I've come to the conclusion that you can't play fair as killer.
I've tried, I really have, but I can't pay fair as killer any more. I hear the git gud and learn to plays. I hear the drop chase and don't over commit. I've tried it all. The region I'm on has me playing against survivors that have 10 times my hours and they're all expert loopers.
When I commit, I might get one kill before I'm gen rushed. Two hooking most people of course. Now, when I slug, proxy camp, use noed, and all of the things that survivors hate, I win. I get good blood points and i pip. So yeah, at the top levels of survivor play, you can't play fair.
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You can play fair. It's called playing within the rules of the game. Playing with every advantage you can get as long as they are within the rules of the game. As long as you play without the intention of ruining the game for the other side by not playing the game.
What you're talking about is the "Survivor's Rulebook for Killers". Discard it.
What people call toxic and unfair tends to be the other side playing as optimally as they can, ignore them.
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In the words of Tru3Ta1ent, who I somewhat despise when it comes to balance ideas, nevertheless I agree with this, “It’s not possible for me as Killer to win 12 chases every game at high ranks-do you think Clown can win 12 chases on Asylum? I have to camp or tunnel to win, I have no other choice.”
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JuSt PrEsSuRe GeNs
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Convincing new killers to "be nice" and "play fair" is the greatest mindtrick in this game. Figuring that out and getting passed that is how you get to and stay in the high red ranks. The jerk survivors are always going to be jerks. Whether you win or lose theyre always going to have something to say. Screw them.
Youre a predator, your job is to kill. Thats your roll, thats what you do. You cant do that being nice. If you see someone injured, thats weakness, predators eliminate the weak first. If youve got two healthy survivors in front of you one is on death hook the other you havent even chased yet, the death hook survivor is weak. And you target weakness. Once the weak are gone, the strong are vulnerable.
I just beat a 4 man swf, and i did so by targeting their OoO anytime i caught her slipping. I tricked her numerous times into thinking i was chasing someone else and caught her out of position. She got hooked 3 times and only 1 other person got hooked once. Once she was gone, everything else fell apart. I also baited their flashlight saviour out a few times and she caught smacks for it. I wasnt nice during the match and you know what happened at the end? They all sent me ggs. Because they were good survivors and knew i had to do what i had to, just like they did.
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You will never be able to fully please the other side. There will always be players on both sides who get mad at you for doing the objective of that role. As long as you aren't cheating or doing anything bannable, you are playing fair.
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Are you mind gaming? Even on loops where youre clearly visible you can make them mess up by double faking.
Windows can be a lot tougher, sometimes you think youre close enough and youre just not, but if you fake passed the window twice then go through it often theyll be right in front of you and youll be right behind them when you come out of tge animation. If youre getting looped a lot with a normal speed killer you just have to practice your mind games and hiding your red stain more.
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You can, anyway only if you get perfect with a character with a high skillcap just like nurse or huntress.
With killers like Bubba, Trapper or Clown it's not possible to win against a good team without pöaying scummy af.
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You are not playing the part of the fairness fairy. You are a killer. As long as you are not breaking the TOS, use what ever is at your disposal to try and kill survivors.
Lol i was a muder machine with spirit last night using silly builds against red rank potato teams. Then drunken me decided to play instadown clown(I probably should have used an ebony mori or not had that last shot)... but i swear, every time i pick clown i get that seal team survivor squad on the worst maps for clown 😂😂😂🤡🤡🤡
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I've said it many times:
"If Survivors never hold back on their builds and tactics, why should killer?"
They'll be salty and try to discourage you with their made up rules about what's fair vs. whats considered "toxic", but they do so with absolutely no intention of playing in kind (it's rather hypocritical of them), so by all means OP: Play how you want to play, and enjoy the game!
