About the 'yes men' who say everything is fine in these forums.
I've been around these forums and on social media following dbd for a while. Something which I always see is people who play the game wanting improvement, the thing is that any reasonable frustration is always responded with a reason for dbd to not need to implement whatever improvement just yet.
I'm talking about the yes men who refuse to criticize the game because they enjoy dbd, convince themselves that or just blatantly lie thinking it's good for the game.
It's more evident in these forums when somebody makes a thread about finding a certain killer hard to play/win as. There's always people saying "well I don't have this issue, I 4k everytime" so you that person is being a 'yes man' and not acknowledging difficult other players have, it blankets the need for criticism for that topic.
The golden counter argument to the Devs needing to cut down on cosmetics and instead fix their game is as we all know "they're two separate areas within behaviour, you can't just get artists to start coding" I think these people are also people who hear this opinion and assume it's the ultimate reason why the game is wonky and cosmetics are decent so they spout it out whenever it fits.
My gripe with that excuse is that instead of allocating so much resources on the team who do cosmetics, maybe the focus should be aimed towards the team behind actually maintaining the game and fixing any oddity that pops up.
Whenever people say there's nothing that can be done because the two areas are separate, that doesn't solve the issue it just covers it up until the next wave of bugs come.
This isn't a bash at the Devs, it's a critique of those people who think that defending the Devs every single decision is good for the game.
I know the Devs need to fix and relook at a lot of things, they're on it but the people pretending that everything is working as intended are one of the main reasons why the next frustration you face is still in the game.
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I think the chapter releases need to slow down to grant more time for bug fixes. The current patch system isn't working. Bug fixes come every chapter and mid-chapter patch but at the same time more bugs are introduced. We are lucky if we get one or two hotfixes between each major update and those hotfixes only address some game breaking bugs.
It is my belief that trying to keep verson parity between PC and console is partly to blame for this. Consoles have verification processes that patches have to go through before they can be implemented. This is not true for PC.
The Devs should adopt a patching system that bring multiple hotfixes to PC where they can be validated in live gameplay. Take those hotfixes and package them up in a single hotfix for console verification. This is something we see already with companies like DE's Warframe.
I don't see BHVR doing this though. This would break version parity between systems which would limit the wet dream of cross platform play that some are begging for.
It's somewhat sad looking how other games are handled. You look at Last Year with the small Dev team they have and they are pumping out hotfixes and balance changes weekly. Imagine how much better this game could be if the focus was on stability instead of mediocre chapter releases.
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Is 'Yes Men' code word for 'Trusted'????
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I do what I want.
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I find it odd seeing the Deathgarden team at the beginning of their revamping of the game into Deathgarden: Blood Harvest progress so quickly. I believe they put out mini patches weekly. Something along those lines. I assumed the dev team was smaller (possibly not, who knows) than DBD's.
At the same time, those devs were determined to keep the game from dying, so that may have been the reason for such quick updates while DBD probably has a more consistent and stable player base that they don't need to desperately please or convince to stay. Not sure. I like your points here, though. Maybe one day this ideal system will come true... One day lol.
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DBD has the benefit of being the first of its genre. DG made the mistake of marketing towards players of this game instead of a wider market. Not to mention the original release was around the same time as larger games were being released.
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While I understand those with the "Trusted" label being far more cautious with their wording I have seen a couple who do not shy away.
I do not believe BHVR would remove anyone's "Trusted" status provided the criticism is civil and not hate filled, but I am not labeled as such and therefore cannot speak to any anxiety or unintended pressure they may feel to do so.
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The yes men are NOT those with Trusted status. I've seen them share their frustrations with everyone else however I will say that I think some people who are Trusted or whatever feel obligated to 'promote the game' rather than have a disgruntled opinion of the game when you've been given a special title.
This isn't about trusted people it's more about the people who shield and dismiss criticism of the game when it's a genuine annoyance which a player has. The fact that I think a few trusted people are kinda like BHVRs shields to criticism is irrelevant because there are also way more random people who are just defending BHVR all the time.
There's no harm in defending the game Devs but when it's at the point that you're trying to make a mockery of people who are mad and then nothing is done to address these issues it's overall bad for the games health as well as the playerbase.
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Lol. Apparently I'm the only one who has no idea who has the trusted status on here.
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Its the people who have the word Trusted next to their name instead of just "Member". All the Trusted people are also rocking red PFPs. Theres afew of us with the PFPs that arnt Trusted though.
