Nemesis LEGION will be nerfed, WHY? .. The perk of NEMESIS has COUNTERPLAY & FULL REWORK LEGION
It's so easy that is dropped the pallet before not to do stun.
GG WP devs.. all must be nerfed -.-
NOTE: GUYS I WOULD TO KNOW UR OPINION ABOUT THIS, GOO
Comments
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Theres no problem with nemesis legion its bop and if theyre really thinking about removing that with the nerfs he just got losing dark devotion and stbfl im not even gonna play legion anymore because itll just be impossible.
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I think Nemesis by itself is not a problem, but rather Nemesis + BoP + Stab wounds/frank's m. combo. Literally a low-iq bloodlust chase crutch.
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Yeah so fix bop instead of dragging nemesis down with it . Nemesis legion by himself isnt bad because you can pre pallet or test it by throwing down 1 pallet and if he doesnt have the perk you just play the normal way. They already nerfed him and removed his dark devotion sloppy and stbfl synergy so nerfing him more will just basically make him useless there will be nothing for him to do against a good team pre nerf with the current perks on live he cant do anything really.
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Yes, BoP is a noob chase perk, it doesn't need stealth, maybe giving it a stronger BL movement speed in exchange of longer BL charge time would be better.
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Like nemesis legion could be like a neich killer that you may see every once in a while. Because theres other killers that have their own ways to deal with you so he might not be that common. I think they should fix bop then bring nemisis legion to live and see how things go and if its horrible then fix it from there.
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So the problem is that BHVR has to tiptoe around any and EVERY perk they make in the future with Oblivious and Undetectable because if they do it wrong then Legion becomes becomes a god again.
Deep Wounds is connected to the TR so anything that changes that changes Legion, if 1 Killer can exploit something then maybe the Killer should just be changed so they don't have to worry about it anymore.
Nemesis on Legion is counterable, 100% it will catch Survivors off guard once and then maybe not again in that match but the point remains that it can still happen and they have to be very careful with what they add in the future and to be honest that might deny us some powerful perks because they have dumb certain things down.
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HEY!!
Don't YOU tell me how to play survivor, i tell YOU how to play killer. I mean did you even read the rule book????
I will play the exact same way against every killer and anything that makes me change my gameplay is OP
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They're probably going to change DW so that it no longer goes down in chase either or within a certain radius of the killer. The perk won't be completely useless on Legion but it just won't have any unwanted effects.
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You mean the one effect that makes it worth it so itll be a wasted perk like every other perk that you can put on legion...
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If you call that counterplays then slugging people with ds is also counterplay.
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I do slug people with ds and wait for it to run out or if im doctor i have unnerving presense to make sure they fail the skillcheck.
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So you want Legion nerfed again..
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Apparently because not like he wasnt the weakest killer already and now he lost dark devotion sloppy and stbfl and now he cant even have nemesis. Poor legions become the mercy of dbd.
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Which means yet again another bt buff making it ignore game rules
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I don't really think the devs ever intended for stealth killers/perks to just ignore the entire point of a different perk that is controlled by the killer's actions.
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Only it isnt..and it's not stealth killers..its undetectable..this would require survivors to ignore game mechanics just because of legion..the dw isnt worth it..either they need to remove it from legion and fix the issue forever, or they bend the rules for survivors which is unacceptable
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Legion? No
Perks? Yes
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THe obsession change by itself can be broken in so many ways that needs to be balanced that the Oblivous effect is just an overkill for just a pallet stun/flashlight blind/Head on stun that happens all the time and it is needed to play the game normally. I understand people want something to change for Legion but this is not the answer ..
And as somene else mentioned the Oblivious effect is really problematic and devs have to be really careful. They can't just put it on random perks like that because it creates a lot of problems. Giving it to one killer is one thing. Giving it to all the killers is another story that I don't really like
Post edited by Haku on0 -
If anything i want them to fix these 2 but revert the other stuff because at least legion was a niche pick before with the perks that kinda worked but required a good bit of setup but if they fix these 2 and push the nerfs they ran legion over with a semi and drove away. (Revert meaning keeping him the same he is on live).
