Genuine Question: What Does the Game Even Expect From Me here??
Let me set the scene:
Dwight is dead, I've got two Claudettes on hooks, and a Nea MIA. Nea saves Claud 1, I come back and purposely choose to down Nea instead of Claud 1, and hook her. Claud 1 saves Claud 2. I run into Claud 1 and pursue, she saves Nea in front of me and I down Claud 1. I pick her up...
And DS happens. I genuinely don't have the slightest idea what the "right" play was here. I went out of my way to pursue the one who had been off the hook the longest amount of time, but gg ez killer you tunneled anyway. I genuinely don't know what the game expected me to do there, I went for the "fairest" plays I could and still the anti-tunnel perk smacked me for it.
What was I supposed to do here?
Comments
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That's entirely the point of why DS is still busted and not an anti-tunnel perk. It punishes you for playing well even when you didn't tunnel. It's a 60 second abusable invulnerability perk.
Why we haven't changed DS to deactivate once you do any action other than running/vaulting/pallet dropping etc the world will never know. The survivor should be having to decide if he thinks he's safe enough and not being tunneled to start working on the objective or making a save.
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Honestly I'd change it to "lasts 60 seconds or when someone else is hooked after you are unhooked, whichever happens first." If it's truly supposed to be an anti-tunnel perk, then turn it off when it's clear the killer isn't tunneling. As is, it's like, here I am being as nice as I'm capable of being as a murderer and the game has decided it's not nice enough! It's not my fault that Nea went down quickly (well, seeing as I have MYC it kind of was but I digress), but here I am actively letting Claud 2 get a moment off the hook and it bites me in the ass.
Admittedly I have used DS in maybe 3 games ever in my countless survivor games, so I'm definitely of the opinion it's not a "must have" perk, but even so - if it could be in play I do my damndest to be nice and not tunnel - hell, even if there's no obsession I STILL try to not tunnel because I know when I'm surviving it's not fun getting tunneled. But here I am doing everything but letting them make a full recovery, not slugging, etc...and the game's just decided I was too mean of a killer, five second time out. Just gets frustrating when it's clear to anyone that looks I'm not doing what the perk is intended to counter. If I do tunnel someone by accident, sure, I get it, DS me and let's go. When I'm making the nicest options available...
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I am pretty sure that the Devs have recently mentioned on the forums that it they never labeled DS as an anti-tunnel perk. Players were the ones who bestowed that title upon it. I guess it is just an over powered perk that forces you to slug. One of them did mention that they are looking into ways to make it more difficult to abuse. They're probably stocking up on potatoes before they reveal any changes in preparation for all the salt they are going to get.
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Slug claud 1 and nea. It sucks for nea but not your fault she got cocky with her DS. Leave them both for a sec and hunt for the final claud. It's not fun for the survivors to be in that position but it's all down to that claud not respecting the killer by unhooking straight up in your face. There is a reason safe unhooking is an actual thing in terms of BP and game points. Because of her decision the last of her team would basically be out of action as a final claud is left hiding, hoping you don't find her.
It's really rare for them to have unbreakable. If you can't find the final claud or she gets away and you want to give up chase. Return to them. DS is normally gone by then and the nea who was off first will probably have crawled off entirely to the corner of the map where she will most likely be healed by the other claud eventually.
That would be my solution. It's not a perfect solution. I personally always thought DS should be an actual visible weapon item. Like a knife or glass shard but they changed it to this perk instead. I don't have issue with it because as a rule I always persue multiple downs or injuries then hook.
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Devs have stated DS is not considered an anti tunnel perk. Which in my opinion makes it worse. They basically gave survivors an abusable FU perk.
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I've played the game long enough to remember the original DS (albeit post duration nerf), which effectively turned the game into "hey, you know how you need to down people up to 12 times to win? Try 16!" The nerfs and reworks to it have turned it into a perk, that, whether the devs meant to do it or not, discourages tunneling. That being said, if it's not intended to be an anti-tunnel then I strongly question why they're ok having a "survivor can do no wrong for a minute after being unhooked" perk. I'd love a "killer can do no wrong once a match for a minute after hooking a survivor" perk...but as is, it's just one more reason why I don't put DS in my own builds...too much potential for abuse.
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The game expects you to lose.
You can just slug everything in sight, though. That's the counter to a lot of the current meta.
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That is why when I play against obvious swf, I have no reservations with tunneling and slugging. I just wish we could tell 100% that they're a swf in the lobby so I can best prepare myself with my best Killer and add-ons. It's only fair since they get the advantage of communication and coordination.
They would never do that since swf would cry about it.
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God I hated old DS. But I could of tolerated it if it was an ultra rare item myself. At least it would of had rarity, be visible to killers and could be depleted.
It's dumb. Yeah. I agree. but dumb stuff that grant an advantage is a part of the game of DBD. Same with exposure or moris. This is mostly because the game is so perk reliant-and frankly over stuffed with perks- while being very, very under developed in literally every other way such as stuff on maps, offerings and items ectr ectr. In some cases add ons-eg: bubba- I don't see DS getting removed, mostly because getting unhooked even safely sort of cause a ring of easily tracked down death for the unhooked. Even for good survivors.
It's dumb but perks kind of band aid that problem. But then again the ruin band aid was ripped off. So who knows.
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Keeping Claudette slugged. Sounds pretty easy to me.
But of course you can also open Thread 3000 about DS because you are not patient enough.
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DS is not an Anti-tunnel Perk and what did you expect? Only because you got one sacrificed and 2 on hook the game should go easy on you?
That Claudette used a powerful one-time use perk to save Nea, you could have easily predicted that Perk and slugged or just take the stun and then go into chasing, Claudette now can’t use DS again. There are toxic uses of DS but this does not seem like one of it.
also you stated you were doing the „right thing“ when you decided to go for Nea as to not tunnel... but the devs have stated many times that tunneling is a legit strategy, and it has been proven to be very rewarding..
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It's obviously to have a stopwatch on standby to start when someone is unhooked and you can know when it's safe to hook them again.
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I mean in that scenario you slug
Or you know just take the DS
DS is not an insta loss. I bet you still wiped the floor with them after the DS
I agree that DS is a trouble perk but people tend to be a bit overdramatic about it sometime
DS by it's nature is an anti momentum perk but by the sounds of it you already had so much momentum that it really didn't matter
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(@csandman1977 ) Yeah, they said it came from the community, but referred to the Q&A about the DS change, saying "this is the only time it was said", and this is pretty much the initial callout to be an anti tunnel perk. That wasn't raised by the players (article linked, screenshot of the relevant part below)
Beneath that: the game didn't expect anything from you. We simply just can wait until it gets fixed or accept that this perk is a pretty powerful offensive weapon for survivors, not a passive protection perk
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Killers just don't have counters to all these superhuman perks
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So, hear me out, we just run a slugging Spirit build. Suddenly, no more DS. I think that is the best solution 😂
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