Strange replays

Seraphor Member Posts: 8,139

Anyone else watch some of the replays of raids on their outposts, and wonder if the raider is just an NPC?

Maybe some people find this fun, but I see so many plays just follow the HRV, like right behind him, in single file, inching forward a bit at a time.

Then there's the replays of my "non linear" outposts. In which my HRV takes a long meandering path through several 'encounters', but the raider has the ability to bypass any and all of these except the final one if they choose to explore, and in fact such bypasses can become obvious once you progress a little further. The intention behind this is that the 'first time' through any particular part will likely follow the HRV path, but once you overcome each 'encounter' and pass it, you 'unlock' the layout of the outpost and can skip that part the next time, making it more encouraging when you die and respawn so you don't end up quitting out of impatience. Obviously raiders can choose to play this how they want, but if they ditch the HRV they could get lost or end up going backwards so it doesn't generally save much time unless they get super lucky. I've seen some people try to carve their own route through it and end up going round in circles.

The thing is, I've just watched two replays of two of these outposts, where the raider has almost completed the route, died, and then retraced the entire route all over again, and again, and again, when they could have skipped straight to the genmat. They didn't go after traps or guards, they essentially sped-run the whole thing, but via the longest possible route. Like they were fixed to the HRV path themselves.


  • MythicMikeneto
    MythicMikeneto Member Posts: 69

    After being lost in an numerous outposts, I stick the the HRV path pretty strongly.

    What you have going against you is other builders who do the same HRV path long/Non HRV path short, but the make the short path super deadly or really easy to get lost in.

    I once had to wait 10 blanking minutes for the HRV because I tried the 'shortcut' and got so turned around and lost I couldnt find my way in or out. It took longer to try the shortcut and then having to wait for the HRV than just following the HRV in the first place.

    Another time, I knew the short path was trapped to hell and back, but I thought I would give it a try thinking, 'Surely they made that route completable somehow.' After 6 repeateded (entertaining) deaths, it was back to the long HRV path to actually be able to complete the level.

    Again, took longer to take the 'shortcut' than to just follow the HRV in the first place.

    Once raiders experience and learn this, your 'shortcut' is seen as the 'long way' (even if it is in fact shorter) and the HRV is the best way to save time and lives.

    From your description of you build it sounds like dying multiple times may actually make the shortcut longer than the HRV path.

    Think of it like this:

    HRV path is 50 long. Shortcut is 25 long.

    Taking the short cut I die 5 times at increasing lengths.

    5 die, 10 die, 15 die (0 rank gain for me at this point), 20 die, 25 die, 25 and get gen mat and head back for the return 25.

    That total distance I covered was 100 taking the 'short cut', twice as long as the twice as long HRV path.

    Now the raider thinks to themselves, if I had followed HRV, I maybe could have avoided those deaths, possibly saved time, and actually gained rank.

    Raider conclusion: long HRV is better than any shortcut.

    Its not always true, but it is usually a safer bet.

    Condolences, my fellow builder.

  • Seraphor
    Seraphor Member Posts: 8,139
    edited May 15

    The outpost in question is now a Social one. Lakota by TheSeraphor, if you want to see what I mean.

    The player made it all the way through the path to the genmat, upon dying in the genmat room, proceeded to following the HRV all over again, multiple times.

    It's not a real maze, once you know where the genmat is, you can literally see it from the starting point.

  • MadMoeZel
    MadMoeZel Member Posts: 685

    i find most people have lacking awareness.

  • MythicMikeneto
    MythicMikeneto Member Posts: 69

    Gave it a go. It was a good time.

    NGL after death three I was ready to just follow HRV for as long as it took. I think it illustrated my example of how if I just followed Harvey I could have saved myself some time and deaths.

    I restarted the level after 'escaping" with the gen mat to give it a go knowing where it was.

    I am not exactly sure what your complaint is at this point. It seems like you are ipset the guy didnt bypass parts of your outpost because his spatial awarenss was not great enough to track which way was the shorcut.

    Until I followed Harvey, I felt like I was reading a book out of order. Thay bieng, said my exploration helped me get my bearings enoigh to know where to go. Had I tunnel vision followed harvey, I would have likely had to continue to follow him on subsequent runs.

    The TL:DR your outpost is a bit 'big brain' for some of the masses; I mean that as a compliment.

    So I recommend not getting too upset when Mr. IQ less than yours comes through and has to hold Harveys hand yo make it through.

    Thanks for the social raid. Very impressive outpost. Ingenious (for big brain base) and brutal (for my deaths), if I could give them.

    Full marks if the game allowed.

  • MadMoeZel
    MadMoeZel Member Posts: 685

    "So I recommend not getting too upset when Mr. IQ less than yours comes through and has to hold Harveys hand yo make it through."

    the number of people that get mad or block/report a builder who kills harvey tells me this is more common that you'd think.

  • Seraphor
    Seraphor Member Posts: 8,139
    edited May 16

    Not upset, perplexed.

    I expect raiders to follow the path at least once, maybe a couple times to get their bearings. But not religiously after multiple deaths when they clearly already know where the genmat is.

    Technically it's in my favour because it increases their chance of getting killed.

    If I got upset every time a raider played in a way I didn't intend I'd be popping antidepressants like tictacs by now. (Hell, half of the replays on that outpost raiders hop to another path and run the whole thing backwards, negating half of the traps) I just couldn't understand this particular behaviour.

  • TragicSolitude
    TragicSolitude Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 6,608
    edited May 16

    I got curious and tried it myself. Very nifty, I enjoyed it. Because I've read this thread, I didn't play it the way I normally might where I go around scouting first, I just started on the path. And if I for some reason thought I might die, I'd look around and try to remember which building I was at. As someone with terrible spatial awareness who gets lost easily, if I didn't stop and try to make a specific mental note of where I was, I wouldn't have a clue where to go if I had to restart.

    I will say it's a bit surprising that after a player dies once they don't start taking stock of which building they're about to enter. Maybe it's tunnel vision, or maybe they're playing the map the way they think it's meant to be played. While scouting around some maps, I've gone in through the exit to discover I just skipped the one-way map, and so I nodded and killed myself and did it again the proper way.

    But really I'm willing to bet many Raiders just forget to make a mental note of where they are.

    Edit: Or they're worried that at some point they'll need the HRV to show them where to go next, and without him it'll be an actual maze where they'll lose time backtracking to figure out the correct path.

    Post edited by TragicSolitude on