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They just might as well keep him the way he is on live at least now hes niche. If all this goes through and those 2 are fixed legion lost all his decent perk synergies so i dont see the reason to play him tbh.
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Might as well keep him the way he is on live at least hes niche if they push the nerfs through and fix those perks he just lost his synergies on live that made him a niche killer so no reason to play him.
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Also, BL + Haddonfield isn't a problem, all you have to do is burning other maps offerings. Billy main = big brain
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I’ve played basically nothing but legion since they came out. I’ve accepted that no matter what the problem is, the answer is Nerf Legion.
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It better not mean extra nerf...I hope that they revert the changes to FF/DW, including the removal of M1 effects from FF or give some actual compensation, because with the new (old) speed they'll still struggle since now they can't as reliably slow things down...or build up pressure by gaining stacks of STBFL and getting in some hits without having the stun, for example.
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Besides, why would you drop a pallet on a frenzied legion? It's a shorter stun than the 4 seconds and it now gives them a timer.
The survivor in that case make a massive mistake and they should be punished for it.
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Then the Legion will just moonwalk.
By the way I'm not advocating for Nemesis or deep wounds to be nerfed because of this interaction I'm literally part of the people who are saying just dropped the pallet early.
However it wouldn't be too hard for a Legion who gets blinded or stun to literally just moonwalk if it's a choice that will make the timer go down.
Beast of prey needs to change that's an outright fact and and I'd also say stab wounds study and Franks mixtape need to change because in general they're bad add-ons.
If an add-on is only good whilst you're cheesing it then it's not a good add on period
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No it is bloody not needed all the time.
As I've stated in previous posts you have to go out of your way to blind or head on a killer you could simply just not do it.
Contrary to popular belief you don't need to bring a flashlight into a game and for the most part unless you have a plan on or you're trying to do a coordinated save wasting time staying in a locker just for a head on stun isn't beneficial to anybody.
Also it is not impossible to just drop the pallet early.
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I tried the build with Nemesis Dark Devotion and BoP. Not One Single Surv falls on the floor. The timer doesnt go down in a chase i was running behind someone but nothing happened. Maybe you should try it in a real Match and see it's not so op it sounds. You will get the second hit earlier before they go down.
Or did I do something wrong?
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If anything i want them to fix these 2 and keep him the way he is on live hes a niche pick who can maybe get value with dark devotion by smacking a survivor then going to another and hoping they bleed out in the 30 seconds before dark devotion runs out.
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As usually. Nerf already dead killer who had a sip of air by Nemesis which have (!)counterplay. And Nemesis useful only for Legion. If it will be nerfed this perk become useless.
What next? Remove Legion from game? xD
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So people who stun the killer with a pallet deserve to be one hit downed by a power that's meant to be for information gathering? Feels a bit silly to me. Deep Wounds should be based on distance from the killer, not terror radius, or being in a chase. This would prevent all kinds of exploitative scenarios with Deep Wounds. I don't think they should have removed Dark Devotion from Legion. Sloppy Butcher might have been a little strong, who knows, I don't know what the data looks like, but healing is pretty much pointless with a Sloppy Butcher/Thanataphobia Legion, and Thanataphobia + Sloppy Butcher is kind of overkill on healing anyways imo. I would have been fine with Legion keeping it though. I don't think Legion needed any of these changes, and I definitely don't think their power should down someone just by getting pallet stunned. In all scenarios it feels like Legion is wasting their potential by doing this.
That said, how do people use this? Do they just not go in Frenzy until AFTER being stunned by a pallet, then use Frenzy to get their down?
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when MoM was op i used legion because it didnt activate it while in deep wounds.
