Devs, You Hit The Mark With This... Almost...
- "Third, the Abandon Outpost feature. If you start an Outpost that you don’t like the look of – you have the option to leave it. We've heard the feedback that this is detrimental to your Ranking, and we will be changing this to no longer subtract Ranking points for abandoning an Outpost – this change is planned within the next couple weeks." ~ Developer Post (STEAM)
I do think the ability to leave an outpost is a good idea, however with the way the ranking system is, this is horrible. Allow me to elaborate.
Leaving an outpost use to punish people by taking away a lot of rank, so you cant just die a bunch of times and leave without consequences. However it was a risk/reward type of system since you could lose less rank through leaving than completing if the base was really hard.
But with the way the ranking system is, you get punished heavily for trying to learn a base and beat it, and Brutal Bases, which have a higher DPR (death per raid) ratio on average are going to statistically be ran less since people do not want to be punished by the ranking system. Brutal Bases statistically get raided less because of this.
Now this change specifically is going to cause Brutal Bases to be raided more but people are simply just going to leave the outpost after dying a few times since there are no consequences for it. Furthermore, it's important to note that this does impact the matchmaking for the bases as well, and can lead to difficult bases (yet again) not being pushed out to players.
I think the only way the fix the ranking system is just to remove the ability to derank but have the process of gaining rank be much slower to compensate. It will provide more incentive to play more difficult maps and encourage basemaking at high ranks (which people often avoid since you derank often with it).
I think the end result of my suggestion will bring a lot more freedom to the players, since people wont feel punished for playing a certain way or trying to build a certain way, it creates an environment where all, or most, restrictions are off.
Comments
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Or... and hear me out...
They could just remove ranks.
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I think the ranking system is a good concept when done right.
The idea is rewarding people for playing the game, it gives them a reason to log on and play matches.
There is a bit of FOMO to it unfortunately, but it's all completely free and leads to cosmetic rewards (that have no impact on gameplay).
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Right now, the system is punishing people for playing the game. Like literally.
I get negative points if i die on a raid AND i get negative points if i keep my bases online and the don´t get enough kills per raid attempt. Thats not motivating me to play at all.
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That was the main point of my original post. The changes they are making to leaving outposts is overall negative (for builders and) for the game since the systems surrounding it are also poorly designed.
The rank system overall needs an overhaul, it causes far more issues than anything else.
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Thats why it should be completely removed. A rank system might be good for a pvp game. But this is a pve game.
The people that struggle to rank up are not motivated and the streamers that rushed to master rank are also not motivated to keep playing.
Since the devs haven´t announced any rank rewards, there wouldn´t be lost anything if they just removed ranks. If i remember correctly, beta hat no ranks and people were more motivated to play and die.
As its now the whole concept of "raid, die, learn from your mistakes and beat the base" totally gets thrown out of the window, because people just don´t want to lose rank points. Removing negative points, might help. But while we´re at it, why just not remove it completely? As its no measurable reflection of skill.
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^ This.
Rank wasn't in the closed beta, it was added after the game was basically completed. The game was not designed around rank. My guess is someone thought it would increase player retention and didn't understand how it conflicts with the game's premise.
Bronze through Gold isn't even a competitive ranking system, it's a battlepass. It's rank in name only, but I think calling it "rank" at all is bad because the term has certain expectations and baggage carried with it. I'd rather the game call it something like "Devotion." The point of it is to encourage people to play during the season. Reward a set amount of points per difficulty level just for stealing the GenMat and let that be the end of it. Dying shouldn't matter. Reward Builders for kills and extracting GenMat from their bases. No more point loss at all.
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Hey, i might be wrong but, from the way this is phrased, "after starting, If you don't like how an outpost looks you can leave without losing ranks"
This means, to me, "I can leave at 0 death without rank loss because I saw someone block off a tomb" not "I can leave after 20 deaths with no consequences"
I think this update is meant to not punish you for leaving if you notice clear and obvious things you don't like, example, Harvey died and it's a 4 floor mazes with no traps.
No deaths, no punishment.
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they call it rank cause thats what they call it in DBD. and once you hit masters, you are RANKED against other masters.
the game may only have you interacting with ai controlled elements but it most definately IS player VS player. a player built the outpost and a player is attacking the outpost. the player set all positions and patrols, the player set every block. if you trying to beat that isn't a competition of minds, i'm not sure what it. i may not be able to immediately react to your raid but i can then respond to your actions after i see the replay and fight back. there is the same ebb and flow as any direct contact pvp game, the contact is just a degree removed.
i disagree with the notion that for it to be PVP it requires both people to be active at the same time. a mail correspondence game of chess is pvp even though both players are taking actions after a period of time has passed and seeing the opponents play and having time to think.
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What you describe is called PvE.
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they call it rank cause thats what they call it in DBD.
DbD has "Grades," which are used for the end-of-the-season Bloodpoint reward and nothing else. The matchmaking rank is hidden from the players.
Unless you mean that "Devotion" is a term used in DbD, but I was only using that as an example of a more appropriate word for amassing points towards set goals for rewards while serving the Chimera (without just calling it a battlepass). Something along the lines of "loyalty."
once you hit masters, you are RANKED against other masters.
In Masters, but not before then. And I look at my rank number and it means absolutely nothing. I know it's technically some combination of my raiding performance and the kill rate of my Outposts, but the number doesn't give me an actual idea of where I stand in raiding, nor does it give me an idea of where I stand in building. Even though I may suck at building or raiding, I guess I'm the 175th best Custodian in general. 175 out of what, though? 175 out of 3000 is good. 175 out of 175 is bad. Or hell, Gold IV is actually a higher rank than Gold I, so maybe 175 out of 175 is the best and 1 out of 175 is the worst.
Rank doesn't influence which bases pop up in my list, nor does it influence who raids my own bases. As a Raider, I'm going up against other people's Outposts. It'd make sense for Outposts to have a leaderboard, except the leaderboard would become obsolete each time a base is changed.
a mail correspondence game of chess is pvp even though both players are taking actions after a period of time has passed and seeing the opponents play and having time to think.
The two chess players are still interacting. The amount of time that passes doesn't come into the equation.
Going against someone's Outpost is more like taking a quiz: the teacher wrote the questions beforehand, then the students give their answers, and afterward they're graded and the teacher can alter the quiz to better suit the next group of students who takes it. Except, this isn't a series of questions on a piece of paper, it's a gauntlet or obstacle course (so, maybe a physical fitness test).
the game may only have you interacting with ai controlled elements but it most definately IS player VS player. a player built the outpost and a player is attacking the outpost.
Games referred to as PvE have levels that were designed by people. The people designing the levels in MYM just happen to be players. PvP means the opponent you're going up against is controlled by a player.
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Honestly, I also think that abandoning an outpost shouldn't count as a kill for the raider. It essentially rewards the builder for making an unfun outpost that people want to leave.
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