More Killers should use Dying Light to counter bad obsessions
I've come to the conclusion recently, that Dying Light is one of the most OP killer perks, because if you get it to proc before 2 gens are done, you basically win the game. If you get someone without DS and find them quickly enough, it's like a guaranteed win. If you get someone with DS either A> they will be a really bad obsession and still get caught after the DS, or B> they will be a really good obsession and not get caught as much and not waste DS. Most players are either non-obsessions or fall into the A category, so you will win most games. The only games you have a chance to lose are games with players from B. From my experience as both killer and survivor, there are very few B players out there.
I sometimes run Ruin/Dying Light with Black Box and mori on Freddy, which is really overpowered to every group of survivors I've had (even at rank 1) except this 1 group I had recently. Their obsession was really good and ran from me all game. There team was really good because they swapped items with him at the start (he had FL in lobby but medkit when I chased him, he was in DW and I saw him put something down and pick something up), he used an inta-heal, and had a FL save, I ate through his DS and his Adren. Got a hook with gates powered and someone save, I kept tunneling because I could mori him. Everyone got out but the obsession, who made 1 REALLY huge mistake I capitalized on and I got him. I safety pipped for that, and it was a really REALLY hard game, one of the hardest I ever had. GG. But I wasn't mad about it because my build is designed to tunnel and this guy and his team was able to beat it. I feel like that's an acceptable outcome, considering that he's that 1/100 survivors that can counter my build and strategy. Literally everyone else has died to this build, once I get obsession I don't even need to try (and if the obsession doesn't DS me and dies I will let someone hatch if they get 2 gens).
With this perk, as killer, you can have control over most games you play just by applying pressure to the obsession. When you do, gens get done, so don't pressure them unless you know the others are occupied with anything but gens. If you tunnel them out the gate, like I found out, they will know it's Dying Light and will rush gens as much as possible. You don't want them to do that, so maybe don't play like you have DL, play like you have STBFL and ignore the obsession. If it's a true obsession with DS, they will pester you and when they give you a shot, you take it. But if it's the first hit act like your angry they took your STBFL tokens, they will take another hit if they aren't near a hook, so just chase the other guy and wait for them to be near a hook (thats 2 not on gens BTW), then turn around and smack them. I have NEVER seen a killer do stuff like this because killers don't understand that when survivors know the build, they will optimize what they do. If they don't know your build, they won't optimize because they don't want to make the mistake of not knowing your build because it gets them killed. That dude in my game spawned in DW. I never realized until that point that it can be a huge give away to these players. But if I see that guy again maybe I'll run STBFL. He will be SUPER scared of me because he doesn't want me to catch him, but I'm not trying to catch him. I'm just trying to make him think I'll chase him so he runs around and doesn't do gens.
Killers, you guys need to think outside the box man. BBQ/Ruin combo is old. People say "it works" when it kinda doesn't. If the team spawns on your ruin, what happens? You lose. It doesn't work, not 100% of the time. No build always works, including BBQ/Ruin builds. Survivors see that stuff and just go "eh this again". Try a Lullaby maybe. Sure if they get it it's gone, but the difference between Ruin and Lullaby is that Ruin will make them look for totems right away, while Lullaby won't make them look for totems until you have a few hooks. Sure they will get gens, but when you start getting hooks you pressure them to find your totem. And if they spawn on it, so what, that could have been your Ruin too keep that in mind.
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Usually what happens with DL is either.
A: i bring a mori (of the which is dont have many), Or it triggers way too late or never. Il try it when i can though. Maybe its better than ruin.
At least you are trying to help killers win.
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You will need to use it with a Ruin if you have a really good obsession. Blood Warden is a good backup in case they get the gens done, as long as you caught your obsession by then and burned through DS/Adren, you can slug them until you can proc BW. If they are smart they won't open the doors, but if you can catch someone the tries to revive the obsession then you can hook 1 and slug 1, now it will be hard to save.