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There are currently eight Trusted members - myself, GrootDude, Boosted_Dwight, FireHazard, Elk, Boss, twistedmonkey and NMCKE. As LordGlint mentioned, they (we) can be distinguished by the "Trusted" tag that appears next to our username on each comment.
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I don't see a trusted tag next to names. Maybe because I'm on mobile? And I have no idea what PFP is.
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Ah, yeah the tags aren't visible on mobile. That will probably change with the new forum update - as I understand it, it's supposed to be a significant improvement to the mobile interface. For now, though, I can tell you that all of the eight people I mentioned above are Trusted. Basically anyone with a red profile picture (with LordGlint being the only exception currently).
Also, PFP is just an abbreviation for "Profile Picture" or "Profile Pic" 😊
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Oh I guess I never noticed the red background on you guys pictures.
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Dont I feel special, lol
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Aw I'm sorry, I didn't mean to make you feel bad 🙁 Genuinely, FUotM is an achievement and something to be proud of in itself.
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Honestly I hate ppl like that, like when I talk about something and they’re like “I don’t have any issue with it” like ok cool do you want a cookie or something? If you have nothing to help the argument then don’t participate like for example when I say that the frame rate is bad in ps4 and some random person says “idk what you’re talking about I get 4 kills with 30 FPS easily” wow very helpful thx for participating with your utterly useless comment
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Your good. There should be afew of us running around with the PFP, Im pretty sure I was just the first non-trusted and probably the most active.
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I think it was just you and Divine_Confetti, and they decided they didn't want to keep it. I don't believe that any new FUotM have been chosen since November.
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There isn't much money in solving actual big problems, money comes from band aid fixes and releasing more DLC and cosmetics. People just need to remember that they are a company and not your friends, if they can make money at your expense they will.
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Well then...lol. They dont exactly announce FMotM or anything, you just kinda stumble across someone with the background. Maybe the new ppl are just the type who stick to the Lore subsections or something, lol.
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Yeah, I think it would definitely be good to have more info available about the program in general. Until quite recently, barely anyone even knew it existed, including those nominated for it in some cases.
I tend to hang around Recent Discussions, so I see pretty much everyone that comes through, and I haven't seen anyone else with the red avatar. And it seems unlikely that they would give FUotM to anyone who is so inactive that they just disappear for weeks on end immediately after getting it. But anyway, I don't want to derail the thread completely, so probably not the best place to discuss it in too much depth.
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What the "Yes Men" don't understand is that they are not doing the game any favour. Criticism helps changing the game for the better.
Pretending that problems don't exist or even blatantly making stuff up to "win" a discussion doesn't help anyone. Other players aren't going to be convinced by such "arguments" anyway.
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Yeah, what a shame. Even they said they wanted it to be competitive. Like a potential e-sport, but I don't think many past the DBD fanbase got to see it sadly.
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I think the criticism is indeed, very necessary. I’d highly doubt that the Trusted Program has anything to do with it though— they just encourage constructive criticism, which is much more usable than just “this game sucks”.
However your argument does hold water, and BHVR, like all humans, makes mistakes, but it’s better to be honest and admit the game isn’t perfect.
Going into the details in regards to a business standpoint, there’d be no point in having people say the game is perfect, especially with how the game is developed and how they do, listen to feedback. Not only would this be a major issue in regards to how funds are spent; but it could cause a huge scandal. Take for example, October 2019– the Sunday Riley Skincare company made it’s employees write fake reviews for them. With that under our understanding, let it also be said that there was a major FTC Lawsuit, which settled with a warning and if any of it continued, there’ll be civil charges. The difference between this case and DBD is, DBD is a game. However that doesn’t mean that it isn’t possible they’d do so, but with the ruin changes already being a huge source of backlash, the negative PR wouldn’t do any better in this, so logically speaking (from a semi-informed business point) this wouldn’t be worth the hassle. A major damage to their credibility just for maybe a few more product buys with the game already going on sale in conjunction with most other sales, and the winter sale, it’s pretty clear that they have the budget for sales of cosmetics, since some retailed for exceptionally cheaper than its standard price.
If you do however feel as if these yes men are partnered and endorsing BHVR products by saying they’re perfect, here’s how to look out for these fake review accounts. The easiest way to apply this concept is by looking at how old the account is, and how frequently they comment.