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I disagree personally, though I have no aspirations of ever being a red rank killer. At weaker ranks you can get away with playing friendly and fair to everyone, and still get a good amount of 4ks. You will get the odd salty team but in my opinion it's worth it. If you want to be Rank 1, well either you have to be as good as a top streamer or you have to play a lot more ruthlessly to make up for it. That's not for me personally - in part because I'm colour blind and can't see scratch marks on over half the levels, but if you want to get to the top, sure - do what you need to do to win.
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The fairness you speak of seems to stem from the "survivors rulebook for killers"...which I do not agree with
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I leave this simple math here. Explain why Survivors Gen rush & Killer tunneling.
I honestly if tunneler Killer able to 1st hook the 3rd Survivor, they will likely to suicide on hook since 4th Survivor rescue is a suicide.
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Take it easy man, try to camp a zone where the Gens are very close together, try to change of objective several times u can't lose time with 1 survivor who just used god loops or all pallets. All main killers had to camp several times I'm rank 1 in Xbox gg
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Whoever said you had to play by the survivor's rules? I will now quote Tywin Lannister
"A lion does not concern itself with the opinion of the sheep".
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Next time i get hatemail im using that
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I've never played by the "survivors rule book". It's always been there to shame killers and to have easy games. I play by the devs rules and nothing more.
FUCK YOUR SURVIVOR RULES!
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The thing is, I'm not a new killer. I'm consistently in low purple and 375 hours. I constantly get rank ones. Heck I played against umbra the other night.
You and I have the same problem. No joke, i get these survivors 80% of the time.
I can't speak for him, but I mindgame. I moonwalk, play tricks with my red light, double fake, vault the windows multiple times, etc. I win a lot of them, but the time wasted causes me to lose the match.
I use three gen strats, and the survivors i play don't need God loops to waste my time. Here is what they do. Loop a pallet 3 or so times, then throw it last second and rush to another loop. Loop that one and take a hit, then rush to the next loop. Loop that one 4 times and dead hard, which gives them time for one more loop. 3 gens pop and i have one down.
So I try hit and run, keep em off the gens, but everyone uses the exact same perks and tactics.
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What killer are you playing as? I still say if youre getting looped that hard that often theres something off about your mind games. Given what you said about the number of hours you have Im guessing you dont have a lot of good perks yet, thats probably part of the issue too.
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All of them. Lot of doctor, wraith, hag, and plague. Most of my builds are corrupt, pop, bbq, then I throw in save the best, whispers, noed, or devour hope.
Hard to talk about mindgames without seeing me play, but assume I know what I'm doing.
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Well doc has anti loop built in, if you get the timing right theyll start dropping pallets early.
Hag has her teleport, throwing a trap down in the middle of a loop will often scare them away from it and if they dont you can teleport and hit them (never try looping with a 110% killer). Plague and wraith youre kind of stuck but with wraith with the right add ons you can often get that first hit as their leaving the generator, dont be afraid to keep doing that until you catch someone out of position healing.
Youre going to get looped, we all do, but youll find ways around that. Every loop is a pallet gone, and looping them in the right direction so theyre facing a dead zone is important.
At the end of the day, when the match starts youre at a disadvantage. If youre facing teams that are super efficient youre only chance is to force them inti the basement, but honestly its rare that it comes to that. Few games a night maybe. Im not trying to be mean or anything about your play time, im just getting at theres probably a lot of little things youre still missing and dont realize youre missing yet. The smallest mistake can cost you the game
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Doc is good at shutting down the loops, but they can still waste a ton of your time. I never loop with a 110% killer, I use the web method with hag.
The way you talk, you get reasonable survivors, they make mistakes like being out of position while healing, mine dont.
Lol at every loop is a pallet gone. You do realize that every map has more than enough pallets for the four minutes it takes for all five gens to be don't.
You're doing the same thing bhvr does, assuming that it's rare to face these kinds of teams. It's not, not for me anyway. Again, assume I know what I'm doing, I'm good enough to stay at rank 5 against nothing but rank 1s, and I'm good enough to mindgame umbra on a loop.
