Dramatic but this is how I feel now...
@Almo @Peanits @not_Queen @MandyTalk @Gay Myers (Luzi) (Community Managers, Rely this to the Devs. Not blaming the community managers at all. Just tell the Devs what they have done.)
I can't believe you did it. Good job. You have successfully made me lose all faith in BHVR and any hope that you listened to your community. All of this feed back and what do we get? The Deep Wound Changes... the Legion getting all that taken from them with just some movement speed to try and make up for it... even the Oni nerf in a small way, since you gave him no time to settle in like you said you would. Giving Legion the movement speed while removing all threat of Deep Wound... what? It's like you are giving us maggots to eat and expecting us to be happy cause "At least it's something." Are we supposed to be happy about the movement speed cause "At least it's something"? All these "Buffs" are just nerfs you slapped on Legion for no reason and are reverting. The Add-on changes are negligible.
Survivors can get hit with Feral Frenzy and just run around. Something that is supposed to be them bleeding out from a wound deep enough they have to put pressure on it to stop the bleeding... and they can run around no problem. Survivors run around anyway in matches so this is literally harmless, it's basically a free health state. You didn't even reduce Deep Wound Timer, You didn't even revert the reduction to mend times... You made Legion even weaker, cause none of you know how to handle their power or the Deep Wound mechanic which was flawed to begin with. You couldn't just replace Deep Wound. No, you just made Legion's power literally a punishment to ever use. You made walking after people and M1ing the best strategy.
So yea.... You did it. You made me give up. You killed The Fanatical Legion Main. Congratulations. I no longer want to play. I no longer want to support this game at all.
Comments
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Harsh, but ultimately the main point is correct.
BHVR was given pages upon pages of decent feedback and what they delivered was...very disheartening to say the least. They managed to make a weak Killer weaker, despite the Community wanting him to be both FUN and STRONG.
At this point, we all know Deep Wounds is a terrible power. They just need to redesign him.
That being said, I am not to the point that our poor Fanatical Legion Main is at, yet. I still hold out hope, for if he truly is done, I'll take up the fight to see Legion buffed.
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That was mainly to make sure SOMEONE SAW IT, so they would know what they are doing to people who used to enjoy this game. Maybe they can tell the Devs that refuse to listen.
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I do not think they are to blame either, but, they didn't appear to help. I love our CM's, but there must be a massive lack of communication if the Dev team and the Community are SO opposite to one another.
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I've even uninstalled the game. Will I be back? Right now that answer is a no. Maybe that will change, but for now, I can't fathom supporting this train wreck. Maybe after a bit i'll be back to yelling about Legion needing a buff but for now, it feels way too pointless to even bother.
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Then, for the time being, I'll go ahead and take up that mantle. I still have hope. Unfortunately for you, everyone always comes back. It's a damn curse, I swear.
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Thank you for still trying, my friend. Go with The Legion's blessing, as little as that means any more.
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It means something to many of us, some more vocal than others.
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If they really read this post, they'll tell you "Civ V is a good game" or "pretty good job so far"
And i don't think they will rework him like freddy because he is not license dlc. Why spend resource and work on something that is not gonna sales and earns big money?
After all, it's all about business and money
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Perhaps, but I think BHVR are good and genuine people. I think that there has been some massive disconnect between the Dev team and the Community at large. That clearly needs to be addressed.
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I like the changes.
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Nevertheless, lets hope they buff legion in future and not mess up the upcoming doctor's change
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I honestly wish they just completely rework Legion. Give him a Freddy style change. Would be what's best for him, and revert the changes BT got.
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Do you play Legion or Killer?
Actually, you know what? I don't want to even start this conversation.
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Oh? Why do you?
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Was wondering what you thought of it. It's disgusting.
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Yes, I used to main him, my main complaint with the nerfs in the EGC update was that the feral frenzy speed and vaulting felt too slow, I could care less about the deep wounds and basic attack nerf since my gameplay style did not revolve around that
if you did not like the changes its ok, I understand why it is that way
As stated above all I really cared about legion was their movement and vaulting speed, and they buffed that so now it feels way better to play them, now i dont have to rely on bamboozle to feel like i am vaulting pallets midly fast.
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okay, you cared about half the Killer's power. Got it. You are also completely missing the point.
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I'm with you. I can't think of another example of when the community and devs were so far apart, not just for this game, but games in general. It makes the fanbase feel like crap when their input is ignored so obviously. I gave the changes a try and hate them. I'll be stepping away from this game for a bit. Luckily the holidays are coming up to occupy my time until Animal Crossing comes out and then motorcycle season after that 🏍️
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You're giving up yelling at the clouds? @UlvenDagoth
I can't say I blame you. Hopefully you have more fun doing something else in your free time, and hopefully Legion gets an actually good rework eventually.