However none of these characteristics are applicable to said ‘yes men’ nor with the trusted. The Pilot itself states that these users encourage constructive criticism; but that doesn’t mean they think the game is perfect. The same can be said with The Fog Whisperers Program; none of them shy away from having their personal criticism for the game, but like previously mentioned, they encourage constructive criticism.
With their already major gross from the game alone (30 million, which is not as much as the 110 million total gross from the rest of their products), the fake reviews wouldn’t be worth the time or resources especially when they don’t have any issues with sales as is.
TLDR: I agree, but BHVR ran ‘yes men’ accounts are highly unlikely, and Trusted don’t have anything to do with the issue. Looking at companies who HAVE done this, these do nothing for sales since they are not selling a product, and it’s more likely to look for the reviews of the product for this ‘yes men’ situation. Criticism is essential for this games survival, but those FUoTM (or, Trusted), do not do such from what I’ve seen; in fact they can be vocal about it if they so wish.
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I am trying to be less critical but I do understand what you're saying. It can be very frustrating. Especially when it happens over, and over, and over, and over, and over again. With each update there are as many bugs introduced as there are fixed. And you always have the head scratchers. Oni goes live....wraith has 6 new bugs making him a chore to play. How are they related?
I will end by saying I know Jack ######### about coding etc and I do feel overall they do a good job. But maybe lay off a couple in the art department and bring in another QA?
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Really good analysis. I still think too many people on here and Twitter or whatever it is continuously defend every single move dbd takes.
Dbd could tweet New Cosmetic for the Hag 'Thar she blows' (she's a pirate with a wooden leg, eye patch hoop earrings etc.) people would reply "fix the game" leading to lots of people saying it's impossible for the current problems to be fixed. It gets annoying and predictable but most of all it devalidates criticism when it turns into a spst between the two stances.
Also hags "Thar' she blows" outfit when?
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@goat10em I wouldn't say lay off a few off the art department, dbd has been doing well especially over the last year with the cosmetics and all that. They just need to see genuine player criticism and act on it by maybe a few extra numbers to support the game devs where the bugs happen.
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We seen DbD's e-sport potential. It was horrible.
So many people attempted to make a working rule set and no one found anything that worked. It basically boiled down to Survivor V Survivor teams while almost ignoring the Killer. It doesn't help that the "official" DbD tournament was a disaster as well.
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BHVR isn't a Major enterprise. Don't expect too much.
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That tourney, though. Good times LUL
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You have those kinds of people in every game forum, that will never change. Some people will never see flaws, just as some people will always see nothing but flaws.
It is definitely worse here though, because the community is heavily divided into two specific camps. Those that play both get labeled as one or the other depending on what they say at the time. It doesn't help that the devs seem to be taking sides rather than mediating the issues. To be fair, I only started coming here fairly recently when I decided to give killers a try and was looking for some advice. Not sure if this is the norm for these forums, or not.
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Well said my friend.
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Bingo!
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Well on the other hand there's also the 'No men' who think every single change is bad and the devs don't care etc.
The ones who post another "This change is horrible" thread before the change is even out for testing.
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It tells a lot about the game that nobody can come up with a working tournament concept.
Even "space esports" won't continue with the DbD tournaments btw.
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It turns out that a game built for solo players doesn't work in team based competitions.
For a DbD competition to work you need to look at each individual player. Survivor v Survivor, not Survivor team v Survivor team. Killer v Killer, not Killer v Survivor/s.
But that doesnt fit as an esport at all. It would require a round robin tournament with each player taking a turn as Killer. Round robins take freaking forever to play.
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The most ridiculous thing that happens on these forums is BHVR employees responding to the same nonsensical complaints over and over while ignoring serious suggestions.
The "Feedback" forum here is worse than reddit in how often the same crap is retred and the very worst part is how BHVR seems to give the most attention to that crap.
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I think it’s also possible to confuse “yes men” with the super common “internet contrarian”. “Yes Men” would only agree with Dev changes/choices. But this forum (and every other) has its share of contrarians who live and breathe just to argue. People: “Hawkins has unsafe pallets” Contrarian: “um ackshually, I loop all the time, even against bloodlust 3.” And on and on.
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I enjoy the game. I enjoy it before they make a change, I enjoy it after they make a change. It's a good game. I'm not sure if I am your target demo tho since I don't mind them changing stuff.
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Yes but not only them
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