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The perks are pretty irrelevant. See, when they rework legion, they never "really" removed old legion from the game. Old legion is just an add-on. It's very same add-on that made Old legion hated. Let me elaborate further. Nurse has an ability called Blink and as everyone knows, Blink allows you to go through objects which devalues pallets, vaults and virtually every tileset in the game. Legion ability increases his movement speed and allows him to vault over pallets and windows, but the drawback of legion is that his ability was gated by deep wound mechanic, a mechanic specifically designed to "weaken" or remove lethality from his power(in his reworked state). Frank tape add lethality to his power and gives him the ability to ignore tilesets exactly how nurse ignores tile sets. Ironically enough, Nurse gets a pass when it comes to ignoring tilesets because her power has large skill-cieling where as Legion's power is look down upon because the skill-cap to achieve same result is considerably lower and therefore more consistent. It begs to question if mechanics such as these should exist and how potent should they be towards overall gameplay experience.
At the end of the day, all of the arguments boil down to being able to 1vs1 a killer because survivor bias players only have fun if they're able to consistently avoid being downed for the entire match. For some reason, The "1vs1" Survivor experience trumps the 1vs4 experience for killer. Old Legion's High dc rates comes from the 1vs1 survivor experience being miserable because regardless of how good the survivor was, Legion could always down them because of brute force anti-loop behavior his power exhibits. This is very same reason why people don't like bloodlust for killers because that mechanic through movement speed increase achieves similar unworthy downs that deep wound has for legion. At the same time, The killer has to eventually down you in a chase because if he can't down enough survivors in a chase before the generator are powered, you simply will never win as killer. I would say the last 2 years of dbd has truly evolved into being a looping simulator where survivors aren't afraid of the killer and the killer ability to provide any meaningful fear factor in a chase isn't really present so long as pallets exist on the map. as such, working on generators isn't scary or difficult, so in that sense, survivor's skill-cap for completing generators is about as skillful as Legion using Feral Frenzy to down survivors.
TL:DR Legion Franks Mixtape/Deep Wound mechanics isn't a fair gameplay mechanic, however the gameplay implications will not really change the outcome of match if the survivors apply the same tactics they use to beat every other killer(Stall chases, Complete generators & Unhook/heal to pip).
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Rework Legion already.
- His basekit is absolute garbage
- Got nerfed despite multiple posts admitting that he was garbage
- The only way for his power to be any good is if you exploit it
- Unintentionally brought back an old exploit into not 1, but 2 separate perks.
- Devs are forced on this balancing act to make sure he not overbearing
- Poorly thought-out add-ons
- Was hated since release. Nowadays people just tolerate him since he's no longer 'Old Legion'.
I'll see you lot in year when Legion finally gets that Freddy treatment.
Also it's not just Nemesis. Beast of Prey, Franks Mix-tape and Stab Wounds Study completely break him as well.
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You could also simply not kick gens, or run ruin, or slug a ds player. You could simply not play the game if we're getting to the brass tacks. "Just don't do it" isn't a valid response. It's part of the game and needs to be taken into account every time. Sorry. You're wrong.
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Well dark devotion doesnt work anymore along with stbfl because ff doesnt count as a basic attack anymore. Nemesis make sure your stunned with the pallet and make it to the survivor fast enough. Because it takes 20 seconds to recharge the power so you may have like 10 seconds to hit the survivor. Bop is alittle different you have to smack the survivor with ff then follow them till you get bloodlust then they start to bleed out because you become undetectable.
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I hitted the Obsession with the normal attack. And I was stunned before I started frenzy. As long as I heard the chase music the timer stopped. And If I stand still the Survs started mending. I didnt get someone down without normal hitting. Try it. It's nearly impossible without normal hitting if the surv isnt a potato xD
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Weird i havent had that many problems with nemesis (i dont use bob screw bob) use it with spirit fury so when you break the pallets they throw down then try to eat the pallet they throw down at the end. Pallet insta breaks and they become my obsession then i just smack them with ff. (If they dont 360 juke me around my body hate that so dang much).