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Yes, i play legion and killer, most of my games as killer today have consisted on testing legion.
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I feel this way too, I don't even feel like complaining about anything in this game anymore ever since this whole debacle. They don't listen to us, we said Pins need to be on hit and they decided to bamboozle us with making that 2nd hit on a second Survivor, it's the same scenario as someone isn't effected by the add-on. When everyone gathered around for Nurse changes the Devs answered, when everyone cried out for Spirit changes the Devs answered, when everyone is crying out for Legion changes they ignore the entire playerbase lol
Changing Legion isn't as difficult as the Devs may think, all of us here have come up with over a dozen of changes ranging from small tweaks to complete reworks, the entire community has basically created an entire fix for Legion and they decided to take the harder route instead and make it as complicated as possible and in the process make Legion players suffer because they felt it was ok.
''Hey can we have a 3 second stun time?''
''Nah fam nah, I'm making your power less effective so other players don't have to suffer''.
''Uh what?''
''On second thought I'm making it completely non-lethal so it doesn't make Survivors have to worry about it''.
''Please, stop''.
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Well, there is one good thing about the new DW. Survivors actually have to mend. Sure, they can run around like an idiot, but they don't accomplish anything like that. No more survivors working gens through their DW without worry while their buddy loops Legion nearby. Sure, there's no longer anything that the killer can do to progress the timer, but there's also nothing that the killer needs to avoid to keep the timer from pausing. I just wish that either the timer was shortened, or that mending time wasn't decreased.
I keep seeing people say that Legion needs a rework. Honestly, I think they'd be a lot more fun if you didn't get kicked out of FF with a missed attack. I also think that if the pin effects were changed from mangled to hindered, and broken to either oblivious or exhausted, they'd be more viable.
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They can run to the other side of the map, unhook someone, get mended for 8 seconds and move on. They can get on a gen, wait till the timer is close to done then run behind something and mend for 12 seconds. OTZ got an 8 man Feral Frenzy streak cause mending is so quick now. Now they can literally just run away and mend, or mend after Legion leaves. The slight speed boost is HEAVILY outweighed by all the nerfs.... and the speed boost is just a reverted nerf. Legion's power is literally a punishment now
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I really see this as an overreaction, and I say that as somebody who bought Legion and got him to level 50. If anything, this made me more excited to play with him. I like the increased vault speeds, and I love that the button add-ons are finally useful.
If he needs more changes, then he'll get them down the line. If you're gonna be this dramatic over any changes that aren't precisely what you wanted, then you're the reason why community managers get tired of their jobs.
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More insults from you huh? Go away.
Also, good job. I bought them and P3'ed them. So by your logic, I have more right to complain then you.
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You know even tho i dislike otz, he actually did what I imagined legion is good for now. He can run like a dog at the fence chasing from one side to the other and never be a threat. Such fun, such wow utterly useless killer.
How are the button addons useful? They only work if people are grouping up together, you know something good survivors do not do especially against legion. Please explain to me how they are useful.
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Yep. Best Killer ever. 10/10 such wow, much.... I can't even be sarcastic right now to play along.
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If you're going to turn away everyone who disagrees with you on anything, don't be surprised when you get kicked out from places.
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Since DW is no longer TR based, survivors who aren't mending or running will have their timer deplete.
That means Deep Wounded survivors who attempt to do generators, heal, open the Exit Gates, and so on will have their Deep Wound timer deplete. 😁
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I think this is an improvement because at least now you can hit survivors. Because you could have all the stalling add-ons in the world but they're useless unless you actually hit them. Also it helps to think of frenzy as no more than just an M1 attack.
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Yes we know, and we see how useless that is.
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any buff is heavily outweighted by the nerfs.
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Thinking its more then an M1 attack dosen't make it so. Its so much less now.
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Just because the survivors try not to group up, doesn't mean it's never going to happen. There are only so many scenarios where all of your teammates can be spread out enough that Legion can't chain any hits together.
Plus, before these changes, the buttons were completely useless, no matter how the survivors played. They forced you to do something that you should never do as Legion.
You are the one who started an argument. You chose to escalate it and antagonize me every time I replied to you. I simply reciprocated your behavior after I started to get fed up with it.
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I don't see how when every Legion player ever wanted this change. 😕
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Buttons should do it on first hit though to make sure they actually do something though.
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I was just talking. Sorry Text is a mess at context.
