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Was the BNP nerf necessary?

PinkEricka
PinkEricka Member Posts: 1,042
I want to hear opinions.
«1

Comments

  • PinkEricka
    PinkEricka Member Posts: 1,042
    @Tsulan I didn’t know they nerfed mori’s. What’s new with it?
  • PinkEricka
    PinkEricka Member Posts: 1,042
    Tsulan said:

    Please decide yourself... i just posted in your other thread...

    Also, yes I saw. I accidentally posted it twice
  • Tsulan
    Tsulan Member Posts: 15,095

    Ok i post the question again for further reference:
    Was the mori nerf necessary?

    Mori was nerfed last year. Before you could mori anyone the moment you downed him. Now you need to hook them first.

  • Tsulan
    Tsulan Member Posts: 15,095

    @Jack11803 said:

    @Tsulan said:
    Ok i post the question again for further reference:
    Was the mori nerf necessary?

    Mori was nerfed last year. Before you could mori anyone the moment you downed him. Now you need to hook them first.

    BNP was nerfed then too, alongside mori. Both were necessary.

    I agree. That´s why i brought this up.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823

    No, but i barely used it, so i don't care.

  • Jack11803
    Jack11803 Member Posts: 3,930

    @Tsulan said:

    @Jack11803 said:
    @Tsulan

    A mori can currently skip 8 hooks. That’s 66% of the killers objective done with an ultra rare. What’s BNP do now? 4 can do a gen instantly, so 20% of the survivors objective.... with FOUR. BNP did need ANOTHER nerf, this was too hard though. Should do 50% of a gen

    I also agree on this one!
    BNP nerf was to harsh, but survivors prefered to not participate on the PTB to change the final numbers of the BNP nerf. Back then i said, that survivors will regret this. And tadaaa they do.
    Now it´s to late to change it. We´ve got to live with the consequences.

    Yup

  • PinkEricka
    PinkEricka Member Posts: 1,042
    Tsulan said:

    Ok i post the question again for further reference:
    Was the mori nerf necessary?

    Mori was nerfed last year. Before you could mori anyone the moment you downed him. Now you need to hook them first.

    Ohh, I only started playing 9 or 10 months ago so I don’t think I was around to see the mori’s without the nerf. So I can’t really speak on it..

    From the question I am reading, if they can mori someone the moment they down them, that is too powerful and make matches much shorter than they’re suppose to be. I presume the nerf was to give survivors a chance before they get killed off way too early in the game?

    I also presume the nerf on the BNP was to also give killers a chance. I just wanted to hear everyone’s opinion. I think it was good that it got a nerf, it makes me feel bad for thinking that though because almost all my friends are survivor mains and they complain and say that the BNP was balanced and I can’t even explain it to them properly without them cutting me off and saying it was balanced because it would eat up all your toolbox if you messed up...
  • FrenziedRoach
    FrenziedRoach Member Posts: 2,600

    They changed it because their data showed how much of an impact stacking BNP's into one game had on the survival rate.

    So anotherwords, this was a way to target SWF.

  • Bravo0413
    Bravo0413 Member Posts: 3,647
    I agree with Tsulan the survivors should have excepted the nerfs and just played the PTB to maybe have some sort of influence on the changes... furthermore on the games current state the objective already gets completed wayy too quickly for solo play the game for the most part works as intended.. swf is where the devs were looking and they needed to take them into account as they should all the time!... it's the reason on the killer side a lot of the perks like BBQ, tinkerer,MYC are especially good on Billy and nurse and then on lower tier killers there average... the same should be done for survivors the devs should balance it around SWF... I'm happy that their starting to do this and hope they continue to do so
  • Tsulan
    Tsulan Member Posts: 15,095

    @PinkEricka said:
    Tsulan said:

    Ok i post the question again for further reference:

    Was the mori nerf necessary?

    Mori was nerfed last year. Before you could mori anyone the moment you downed him. Now you need to hook them first.

    Ohh, I only started playing 9 or 10 months ago so I don’t think I was around to see the mori’s without the nerf. So I can’t really speak on it..

    From the question I am reading, if they can mori someone the moment they down them, that is too powerful and make matches much shorter than they’re suppose to be. I presume the nerf was to give survivors a chance before they get killed off way too early in the game?

    I also presume the nerf on the BNP was to also give killers a chance. I just wanted to hear everyone’s opinion. I think it was good that it got a nerf, it makes me feel bad for thinking that though because almost all my friends are survivor mains and they complain and say that the BNP was balanced and I can’t even explain it to them properly without them cutting me off and saying it was balanced because it would eat up all your toolbox if you messed up...

    Correct. Moris were to strong back then. Same goes for BNP. Gens are take 80 seconds to finish if a single survivor repairs them. If the survivor hits consistently great skill checks and/or uses toolboxes it´s even less.
    All 5 gens can be repaired in 3 minutes. Now imagine 4 BNP that instantly repair a gen. Then game would take less than 2 minutes. BNP needed a nerf.

