Strongholds going to waste ...

drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773

During the beta, I've really enjoyed the game and it was reflected into the survey.

However, the next day I noticed that a stronghold that took 3 hours to build had disappeared in less than 24 hours. Before that point I had no idea putting some effort building was such a waste of time. (I had build a labyrinth with 4000 units)

I understand the basic reason behind this. That being said, if its stays that way, I have absolutely no interest in building another stronghold.

Building strongholds being by far my biggest motivation to buy the game ... well, you see where I'm going with this.

I hope some satisfactory solution is found.


  • clownkrieger
    clownkrieger Member Posts: 121
    edited February 23

    There was the option to "refill" (and level) outposts if certain conditions are given, but the game didnt really tell you and showed you where (it was pretty hidden in the UI as well). So you can keep an outpost active for around minimum 10 days total if you manage and can afford to level it 10 times.

  • drsoontm
    drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773

    It wasn't too obvious indeed.

    But the way I see it, 10 days, with efforts, is still a limitation.

    A way to "copy" it, make it a template, something so the work doesn't go to waste ... would be great.

    I'm sure I'm not the only one that doesn't like this and there were others propositions.

  • clownkrieger
    clownkrieger Member Posts: 121

    Yea there was a big discussion on steam forums and even here some iirc, you are not alone with that for sure :)

    I personally am ok with those limitations and see their point, but i will play this game mainly to build and want to build a lot anyways, so yea...

  • drsoontm
    drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773

    I'm in several of the Steam ones (under a different name). I suspect this is the best place to speak about it though. ^_^

  • Hodderfodder
    Hodderfodder Member Posts: 163

    You can set it as a Social base. There raiders can keep raiding it, but they won't get resources for it. You won't get resources either. On the plus side it will never expire, and raiders can search specifically for your base.

    Anyhow I do agree that 22 hours is a bit low for the expiration. I'd prefer something like 3 days.

  • Brainware
    Brainware Member Posts: 8

    I think there needs to be some incentive for players to do social raiding even if it doesn't benefit the builder anymore. A better way to search for bases might help, for example "Cretive bases", "Hardcore bases", "Ingenious", etc.

    Maybe just offer players to do random social bases as well.

    Obviously I think there should be a way to just clone your expired base as a new one. Maybe we could have indefinite amount of tiers above 10 but without giving us more building points for things not to go out of hand.

    Otherwise I don't see a reason why anyone would not just build the exact copy of their old, good performing, base to farm more staff.

    One limitation I see is every starter base is randomly generated and same design might not be possible in the same exact manner. But I think we should be able to copy some parts of the design and have option to reuse them.

  • Entchenklein
    Entchenklein Member Posts: 35

    Its kinda frustrating if you have 10 days and then suddenly your base is useless to you

    Especially since it will be only 1 day on the highest prestiege mode

    As it is right now i basically copy paste my base once it runs out and i dont waste much time on base design a few tweaks here and there but not really finetune my base

    I would realy love to do finetuning on my base but as it is now it is kinda wasted time

  • Viktoriusiii
    Viktoriusiii Member Posts: 36

    Why SHOULD social raiding not give you anything?

    Maybe only 10% of competative... but as I stated before: I have no intention to buy the game as it is right now...

    Social raiding with creative bases might at least be one way for me to enjoy the game.

  • Platinum_Cloud
    Platinum_Cloud Member Posts: 2

    Yeah I remember being confused by the same thing. I spent hours making a base as I love making artistic looking designs but I was really disappointed to see that my base was deactivated the next time I logged in. And apparently after prestiging 10 times your base is basically retired at that point which I found to be highly disappointing.

    I understand that they might want to limit how many bases can be played at once and to keep old unattended bases out of the queue but maybe take away the 10 time limit and have bases decay after a longer period of time? This system feels a little harsh for active players. Maybe a system where bases decay after certain number of raiders have attempted which would ensure a fair judgment for a bases deadliness?

  • drsoontm
    drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773

    Whatever they do, we'll know in a week if the game is worth a builder's time.

  • Kharel
    Kharel Alpha Surveyor Posts: 21

    Worth noting, there's some inaccurate math and/or assumptions in here. A large-pool (4800 genmat, extraction rate is 150/hr) base will stay active for about 2 weeks and will last 32 hours at each prestige level, unless you set it to overdrive or prestige early.

    Small genmat-pool plots will last just over a week; the plot selection method from the open beta leaves it up to you whether you want to hit prestige 10 faster or have the base live longer.

    I'd argue that while building the perfect base is fun, you can do that in social just fine. The regular "active" mode is designed to test everyone, raiders and builders alike. If one of those two gets to perfect their creations at will for an indefinite length of time (copying it, indefinitely extending the "live" duration, replicating it block-for-block on a new plot with a button press, etc) and the other doesn't get to practice beating that creation without any risk of losing rank, there's a severe capabilities mismatch.

  • Matoshiro
    Matoshiro Member Posts: 4

    I think the expiration time for Outpost is pretty fine. You want people to go through it once, not twice.

    Moreover, nothing stops you from "trying" the same setup/traps, etc, on another plot of land. You may get some "bedrock" at a place you didn't have before. And the genmat/forsaken tombs being at another position too. But the "style" and trap setup you did, can always be replicated.