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Yeah, that might work vs rank 18 survivors. But Dying Light is useless on high ranks. By the time you killed the obsession, 4 gens are done. DS users on high ranks usually know how to loop.
Also the slowdown is to small. Even IF you manage to kill the obsession early.
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No thanks. I don't like that perk. I don't think survivors like it either.
But as Tsulan said, it's not very good verse competent survivors. They'll just get the gens done.
Sure, if the survivors are meatballs, then it can be impactful. Otherwise, it's just an obnoxious perk.
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@Tsulan said:
Yeah, that might work vs rank 18 survivors. But Dying Light is useless on high ranks. By the time you killed the obsession, 4 gens are done. DS users on high ranks usually know how to loop.Also the slowdown is to small. Even IF you manage to kill the obsession early.
If you combo it with Ruin you can get your obsession before gens are done. I think it comes down to how hard you tunnel. If you chase them REALLY hard and never relent then the others just rush gens. If you chase them until you get a hit at least, then break the chase if it goes on too long and go for someone else you can do it, baits the obsession to move away from loops. As long as Ruin doesn't go down instantly, you have time to catch the obsession. You want to proc DL at something like 2 gens anyway, because now even if they split the map you can still win. If they don't, it's pretty much GG for them. Your goal shouldn't be to catch the guy at 5 gens, because it gives it away you have DL.
And adding 26 seconds to a get or 6 seconds to a heal is not small. You force them to team up on gens, so now they are easier to find because they will all be together. As long as you kick gens, and watch any that are like >50% for a little bit until they go down, you can keep the game going as long as you like.
@Mister_Holdout said:
No thanks. I don't like that perk. I don't think survivors like it either.They don't, and that's why they gen rush if they think it's coming. It's why I say you should play like you have another obsession perk, maybe STBFL or none at all. If you have an opportunity to catch the obsession you take it and don't let anyone save (or maybe use something like MYC, let them save, then tunnel the obsession, MYC won't try to body block for him and will probably run away and hide for a bit).
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@thesuicidefox said:
@Tsulan said:
Yeah, that might work vs rank 18 survivors. But Dying Light is useless on high ranks. By the time you killed the obsession, 4 gens are done. DS users on high ranks usually know how to loop.Also the slowdown is to small. Even IF you manage to kill the obsession early.
If you combo it with Ruin you can get your obsession before gens are done. I think it comes down to how hard you tunnel. If you chase them REALLY hard and never relent then the others just rush gens. If you chase them until you get a hit at least, then break the chase if it goes on too long and go for someone else you can do it, baits the obsession to move away from loops. As long as Ruin doesn't go down instantly, you have time to catch the obsession. You want to proc DL at something like 2 gens anyway, because now even if they split the map you can still win. If they don't, it's pretty much GG for them. Your goal shouldn't be to catch the guy at 5 gens, because it gives it away you have DL.
And adding 26 seconds to a get or 6 seconds to a heal is not small. You force them to team up on gens, so now they are easier to find because they will all be together. As long as you kick gens, and watch any that are like >50% for a little bit until they go down, you can keep the game going as long as you like.
So YOU would recommend to tunnel? Interesting...
On a more serious note, that perk needs a complete removal. It singlehanded promotes the 2 things survivors hate the most: tunneling and camping.
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@Tsulan said:
So YOU would recommend to tunnel? Interesting...On a more serious note, that perk needs a complete removal. It singlehanded promotes the 2 things survivors hate the most: tunneling and camping.
It's acceptable if you are running DL/RM (which I've stated many times before BTW). You have a completely legit reason for it because it's one of your perks. If you do it all the time, whether you have these perks or not, or whether you are winning or not, then it's just toxic behavior.