  • Jesya
    Jesya Member Posts: 1,101

    yes, yes it was.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823

    @Vietfox said:
    No, but i barely used it, so i don't care.

    Wanna make myself clear, I understood the nerf it got. As others said, yes, it was needed, but not that much.

  • fcc2014
    fcc2014 Member Posts: 4,388

    @PinkEricka @Jack11803 @Tsulan I disagree with both nerfs Killers mori shouldn't have been nerfed and neither should have brand new parts.

    The parts were 7k and skill required hitting skill checks.

    The mori's were a terrific counter against swf and ds. Killers could be more strategic with their offerings.

    If i got downed and taken out with a mori it was whatever. I prefer that over being camped and tunneled.

  • shadowsfall42
    shadowsfall42 Member Posts: 201
    BNP was essentially as if the game started with 4 gens, instead of 5. I'll admit though, 25% is a little low for an ultra rare add-on. So I'd either up it or lower it's rarity.
  • RepliCant
    RepliCant Member Posts: 1,436

    That BNP nerf was big, but due to how big it was, it needs to be a Very Rare add-on and not Ultra Rare. And they need to think of Ultra Rare items that aren't insta-whatever like the Rainbow map and Skeleton key.

  • slingshotsurvivor
    slingshotsurvivor Member Posts: 943
    BNP was so rare that the nerf really didn't do much at all imo. Gens still get rushed. So what are they gonna nerf for that? That's my question. 
  • Master
    Master Member Posts: 10,200

    @PinkEricka said:
    I want to hear opinions.

    yes

  • chemical_reject
    chemical_reject Member Posts: 940
    Ehh. I still ######### it up most of the time anyway and don't get the FULL use of it so the nerf just made it less appealing to me. I avoid it in my blood Web 
  • SnakeSound222
    SnakeSound222 Member Posts: 4,467

    Yes. It's now balanced.

  • Zagrid
    Zagrid Member, Alpha Surveyor Posts: 1,000
    Yup
  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    edited August 2018

    @SnakeSound222 said:
    Yes. It's now balanced.

    An ultra rare addon which has been nerfed down to 25% progress? that's why some killer main's balance ideas aren't being taken seriously.

  • SnakeSound222
    SnakeSound222 Member Posts: 4,467
    edited August 2018

    @Vietfox said:

    @SnakeSound222 said:
    Yes. It's now balanced.

    An ultra rare addon which has been nerfed down to 25% progress? that's why some killer main's balance ideas aren't being taken seriously.

    I wasn't talking about rarity dude. If we are going to talk about rarity, then it should be lowered to Very Rare.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    edited August 2018

    @SnakeSound222 said:

    @Vietfox said:

    @SnakeSound222 said:
    Yes. It's now balanced.

    An ultra rare addon which has been nerfed down to 25% progress? that's why some killer main's balance ideas aren't being taken seriously.

    I wasn't talking about rarity dude. If we are going to talk about rarity, then it should be lowered to Very Rare.

    I agree with being lowered to very rare, but it's still an ultra rare addon

  • Dustin
    Dustin Member Posts: 2,306
    edited August 2018

    Brand New Part nerf was necessary. Even though it's a rare occurrence starting a game and then 30 seconds later having 2-3 generators pop is awful. Because of that I'd often have a killer dodge the lobby if there was more than 2 toolboxes in the lobby. Personally I'd dodge if I saw 4 toolboxes because I got 4 man BNP'd one too many times when they were instant and if I don't have time to do anything I'm just not going to play with that lobby. There's no point.

    It was also stupidly easy to power through HEX: Ruin with a BNP so the only option would be to locate a survivor before they reached a generator but if there's more than one of them you can't deal with all of them. I do like how BNP doesn't consume the toolbox now. I feel like a lot of high tier addons should be consumable without destroying the main item component just with slight nerfs. I also don't see the price of BNP's being unfair either because at high character levels it's stupidly easy to stockpile them.

    Overall the changes to BNP were 100% justified and fair. I feel the same way about mori as well although I do feel Yellow Mori is kind of weak in comparison to the other two.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    I don't have an issue with the nerf per see, but with it being an Ultra Rare and being 7k is way too expensive. Making it a rare for like 5k would be more appropriate. You could then insure it has the same chances of spawning as other rares of that quality say Stypics in the bloodweb.

    I saw the numbers on the PTb and knew it'd be problematic but also knew that I could adapt to it. Before all killers ran Ruin which helped negate it and as well as overwhelming presence. There was also always some boob that would bring the killer right to me when using a BNP usually a Billy or Doctor.

  • Mister_xD
    Mister_xD Member Posts: 7,669
    edited August 2018

    decide for yourself.
    do you want to play a tense round of DbD, with a lot of action going on and you barely make it out, but feel great for doing so, or do you want an eZ win in less time than it takes you to even find a game?