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Every Legion player wanted this change? Really? I didn't. I doubt many others did too looking at all the threads asking the Devs the heck were they thinking doing this. The speed doesn't make up for everything else. Legion's power does nothing other than injure people which most ignore anyway. They have been made more add-on dependent and useless. Most perks do nothing for them anymore. You might as well just m1. Heck, my two Legion rework threads didn't have this crap in them and they were massive. You can't just say "Every Legion player" wanted something.
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Accurate
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Trust me friend there is nothing worse than hitting one survivor and almost never catching other survivors (I'm sure you can relate) but this is better for legion. 130% movement speed, 0.9 second vault speed, pins on first hit. In exchange for 3 seconds of mending (survivors used to mend in same spot hit then do stuff negating hard work) and slight nerf to mend time add-on, removal of basic attack on frenzy hit (I'm not a fan of this change but I can see why.)
All in all, legion is in a slightly better place and can at least punish mistakes more often then before.
Tl;Dr These changes are good but like anything could be better, Ulven I know that if anyone can keep faith and suggest amazing ideas it's you, I simply ask for some patience and time to review these changes.
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Buttons should cause the effect on the first hit, considering how crap DW is.
A missed attack should not stun Legion and take them out of FF, considering it's a non-lethal ability.
Not only was the time needed to mend reduced, but now as long as the survivor is sprinting the timer doesn't decrease? Really? That's how they fixed this?
They need to rework Legion, already. They're absolutely useless and not fun nor rewarding to play as. They get awesome cosmetics and shafted in every other way possible.
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Pins on first hit. You are already wrong. Pins only work if the person is highlighted in KI. So you have to hit someone else first.
It's not better. We lost perks, we lost what little lethality we had, we lost any pressure our power could bring for what? We move faster. Yay. We get stunned for 4 seconds still, we lose our power on a miss still. We have forever to wait for our cooldown made worse by the fact if you DO m1 someone you lose 50% of your power.
This is what I said. We shouldn't be happy cause "At least there is some buff." This is a foolish mentality and will only result in us being dogs, happy to get table scraps. Slightly better means nothing when a survivor can run across map with no penalty and get mended by someone else in under 8 seconds. OR just themselves in 12. OTZ got a 8 man frenzy stream cause people kept mending so fast. Does that look like a useful power to you? Hell it doesn't even do anything after they are injured.
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Thank you for still being a voice of reason.
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The deep wound was anyway never a threat, just like piggys trap it is a timewaste. It sucks they reduced the mending time but the other changes dont really mind Legion at all. I mean it was honestly really frustrating if a Wraith chased you cloaked while you have deep wound and you would die without beeing able to do anything, same goes to Freddy. Bebause of this issue they did this change and I can totally understand BHVR there.
BUT I cant understand why BHVR hates Legion SOOOOOOOOO much, why does they just dont give us the money back and delete them? I mean come on... just end the suffering of this Killer. I am not even in the state where I would call this character a KILLER.
It is fun atleast running around really fast and stabbing everyone because of the speed and vault buff but thats it. But well.. we all know that BHVR will never do somerhing with Legion or maybe in a few years when they managed to update the other killers.
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Well, several of Demogorgon's add-ons don't do anything if you don't make use of his portals (Or if you don't get a chance, because you spend the whole match chasing people). Some of Myers' add-ons don't do anything if you don't stay in EW1 long enough to hit someone. Most of Doctor's add-ons don't do anything at all if you never use Treatment mode or Shock Therapy. Several of Trapper's add-ons don't do anything if the survivors don't step in any traps. Should they all be changed?
Add-ons are meant to change up your playstyle. Buttons encourage you to go for chain hits with FF. So let them.
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Dat "trusted" boi uses NOED on Legion. Just sayin'
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You arnt seeing that the "buffs" dont outweigh the nerfs. Sure, the speed feels better. I'll give you that. It's fun.... but it's useless. You have no reason to ever use your power, as at this point it actively punishes you for it. Sure you get that first hit, but then what? You are an M1 Killer with nothing to help you in a chase, at all. Legion is now one of the worst Killers on the roster, even lower than even 2 days ago.
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It's a sidegrade. Survivors can still loop Legion after being buffed from a frenzy attack. It only helps with preventing survivors from doing interactions when their DW bar is low. They're free to do gens, run around, or whatever until then.
Get this, deep wound and borrowed time are the same effect. Only difference is in how it's applied right? Borrowed time is considered to be a powerful survivor perk. So, why does a killer apply a buff to who they should be trying to kill? Might as well play survivor rather than playing as Legion.
All you get from frenzy is information which is only marginally useful. Legion can't even stall anymore.
Before you argue that their faster now. Great, you can catch up to the survivor. Now what do you do? Eat a 4 second stun while the survivor runs away.
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