While I agree with you about survivors hating it, it is the obsession. If it's a really good obsession they won't get caught and they will all escape. But, it's the only perk in the game you can really use to punish a bad obsession. I usually play that if I catch the obsession and they don't DS me, then I won't camp them and let the team save, but I will still tunnel them if I NEED to. That's the thing with this perk and camping/tunneling. If you are winning, you have reason to not camp/tunnel because you aren't pressured to lock the game at that point. It's only once the game gets to a certain point, when like 2 gens are left, that you want to really make sure the guy is dead. Obviously you want to catch him once either before Ruin goes down or before 2 gens get done. But if you catch him before that point you can choose to let the game play out and chase other survivors (which you want to to anyway, because if you just camp the guy right away they others will rush gens). As long as you bring a mori and get that first obsession's hook quickly, you shouldn't force survivors to rush the game.
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@thesuicidefox said:
@Tsulan said:
So YOU would recommend to tunnel? Interesting...On a more serious note, that perk needs a complete removal. It singlehanded promotes the 2 things survivors hate the most: tunneling and camping.
It's acceptable if you are running DL/RM (which I've stated many times before BTW). You have a completely legit reason for it because it's one of your perks. If you do it all the time, whether you have these perks or not, or whether you are winning or not, then it's just toxic behavior.
While I agree with you about survivors hating it, it is the obsession. If it's a really good obsession they won't get caught and they will all escape. But, it's the only perk in the game you can really use to punish a bad obsession. I usually play that if I catch the obsession and they don't DS me, then I won't camp them and let the team save, but I will still tunnel them if I NEED to. That's the thing with this perk and camping/tunneling. If you are winning, you have reason to not camp/tunnel because you aren't pressured to lock the game at that point. It's only once the game gets to a certain point, when like 2 gens are left, that you want to really make sure the guy is dead. Obviously you want to catch him once either before Ruin goes down or before 2 gens get done. But if you catch him before that point you can choose to let the game play out and chase other survivors (which you want to to anyway, because if you just camp the guy right away they others will rush gens). As long as you bring a mori and get that first obsession's hook quickly, you shouldn't force survivors to rush the game.
I understand your logic. But this perk (and the corresponding play style) will only net you toxic comments. Doesn´t matter if you only tunnel and camp the obsession. Yes, it can get the job done, IF you have a bad obsession. But most good loopers equip DS anyway. So they know how to keep you busy.
So it´s either a easy match, where you can use DL to its full extend and the survivors will report you for it (not a problem on PC, but on Xbox). Or you get a hard match and the perk won´t do anything.I would recommend this only to experienced killers which know the consequences. Never recommend this to a new player. Since it could result in really toxic responses.
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I tried it with Freddy.
It's not that bad if you can get it to activate early, but with how DS currently is, I feel inclined to not run it.
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@Tsulan said:
I understand your logic. But this perk (and the corresponding play style) will only net you toxic comments. Doesn´t matter if you only tunnel and camp the obsession. Yes, it can get the job done, IF you have a bad obsession. But most good loopers equip DS anyway. So they know how to keep you busy.
So it´s either a easy match, where you can use DL to its full extend and the survivors will report you for it (not a problem on PC, but on Xbox). Or you get a hard match and the perk won´t do anything._ I would recommend this only to experienced killers which know the consequences. Never recommend this to a new player. Since it could result in really toxic responses._
Yes, I am saying this to good killers. Bad killers won't be able to punish bad obsessions. Good killers can, and good killers are also the only ones that know how to catch obsessions. Like, that guy ran from me ALL GAME, his team did my Ruin and all the gens right as I hooked him once. He made a mistake running for the door, I took advantage and still caught him for the mori. Everyone else got out, I got a safety (because I killed the obsession) and that is totally cool with me. The guy was a good obsession, his team deserves to get out.
