Losing Rank points discourages challenging yourself

TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,608
edited April 11 in Feedback

Points earned towards Rank should only be negative when someone leaves an Outpost without completing it. You don't want to discourage people from attempting higher difficulty maps, but that's what the current system does. Persistence should be rewarded. As is, if you fail a few times, you might as well just cut your losses and leave without completing the Outpost. You're also better off sticking to maps that are quicker and easier to complete rather than attempting a map that may take multiple attempts.

You also might want to consider not taking away rank points if a player dies in a base 10 times (maybe more, maybe less, what seems like a reasonable amount of expected persistence?) and then gives up. The person who designed the base got kills and the player attempting the base tried. Rewarding zero rank points is fine, but taking away rank points is unnecessary when the player made a real attempt at it.

(I know Rank doesn't necessarily matter, but it goes toward getting a reward at the end of the season, right? So it's a tool of encouragement. It should reward players for playing, and part of playing a game is challenging yourself rather than sticking to easy mode.)

Edit: Crossed out large sections because I changed my mind. Players shouldn't lose rank points at all. Rank is for showing time played. Rank is for rewarding cosmetics at the end of the season. Increase a player's rank quicker with better runs, sure, but don't subtract from it.

Post edited by TragicSolitude on


  • Darkyan
    Darkyan Member Posts: 122
    edited April 9

    Points shouldnt be removed at all.

    I actually think season ranks should be attached to how much you play the game, and how much experience you get in your outposts rather than just completion

    There are outposts in this game that are basically impossible unless you carry 2 shield, a phoenix revive a deflect sword the barrier weapon and a 40% speed boost.

    Punishing players for not buying every single weapons in the game is counter productive

    There are some garbage outpost out there, and I don't like the idea of needing to die 48 times just so I don't lose 30 points six times in a row from bad matchmaking RNG

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,608

    Your rank can go backwards?! What the hell, BHVR?! I got to Silver 1, decided to try out a Brutal Outpost, did horrible, and went back to Bronze 4 for my efforts.

    Don't reward cosmetics for rank and then take players' progress away from them. That's a crappy thing to do. You shouldn't take points away at all. Time played can't go backwards. When I try to complete an outpost and it takes more than a few tries, that's persistence, that's a good thing; it benefited the builder with more deaths so why are you going to punish the raider when they're doing something you should want to encourage?

    As long as players are working their way towards earning a reward, they shouldn't be punished with negative progress. The ranking isn't competitive, at least not before Master.

  • Entchenklein
    Entchenklein Member Posts: 35

    personally i feel like it should depend on the map for example when the map has 10 kills per raid attempt you die 9 times so you are better then average meaning you gain points you die 11 times you are worse then average aka you lose points

    also maps that have a higher kill count per raid attempt should give more resources aswell so its worth it to spend 20 tries 30 tries in that map

  • chezpizza
    chezpizza Member Posts: 120

    You only lose about 30 points of ranking even if you die 100 times.

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,608

    Outposts can hurt your Rank, too. No one was running my Brutal Outpost, and my Dangerous and Normal Outposts were getting a lot of players who were looking for easier levels to farm. I'd be Raiding and complete an Outpost on the first try and see negative Rank points because the Outposts were doing poorly. Between hardly getting any Raiders and the ones I did get hurting my Rank, I've disabled my Outposts for the foreseeable future.

    MYM's reward system has got Builders trying to create unfun death traps and Raiders trying to avoid dying. Its at odds with itself. BHVR created a level designer with a huge grind that they also want to be nastily competitive and it's hurting the game. I'm not saying Builders shouldn't try to kill Raiders, I'm just saying that the reward system shouldn't be based around it. Players should be able to build what they want and die an infinite amount of times, and as long as they're playing the game they should be making progress towards the seasonal cosmetics.

  • HangryMogwai
    HangryMogwai Member Posts: 36

    Noticing this too. That first week I was exclusively playing Brutal outposts and my own Brutal outposts were out performing my Dangerous/Normal ones as people wanted the challenge, but since rewards for rank was mentioned, everyone (myself included) seems to be sticking to Dangerous. It’s far more rewarding to run bases you can do in 1-5 min and have a solid chance to make it without dying versus playing outposts with 4500-6500 capacity kill boxes or endless mazes. At this rate, I should have master raider tomorrow and I hope to start running some Brutal again as they were more fun/challenging.

  • encrypt128bit
    encrypt128bit Unconfirmed, Member Posts: 2

    While I agree someone who keeps attempting a brutal outpost shouldn't be punished or only punished if they are worse than the average, I have to disagree on some of these comments. What people what differs from person to person. I for one, like a challenging outpost using unique methods to challenge raiders. Even 'kill boxes' are beatable with the right equipment and if you don't have the right equipment, come back later to attempt when you do. I've found even the most brutal outposts are not impossible and I rather enjoy finding the work around to complete them. The game is fun all around IMO and challenge the raiders to think outside the box in some cases.

  • hastarkis
    hastarkis Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 580
    edited April 17

    Great point. I was super exited during closed test and was investing hours into hard bases to finally beat and complete them. It was fun. It was profitable for everyone.

    Even though I don't care about place in rank table I do care about rewards in the end of season, plus it is just lame to be punished for completing a super hard outpost just because it took 50+ attempts for me :/ Now I don't feel challenged after couple unfortunate deaths, I feel frustration because I know even more are coming and I definitely will loose points here. And I try the base with that though in mind. Then I finally beat the base and get negative points for that. Whyyyyy

    It's nice to raid social outposts freely, I miss that feeling in normal game.