    The expiration is long enough, so that you can keep modifying it for a max of 2 weeks, but short enough so that you still need to make a new one time by time.

    Also, the Outpost/builder don't get much from doing so. You're way better spamming brutal raids to unlock stuff fast. So the "why can't I keep the same base for a month to make mats" isn't optimal.

    Now, having a "trap setup" or a possibility to copy/paste some traps/guard setup and store them in a slot for new outpost. That'd be dope :)

  • Matoshiro
    Matoshiro Member Posts: 4

    Forgot to add, that there's is some plot of land with 6 000 genmat activity. So if 150=1hour, and you can prestige 10 times. That's around 18 days of Outpost being out. And around 40 hours 'til you need to refill it with a prestige.

  • drsoontm
    drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773

    During the demo, my 4000 crafted maze got less than 24 hours of shelf life. So either there is another factor, either there are bugs.

  • drsoontm
    drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773
    edited March 30

    The problem is that when you spend hours making a nice place, you don't want to redo it sandcastle-style. (Well : I don't)

  • Entchenklein
    Entchenklein Member Posts: 35

    The thing is the first outposts i made were pritty unique they had something special about them but once i realized the outpost only lives about a week or so asuming you even get to prestige them i just slapped a few killboxes together and turned on overdrive way more efficient then actually thinking about fun and challenging setups

  • drsoontm
    drsoontm Member Posts: 3,773

    Yep, I've just done a test map (level "2", ~3000) and it will be there for 12 hours unless I prestige it.

    Utter waste of time.

  • CotePathos
    CotePathos Member Posts: 31

    Sadly it's kind of necessary to keep the pool of bases flowing. Right now there are so many bases compared to the amount of Raiders that most of my bases are barely being raided.

    Creative appearance is always valuable, since more people will click your base. Community tab and base sharing is the "endgame" so to speak since it doesn't grant progression.

  • hastarkis
    hastarkis Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 580
    edited April 6

    One of my bases got 27 raids, another one - 700+. Both in normal category. I don't think it's "bases vs raiders" question. More like matchmaking and luck. And it's more likely they are afraid of raiders to not have enough bases to raid, lol.

    Like, there is limitation for active outposts. It's five per player, players can't keep more than 5 active, and all those players supposed to raid because they can't progress purely with building. And all of them pretty can raid more than five outposts per day (on average). Your bases won't suffer from lack of raiders if your thumbnails are interesting enough. It's mathematically impossible as long as your base lives long enough. Like if there is a bag with hundred balls and one person takes one ball out every 3 seconds, then the person will get your ball guaranteed after 5 minutes max (you can't raid same map twice so the map won't be offered again, at least until prestiged). But what if every 20 seconds the bag is refilled with new balls? And every time the person has 100 fresh balls to choose randomly?

    Shorter base life -> more new bases every day -> less chances to get your bases offered (and chosen) to raid. Longer base life -> less options for raides over time -> more chances your map will be raided.

    During alpha and beta (despite pretty low number of players and pretty low number of raids per base) most people still were able to prestige their bases. Some of them wasn't, yes, but was it lack of players that affected it? Idk. And I had time to raid freely with no pressure of necessity. My outposts lasted slightly longer than now and I had free time to raid for progress and unlocks, and I had enough leftover resources after that to pay for prestiges. I kept 5 outposts with no problems.

    Now I have problems with 3. Despite 700 attempts and 1400 kills on one, 27 attempts and 120 kills on another, and 235 attempts and 470 kills on third. 200 deaths base cannot pay for itself, I barely get 300 synth while I need 900 to prestige it, and I don't have enough time to earn synth for all bases AND progress myself.

    Now I'm just questioning myself whether building worth it at all. They could limit bases to 3 instead of 5 but make them longer if that's the problem. Or make outposts pay for themselves to make maintaining them profitable. 200 deaths per prestige isn't enough how is it possible?.. Maybe it is a bug (although I know about resources bug and restart the game every time I want to collect them). So as for now it's just a sink for resources. That's it.

  • Seraphor
    Seraphor Member Posts: 8,128
    edited April 7

    Well I've just discovered that outposts delete themselves when they expire and now I'm thinking what's the point in this game?

    If your creative efforts are wasted there's no reason to build anything other than a mindless killbox, which means all outposts will eventually end up being mindless killboxes.

    At least 'retire' an outposts so that the 'active' status is simply unavailable, and include 'social' outposts in a pool for random raiding even if you don't gain anything from deaths on it.

  • hastarkis
    hastarkis Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 580

    Wdym they delete themselves?.. Or do you mean depleted status?

  • chezpizza
    chezpizza Member Posts: 120

    I'm starting to get to that point of needing to constantly prestige and I threw one of my bases to social raid cause even though it gives me no progress I don't want it just sitting there.

    Read that once a base hits level 10, it can't be prestige, which prevents reactivation for progress. So that's got me concerned. I can still put it in social raiding but gain no progress. Speak of, is there a way to explore social raids without needing a creators/bases name?

  • hastarkis
    hastarkis Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 580

    Same here with prestiging :/ and yes, p10 bases get 💫mastered💫 label and then just sit there with no usage.

    As for social - asaik there's no way. But you can join mym discord (not official), people share their social outposts there. Not great but still an option.