Like I use this perk and if I end up killing the guy fast I will actually stop playing, open the menus and send him a "GG, sorry it had to be you, better luck next time
". Yea it totally sucks to be that guy right now, and I sympathize but that's how the perk works. I send him a message and most of the time people are cool with it, some people are mad but then I just point out that's how DL works, again sorry, and they are cool with it. Maybe 5% would be so mad they can't stand me, but I'm willing to bet those players would be mad if I killed them in any fashion.As long as the killer isn't a dick to the obsession about what he did to him then people won't be toxic about it. Like, it's his job to run away from me as long as possible if I run DL, and if you do that bravo. Killers get mad at obsessions for looping but don't realize this is what that guy is there to do. If you don't have an obsession perk, this guy will just pester you all game and do stuff to make you chase him. Is it frustrating to deal with? Yes. Well put on DL and see how good this guy really is at running. Put on PWYF, break a few chases with him, and you can easily catch him at a loop. Make him drop pallets even, you could still catch up to him. This is what good killers should be doing. But good killers should also understand that DL is a ######### perk to survivors that aren't obsessions, so they should at the very least play nice when they can afford it and be a good sport with obsessions they kill and proc DL.
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I don't like that perk at all, I hate the playstyle it promotes.
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The only problem with this is people who run obsession perks usually try harder. Dying light is nice if you get lucky with a bad obsession, but there are better perks that are much more efficient. The time it takes to tunnel down an obsession is better spent on controlling all your survivors
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@Hillbilly420 said:
The problem with Obsession perks is that you need to find the Obsession early in the game. It's a weird situation where if you don't run an Obsession perk then you'll probably find the DS user super early in the match. And when you don't run the Obsession perk you just can't find them.Save the Best for Last is easily the best Obsession perk precisely because you don't need to find the Obsession.
Yes, it's called RNG. Killers need to accept this as a fact of life. Your Ruin could go down at the start of a game, or it could last all game. Depends if the survivors find it.
It's a risk, but a good killer should be able to find and catch bad obsessions. Put on BBQ and just start going after hooks until you find them.
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If you're looking to slow progress, thanatophobia has relatively more uptime, doesn't require tunneling, and is more efficient than dying light if you really crunch the numbers. The chances of dying light performing better than thanatophobia is an rng crap shoot that heavily favors thanatophobia.
there are better perks than either of these perks though1 -
@davidps4DBD said:
If you're looking to slow progress, thanatophobia has relatively more uptime, doesn't require tunneling, and is more efficient than dying light if you really crunch the numbers. The chances of dying light performing better than thanatophobia is an rng crap shoot that heavily favors thanatophobia.there are better perks than either of these perks though
I agree. TP with Sloppy Butcher is quite reliable. But survivors have counters to this too, like Resil and toolboxes. It also relies on you hitting people often, and when they see TP most people will try extra hard to heal.
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I can't, my standard-equipped Save The Best For Last would intefere greatly.
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Sadly the perk doesn't help as much as you might think. Very few cases has it managed to stall the game for me.
Especially if the survivors are aware what is going on (for sure when they are a SWF), Mori into Dying Light can be spotted pretty quickly. Then all they have to do is play smart.
Had matches where it is very hard to find the obsession, and when I do, he's got 3 body guards :chuffed:
But that's at higher levels, maybe it works at lower ranks, wouldn't really know.
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@Swiftblade131 said:
Sadly the perk doesn't help as much as you might think. Very few cases has it managed to stall the game for me.You need it to proc before 2 gens are done to get the most use of it, but when you get it at that point or sooner you can almost always win the game with a 4k.
@Hillbilly420 said:
It only really works on Freddy if you use the Black Box add-on AND have an Ivory Mori. But even then half the time the Obsession will either be close enough to another Survivor to instantly be woken up or they're close enough to a gen and just touch it and escape. I had that happen once. Start of the match I see the Obsession, I'm roughly the distance of a quarter of the map away, the guy touches a gen for about one second and he escapes.No, don't use Black Box at high ranks. If you have a good obsession they will immediately know your build. I just got a 4k with Ruin, DL, PWYF, and BW with Class Photo/Z Block and a pink mori. Use CP to find my obsession then got her before 2 gens were done and they did a third +Ruin as I mori'ed her, and then the game just stopped. I wouldn't chase until I got everyone asleep so I just keep walking around the gens and sleeping people (which shows where everyone else is) until I killed one. Rinse, repeat for last 2 until I slugged one, her friend got the heal I came back and got them both.
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