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If you're not hacking or cheating in some way then technically you're playing fair. The survivors rule book for killers is a load of shlt so just ignore entitled survivors and do whatever you have to do to win tbh.
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Well, i keep stats as solo survivor since the last patch, and i have to say this:
I like games that go on, back and forth the best. i dont mind losing then, but camping and tunneling prevent that.
However, i played over 100 games. i got 17 0kills, and 20 4ks. 4 of the 4ks did so with neither mori, camping nor tunneling (although 2 got devour hope to get active on a map where they weren´t found. But thats fair to me).
All other 4k resolved around those strategies, with a major chunk of the 3ks as well.
So to me, while it shows that killers can get 4k without doing those tactics, the majority of players that dont deploy those are not doing that well.
So a killer has to decide to either give the surivors a game they can enjoy, or to be effective. Both is very hard, and while i would want killer to get the enjoyable route, i find a lot of survivors very toxic, and can understand why killers then rather chose effectiveness.
Also to remark: I think a lot of 3 and 4k´s are actually not won by the killers, but lost by the survivors. If i played swf instead, i think those numbers would be very differen.
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Contrary to popular opinion, you can play within the so-called "Survivor Rulebook" and succeed. I've made it to rank 1 by doing this without Hex:Ruin, and while it wasn't easy, I didn't feel bad about anything I was doing.
I did this because I played both sides. I know what it's like to be first hook moried, camped, and tunneled, like I know what it's like to be tbagged and genrushed. I can get up to rank 1 by doing neither of these things.
It's a matter of getting lucky with the map spawns and RNG, and playing right. I won't pretend like I'm a god killer- I wouldn't even call myself good- but I don't get why everyone says it's impossible when it isn't.
It's challenging, but it's worth it.
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Of course you can, but you're handicapping yourself. While you can sympathize with how it's like to be kicked off the game first from a mori, a camp, or being ruthlessly tunneled, that doesn't mean you have to play suboptimally
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It’s all about gen pressure bud.
1: If you’re chasing a survivor where no gens are drop chase, they’re purposely wasting your time. Go back to gens.
2: if you’re chasing a survivor near gens and they drop a pallet, and you see another pallet close to them. Chase the survivor around that loop so they’re on the opposite end then break the pallet chance are you’ll get a hit in or a down.
3: Don’t be afraid to 3 gen if you have a weak start.
4: your priority is always gens, if you’re at a part of the map where a bunch of pallets are around and you’re chasing a survivor chase that survivor and break 1-2 pallets if you can’t get the down give up chase and go back to gens.
Gens are the priority for survivors pallets are their safety net tactically lowering that net over time is how you win the game.
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There's no univocal definition of fair. You can definitely play without camping and tunneling in the red ranks, if that's what you meant. However, it's a choice, not an obligation.
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This forum does not like people using logic. Be careful.
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No, you're correct; it's a handicap. But it's one I enjoy and still do well with, hence why I'd like to dispute that there's no way to do well while "playing fair". You can.
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Yeah, from what I remember that dude singlehandedly screwed the balance of For Honor.
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Then you have really really bad luck. If every team you face plays 100% perfectly and never makes any mistakes then yeah, youre screwes
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A another bad killer thread. Learn to play, its not that hard.
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Yep, I already know and do all of that, plus more. I don't chase off spirit burst for instance. Make em waste it, then pressure gens. These people I play know the distances down to the last pixel, plus they split up on gens, so you can't pressure everyone at once. Sooner or later, you have to commit. Plus if you don't get hooks, you don't get your emblems, so you don't pip.
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Not every team, but the majority do. Maybe 2 out of 10 make mistakes. And it's not that they don't make mistakes, but perks like deadhard bail them out when they do. Yes I know, bait deadhard, but baiting is useless when they use it for distance, or have the reflexes of a mongoose on amphetamines and refuse to use it.
Saw that video 150 hours ago. Again, assume I know what I'm doing. Simply by running those loops in the most efficient manner, you waste too much time.
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