    Post edited by Mister_xD on
  • Spiritbx
    Spiritbx Member Posts: 264
    Remember that you get to keep the toolbox now. That means that you have an instant 25% AND w/e toolbox you brought.
  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823

    @Spiritbx said:
    Remember that you get to keep the toolbox now. That means that you have an instant 25% AND w/e toolbox you brought.

    Not a big deal, most of BNPs were being used on brown toolboxes

  • Global
    Global Member Posts: 770

    yes free gens is crap even tho they are easy as hell to fix anyway.

  • Spiritbx
    Spiritbx Member Posts: 264
    Vietfox said:

    @Spiritbx said:
    Remember that you get to keep the toolbox now. That means that you have an instant 25% AND w/e toolbox you brought.

    Not a big deal, most of BNPs were being used on brown toolboxesThats the point. Now you can bring in a good toolbox and actually use it.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823

    @Spiritbx said:
    Vietfox said:

    @Spiritbx said:

    Remember that you get to keep the toolbox now. That means that you have an instant 25% AND w/e toolbox you brought.

    Not a big deal, most of BNPs were being used on brown toolboxesThats the point. Now you can bring in a good toolbox and actually use it.

    Okay

  • Master
    Master Member Posts: 10,200

    @Mister_xD said:
    decide for yourself.
    do you want to play a tense round of DbD, with a lot of action going on and you barely make it out, but feel great for doing so, or do you want an eZ win in less time than it takes you to even find a game?

    Survivors prefer the EZ win most of the time, at least thats my experience

  • Esheon
    Esheon Member Posts: 568
    Vietfox said:

    @SnakeSound222 said:
    Yes. It's now balanced.

    An ultra rare addon which has been nerfed down to 25% progress? that's why some killer main's balance ideas aren't being taken seriously.

    Killer main balance idea?

    The devs said "hey, we're going to do this", and everyone on the forums collectively went "hm, that was random". Killers had wanted a nerf, but I don't recall anyone on the forums suggesting the current version of the BNP.
  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Master said:

    @Mister_xD said:
    decide for yourself.
    do you want to play a tense round of DbD, with a lot of action going on and you barely make it out, but feel great for doing so, or do you want an eZ win in less time than it takes you to even find a game?

    Survivors prefer the EZ win most of the time, at least thats my experience

    Perhaps you need to come to PC then since most of us want a challenging game that's fair to both sides but without all the jerks.

  • Iceman
    Iceman Member Posts: 1,457

    Yes. Mori should also be switched to requiring 2 hooks before use.

    Where is the fun in that? You might as well just put them on their last hook if that is the case. 
  • Master
    Master Member Posts: 10,200

    @powerbats said:

    @Master said:

    @Mister_xD said:
    decide for yourself.
    do you want to play a tense round of DbD, with a lot of action going on and you barely make it out, but feel great for doing so, or do you want an eZ win in less time than it takes you to even find a game?

    Survivors prefer the EZ win most of the time, at least thats my experience

    Perhaps you need to come to PC then since most of us want a challenging game that's fair to both sides but without all the jerks.

    Sadly I am on PC and a lot of survivors I face as killer prefer the easy mode.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Master said:

    Sadly I am on PC and a lot of survivors I face as killer prefer the easy mode.

    I don't really run into that except for the rank 15-20 range and sometimes lower. But the 1-5 range is usually pretty good but realistically unless you're at 1-2 you still get the jerks so to speak.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823

    @Esheon said:
    Vietfox said:

    @SnakeSound222 said:

    Yes. It's now balanced.

    An ultra rare addon which has been nerfed down to 25% progress? that's why some killer main's balance ideas aren't being taken seriously.

    Killer main balance idea?

    The devs said "hey, we're going to do this", and everyone on the forums collectively went "hm, that was random". Killers had wanted a nerf, but I don't recall anyone on the forums suggesting the current version of the BNP.

    If you click on "show previous quotes" you'll see the guy who i replied saying "Yes. It's now balanced."

  • HeroLives
    HeroLives Member Posts: 1,985
    Needed the nerf, but was too heavy of a nerf. Avidly go out of my way to no longer buy them if at all possible.I view them now as a waste of bp. 
  • Boss
    Boss Member Posts: 13,616

    Absolutely.

  • pauloandrade22
    pauloandrade22 Member Posts: 697

    Was to strong .

  • JovialCub
    JovialCub Member Posts: 88

    My opinion, is that they looked at numbers for game length and use of parts. They collected data and analyzed the numbers with statistics. They decided that the numbers revealed that the impact being made was too far outside the standard deviation of expected performance.

    The original brand new part instantly completed the entire gen with no skill checks required. Obviously outside the realistic game play experience we know today. It needed a change.

  • DocOctober
    DocOctober Member Posts: 2,230

    Yes it was necessary. A single BNP would complete 20 % of the Survivors' objective in 10-20 seconds. That is simply too strong.

    That would be pretty much equal to the Killer having something that would allow them to sacrifice a Survivor on the first Hook (something the original Memento Moris used to do, but that was nerfed).

  • jiminie
    jiminie Member Posts: 200

    Necessary? Yes
    Too harsh? Definitely