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Ah I See my problem. I thought they just go down. I didnt hit them with ff again. So if I hit them 3 times with ff they are down like with release legion ?
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Basically how nemesis works is for 40 seconds after you get hit with the pallet the survivor has some kinda effect that makes them immune to tr so what you want to do is smack them with ff. Then they might bleed out but depends on how long you took to hit with them you have to be really quick or else i think the status effect will run out and then they just go back to not going down.
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Basically nemesis when your stunned with a pallet for 40 seconds the survivor gets the status effect that makes them immune to tr. So you get hit from the pallet so that removes 5 seconds so you have to be really quick because even if you smack them with ff if nemesis runs out they wont bleed out.
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Sorry to burst your false equivalence even kicking a generator is something that happens naturally you don't have to run ruin and you don't have to slug for decisive strike.
Nice job trying to compare those two to kicking generators to make your false equivalency seem more valid.
That's like someone camping and then getting surprised when I get gen rushed just don't camp. The ability to campers in the game just because it is doesn't mean you have to do it especially if it's obvious that it's detrimental
Actually read what I'm writing this time BLINDING the killer and HEAD ON stun are things you have to go out of your way to do do you can survive just as well without doing it.
You hinder yourself by not kicking a generator you don't hinder yourself by not blinding the Killer.
I never once said that the survivor has stop looping.
However blinding the killer requires you to bring an item in use the item and aim it at the killer's face for a couple of seconds this breaks the flow of gameplay it's something you have to go out of your way to do.
Head on you have to go into a locker for 3 seconds and wait for the killer to go within Range and then fast whole out of it once again something you are going out of your way to do.
Considering you have to go out of your way to do both of these things yes don't do it is a valid statement.
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Killers dont see the timer go down. They made it that way so the killer wouldnt know if you were in his TR or not. It goes down on the survivors screen, but not on yours.
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The problem that i'm pointing out is fairness, not viability.
The only killers who will run "new old legion" (stab wounds/frank's + BoP + Nemesis) are the ones who got matched with a survivor from their blacklist and want to give them a one-way ticket to the hook... And baby killers, of course.
New old legion is just another toxic tool for brainlets (like insidious camping). As a killer, i want the game to be better for both sides, not completely killer-sided, and that's why i feel this should not be implemented.
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It was hard to write that distinction in my post. Potency = how strong something is. How dynamic a mechanic is =how much inconsistency/counter-play a mechanic has. Iridescent head Huntress is very powerful, but it is still dynamic killer. you either miss or hit hatchets. Legion's deep wound mechanic is either garbage because you have no lethality/weak.or strong because lethality is good enough to win. You can be strong and have counter-play, Weak and limit counter-play or strong and still limit counter-play. you always want first one, and don't want other two. Legion franks tape/cold studies fall between 2 and 3 and not really first one. Maybe legion could somehow be juked than he would fall closer to first one. Maybe if for example, if he vaults a pallet, he loses 80% feral frenzy gauge and he has to hit you in like 4 seconds or his power expires, this might allow you to window jukes or pallet jukes. Revaulting a pallet or window ends the power automatically than maybe franks mixtape could be default legion or something along those lines.
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I really want to know what the Devs are going to do, the more I look at Legion the stupider it gets and I just want to know what their plans are or if they're even listening. I'm not even excited for the Legion changes or even about playing them anymore because of how ridiculous this has turned out.
They increase his speed, nerf his stall power, and keep his stun time so he can't even be a chase Killer or a stall Killer, he is in-between both things because they can't make up their mind or even listen to the community. It wasn't the community who wanted the Mend timer shrunk down it was them.
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If anything, I feel like The Legion needs to be buffed. And that could be the buff they need. Survivors would just have to be more careful to not be the Obsession?
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