NOED is not OP, but that doesn't mean it's fine
It's just bad game design. Teaches killers to play poorly and wait for a massive reward. In my opinion it should lose its hex status and be toned down massively, or give a permanent 5% increase in speed and perhaps a 15% successful hit cooldown without the ability to one shot survivors.
I know survivors have many more broken asf perks, but please try to remain on topic. There are other discussions for DS, BT, etc. Hope y'all having a nice day.
Comments
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Teaches survivors to cleanse totems. Cleanse those totems, people!
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I agree that NOED isn't healthy for the game and it's effect can be very frustrating if used paired with certain strategies. I would suggest to rework it into a perk that causes entity to block the exit gates with a few more additional effects if it remains a hex.
That beiing said Decisive strike has right now exactly the same design, promoting player to do stupid ######### that would normally get them killed and people still defend it and call that it's fine and balanced sooo 🤷
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But you see, that's always been the one counter when people bring up the fact it's a bad perk. Looking for totems is an awful solution cause it's even LESS engaging than repairing.
I've always been down for a second FUN objective to give killers more time, almost ANYTHING will do (fuel for gens, getting gen parts, whatever) but looking for totems is generally just a waste of time until it's too late. No single perk should give a team a chance to 180 the game entirely.
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Noed is terrible designed. Besides that the rewards the failure of the killer to Eliminate 4 survivors before all gens are done, it also is only punishing solo survivors. Swf who want to win WILL cleanse the totems in the most efficient way possible due communicating the counter.
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Let's not forget the deadly noed, mori facecamp combo.
Killer facecamps.
Killer mains: "rush gens"
Also killer mains: "cleanse totems"
But yeah can't do both at the same time. Either you get picked up one by one when trying to cleanse all totems or you die all at the end due to noed
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So you get all the gens done and deserve to escape ? Got it.
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I've had a 4-man escape after rushing gens and cleansing totems. NOED didn't even trigger. Red rank killer, too.
Now this is the part where you tell me the killer was just bad/boosted.
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Yes.
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Yeah thats a 4-man not a regular group of solos. Most solo games I play in you don't have much time to cleanse the totems by yourself, and I can't trust my teammates to do them either.
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I said a 4-man escape. I was playing with one friend and the other two were solos.
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So make the perk absolute trash just so nobody will use it and pretend it isnt just making another throw away killer perk...interesting idea
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Sure you did. You are just better than everyone else.
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I'm not, and therein lies the problem: all I see are survivors who refuse to cleanse totems, then complain they got hit with NOED. It's like killers camping and then complaining they got gen rushed.
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I understand what you are saying, but I don't get why you said ""wait for a massive reward", because that is calling out every end game perk like blood warden or remember me which can be used effectively.
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Not all end game perks are unhealthy just because NOED is, blood warden rewards playing well for example.
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So when I do 3 or 4 totems which is already terribly boring I go down because my team didn't do the last one? There should be more incentives because so far barely anyone is touching totems.
Noed is a fine perk...for boosted noobs. Free hook for participation
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NOED is fine. Especially for an endgame setup.
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Still most solo groups don't have enough time to search the map for totems. Literally just played a game where only got done because my teammates kept floating around the hook when the killer was patrolling it.
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It's bad game design that's a direct result of the bad game design of survivor perks, though. You can't have a conversation about one without the other.
You're right, there should be no perks that serve as after-the-fact "gotcha" cards that just artificially flip the script after the opposition does what they're supposed to do. However, NOED is a weird one to complain about as it's pretty much the only killer perk to do this in the face of stackable second-chance perks that don't have totems to be cleared on survivors.
It doesn't teach killers to wait until all the gens are completed moreso than it just gives them a reason to keep playing when they run into survivor teams with each one essentially running 2-3 "survivor NOEDs" that you can't really do anything about. If you're running into a bunch of games where survivors just won't go down no matter what you do, or gens just feel too fast and the game is more one of just staring at survivors teabagging at the exit after being gifted their win by their perks - well, that's when a killer runs NOED. It's a dumb perk that doesn't do anything for you all game until you've already lost, but when every game starts to feel like you've already lost before the game begins then it starts to increase in value.
When I run into matches with multiple survivors running all these take-backsie perks and playing like idiot bullies because the game rewards that kind of behavior I usually end up just giving up and either memeing or actually atl-tabbing and AFKing the last half of the match. I could get sweaty and tryhard but I'd rather de-pip and get to some level where the game is fun to play. If I'm running NOED (rare) and they haven't cleared the totem (rarer) I'll usually keep going cause I'm finally allowed to fight cheese with cheese. I suppose it works pretty well for the camper killers looking for the altruistic 4ks, but other than that it's just a frustration perk that gives the killer the rare opportunity to do to survivors what survivors do to killers all game long, if survivors let it activate.
NOED's not a well designed perk, but it's really a symptom and not the disease.
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I say just make it so at the start of the game, the survivors are notified that the killer has it, and they get a totem counter next to it. that way it punishes bad teamplay while giving the survivors the necessary to remove it. and Killer mains, if you feel like complaining about this, think. if they work to cleanse all the totems, that's less time on gens.
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This. NOED isn't a problem if you do this.
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Honestly, it's fine. NOED is only a good perk because of the MS. The instadown doesn't mean jack tbh. But yeah, it's in a good spot, it punishes survivors for not cleaning totems and is easily avoided.
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NOED is actually a perk that has the power level every Hex perk should have. Hex the third seal is for example a complete Joke of a Hex perk. Another good example of A good Hex perk is devour hope.
My change for noed is that in the beginning of the game one random dull totem is chosen to be the Hex of noed. If survivors cleanse this totem they dont have to worry about the perk during the endgame. This means survivors dont have to cleanse all the dull totems to actually remove Noed after the gens are completed.
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As a solo survivor I see this happen pretty often. There really aren't many spawn points, you play enough and you find them fairly easily. People just ignore totems that are right next to them, rather risk getting downed with NOED and complain than take 14 seconds to cleanse.
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Another "crutch perk complain"... I guess you can put it into the oxford dictionary, that not every killer that runs NOED is bad by habit and still able to learn to get better with each and every game, but people will still parrot "crutch perk, crutch perk" til the end of times...
Did we have an Adrenaline-NOED standoff in this thread already? Didn't bring up the motivation to read the answers yet -.-
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