hope, I'm happy to go out searching. Doing gens is fun, but if there are more options, I like to take in as much as i can.
I wouldn't say you are on your own for your opinion, but I would need some proof that its shared by a majority of the playerbase. 🤷♂️ I could be wrong, no doubt, but neither of us can truly know without a massive poll with a lot of participants.
I agree that a single perk shouldn't be the answer, but it's the best answer we have at the moment. Not ideal, butnit is what it is.
If the gameplay changes and this new Ruin fits in nicely then that's great. But for the time being, it's an overkill nerf without making any changes to the gameplay.
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Survs have perk which counter all hex / not hex totemes. (literally NOED can useless because all totem is cleansed). But survivors prefer to run all meta perks like BT, DS, Adrenaline and etc.
Devs not care, nerf and make game even more easier for survs, because it's hard for newbies.
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Personally, I think running small game will take up one perfectly good slot for perks that give value in killer/survivor detection or stay alive, like bond, spine chill, aderaline burst, self care, and more
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Survivors don't like to run anything else but the extra life perks.
The same thing happened with spies from the shadows, killers were running it and survivors complained that crows kept giving them away, they got told to run calm spirit but refused so bhvr nerfed sfts and made crows ignore a crouching survivor baseline.
Survivors always get what they want, and i am waiting for the mom buff that will undoubtedly come, just like decisive strike got a buff disguised as a neft.
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If I see a perk, I generally gun for it or make a note that I’ve seen it, should I choose a very rare or higher item, since passing up on a perk in the bloodweb usually results in it not appearing for 6 or more levels. I’ve been meaning to do a Small Game build for a while and had the toughest luck finding it. Same goes for Hope, with the Tome challenge. Hope was very difficult to find. Perhaps I’m just unlucky.
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@Godzilla +1, but unfortunately this game evolves by adapting to the players yelling loudest. As it is a confirmed strategy, there is no adaption by using perks, it is just yelling and waiting, until it get's nerfed.
I also think Small Game should be the choice for new survivors. It helps you pretty much getting map awareness. Learning killer trap placement, learning totem spots. Actually that would be exactly the spot that Small Game was made for. What else if not for new players?
Btw everyone forgets about gen tapping. If you really dislike totem search (which is laziness) and missing great skillchecks (which is training) so much, tap gens. I also dislike the reasoning "because it is frustrating" to justify several of the recent changes. Punishment is a key concept of DbD. You make a mistake, you get punished for it. Bad timing on loops? Get hit. Don't hit the skillcheck, regression and location revealed. Missing Hex skillcheck? Regression. Same on killer side. Get 360d? Short stun and probably much longer chase. Bad timing on window hits? Survivor reaches new obstacle. Bad handling with your killer power? No use of it and probably extra stun.
Quote about a "key issue" why it is frustrating to play against Ruin: "Its punishment of new players or those who can't hit Great Skill Checks". For me it is frustrating when I miss ANY skillcheck, not just ruin. Can we please have a 5% progression every 10 seconds on all interactions without the need of skillchecks? Seriously... And what the heck is less frustrating on higher difficulty skillchecks of the doctor compared to Ruin? With the doctor's reverse skillchecks coming in the same patch as the Hex changes. BHVR talking about consistency lately, but this view is not consistently spread over all their topics
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It doesn't even need a buff more people just need to stop complaining and learn to compromise by either running small game or learning how to hit ruin skill checks. I run that perk and just go around cleansing every totem I find out of paranoia the killer has noed or devour.
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Then that's the players choice, that's why we only have 4 perks slots. Being able to do everything would make the fane easy and boring.
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Yeah I'd have to agree that that you must be unlucky, or maybe I'm really lucky and no one else gets the perk in their web and that's why it's never brought up in discussions, no one knows the oerk exists :p
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I totally agree with you. It's just that if I had to choose between buffing it or beefing RUIN, I'd rather have the buff
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I totally agree with you. It's just that if I had to choose between buffing it or beefing RUIN, I'd rather have the buff
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I hear ya man, I agree with your statements.
I would likentonhear the dev's thoughts on this specific topic.
Small Game makes finding the totems easy for new players, they are learning more about the maps and all that, its helpful to the other survivors, they get blood points so they do get rewarded for cleansing.
New players won't have access to all the other second life perks and all that so it can't be taking a slot away from too many useful perks for them.
Maybe the dev's have talked about it before but I'm not a very active forum user and have only been playing since it came out on the Switch. Would be nice to know their thoughts. I doubt any of them will see this thread, I know they are busy.
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Small game is a good perk just too many overlooking it. I'm still gonna use it regardless of the odd ruin nerfs because devour, noed, trapper traps and hag traps also just because I enjoy cleansing totems.
I don't think many like to take chances on the lesser known perks.
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Needs more survivor maining streamers/youtubers to talk about :p problem is they are expert players and never need to worry about being able to find the totem or can just power through Ruin.
I wonder if the dev's have ever pushed Small Game when discussion about Ruin come up. I know they have lots of other things to do and they did put the perk in the game. I would assume that would be easier then reworking and testing a new version of the perk, but I don't have the background k knowledge to really know
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Think about it. If they did that survivors would have to replace one of their over used perks like ds or unbreakable and that does not coincide with the mission here.
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Except in the developer update they said new players were having the issue so they won't have all those perks. Maybe one or two but not a full 4 perk slots worth.
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