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Devs, Please For The Love Of God Get Rid Of Keys And Moris.
Does anyone actually like them? I see them every other game, whether I'm playing killer or survivor. Not just that, but they are a constant topic on these forums. They listened to the Billy changes, why not these?
Comments
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I want them to remove keys and ebony moris from the game.
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Players hate this because it's something unexpected.
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This is not a poll. Also moris are way more broken than keys, so it's annoying they get lumped together. Both do need a nerf, though.
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They should be lumped together. They both grant a free and lazy win, no matter how much you outplay either side.
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Moris allow an easy 4k (or 3k + hatch escape) even in matches the killer has no business winning. Keys usually just turn a 4k into a 3k, and even then they're harder to use than a mori. You're still vulnerable to Franklin's, tunneling, moris, etc. It's a rare game when multiple survivors escape with a key.
Moris are also way more common in the bloodweb than keys. I'll typically get like 8-10 moris en route to level 50 but only 2-4 keys.
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No, you can absolutely destroy the survivors, but what do you know? 2 or 1 gens left and they both escape with a key. In fact if there is 1 gen left 3 people can escape. At least you have to hook the survivor, which takes more skill than holding a button down.
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My bad, I marked it wrong.
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It much easier to mori someone as killer than to use a key as survivor, even if you're with a SWF buddy with a map. And, when you mori someone, it makes a much bigger impact on the final result of the game than escaping with a key. I play both sides and it really blows my mind that people get this up in arms about keys. If you really don't like it, just bring Franklin's or a mori and tunnel the person with the key. Individual survivors have much less of a say in when they can use a key. You can play 100% optimally, but if you end up having a potato in your lobby your only option is going to be waiting for the EGC, and in the EGC you already have a decent chance of getting hatch even without a key.
The other thing is, even if two survivors escape with a key, the killer is probably not going to depip. They may well even pip if they played well throughout the match. If you get moried it is extremely likely that you'll depip.
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S'all good dude :)
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Franklins? So you can pick the item up again? Anyways, both need a hard nerf. I think you can see why they are lumped together though.
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Franklin's is being buffed so they can't pick it back up if you don't want them to. And, regardless, if they're wasting time running around the map to grab their key, they're probably going to get destroyed. They could just leave it on the ground and pick it up at the end if they're in a SWF (until 4.1.0 goes live), but people typically don't if they're playing with randos because they don't want to risk a teammate coming along and taking their key.
I do see why they're lumped together, but I don't think they should be on the same tier of concern for the devs. I consider keys strong but borderline fair, while (non-yellow) moris seem clearly OP. Bringing a key also hurts you a bit because you can't use another useful item during the match, while a mori just replaces an offering slot that's usually used for extra BPs. Pretty much every other offering in the game has no or almost no impact on the outcome of the game, so moris being this strong really feels like an outlier.
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I lump them together for a few reasons. First being that they both help either side accomplish they're goals with far less effort than usual. Second being that they are kinda on the same scale. An ebony mori is far worse than any key but keys are more consistent. For example, a pink mori is far stronger than a pink key, but a green key is far stronger than a green mori. If that makes sense.
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I'd personally rather have a green mori as killer than a purple key as survivor! Tunnel that first guy and get an easy win :D
I do see where you're coming from, though.
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I disagree, but thats just me. Its also worth considering that there can be multiple keys in play, and you can pick items up. Then theres SWF, we all know how that goes.
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I saw kate with a key in the lobby last night, while I was prepping for my Wraith daily. So I turned on an Ebony mori. They spawned within feet of a generator of course, while I had to go find them. I hooked her first. her team swarmed the hook. I downed her after the unhook. then I downed the savior Nea. I walk back to mori the key-holding Kate. she DC'd.
in the results screen, I notice she had both unbreakable and Decisive Strike. so what was the counter to this?
Please note that "let the survivor go" is not a legitimate counter. Unless the counter to Overcharge is "don't do gens."
I fact, i propose an overcharge rework. Any time a killer kicks a generator, they get a DS style skill check. If they succeed, the next person to touch that generator before it regresses to zero is instantly downed by a bolt of electricity shooting out. And this works up to 4 times, to match the possibility of 4 DS users per match.
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I don't have a problem with them. And this shouldn't be here if it's not a poll. Should be in a general discussion thread
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Yeah, I marked it wrong. Unfortunately editing won't let me change it. And by not having a problem do you mean you never see them? Or do you mean you don't see a problem with them?
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I don't see a problem with them to take them out. I do see them, just not all the time to warrant wanting to get rid of them
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I have had plenty of matches where keys allow for a 4k to turn into a 1k. The common excuse of that they have to do gens does not work because 3 of them usually get done within the first minute or so. Which means if they either find a key or bring them in, that means there is a high risk of them just leaving because the game is too hard for them. Not only this, they get over 5000 points for escaping via hatch. There is no downside to a key like there is with a mori.
Not only that, but as someone with less than perfect eyesight, I can't see keys in the lobby. They blend in too well. Where moris are essentially announced.
Moris have to have the work of chasing, downing, and actually deciding to use them. And Moris give you less points, and take away the ability to use pressure perks, like Pop, Thana, etc. Not only do Moris discourage a killer from using them in that way, but also get the killers hate-mail for using even an ivory. And they are locked in an animation, during which survivors can decide if they want to use said key.
There are between 1-3 red options in a bloodweb for any given killer. There are 5 red options for survivor, and 10 purple ones (Items and addons). The chance to get a key from these are 1/3rd chance for killer, 1/5 for survivor (for a red key), and 1/10 for a purple key.
Of course moris would be more common just because there are less options to choose from. And keys are still relatively common/easy to get. Dont forget that plunderers exists to raise that chance higher than how easy it already is.
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I think that the key is the most unbalanced thing in this game
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keys usually turn 4k into 1k or 2k if the killers lucky
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If three gens are popping a minute into the game you might want to change your perks and/or your strategy lol. That does have to be rough to not see keys in the lobby, though, and I'm not sure what to really suggest for that other than making sure your resolution isn't downscaled if you're on PC (assuming your PC can handle full resolution).
I'm not sure where you're getting those stats on ultra rares in a given bloodweb, but those numbers are way too high. Most bloodwebs I don't get a single ultra rare. Are those stats for level 50 bloodwebs? I can't really speak to that because I almost never buy from level 50 bloodwebs; I'd rather save the BPs for prestiges.
If you're killing someone with a mori, that's going to do way more good for you than missing out on 0-2 pops or 0-4% slowdown from Thanatophobia. You're definitely likely to get salty survivors in the lobby for using one though, 100% agreed. It's in the game though and you're entitled to use it. I usually save all of my moris to do dailies so I have that "excuse", but you can also just leave the lobby to not need to deal with it.
I guess as killer I just don't really care if the last survivor is going to escape through the hatch, which is usually all a key does. At that point the match is already basically over. I've already gotten my points and I'm also probably going to pip. If the last survivor escapes, oh well, they may have gotten out anyway in the EGC and I get to requeue. It happens. As survivor, though, if I see a teammate get moried like 3-5 minutes into the match (which the killer can really do whenever they feel like it - just tunnel the first guy you down) I feel completely different because at that point the game is pretty much over unless the killer is a potato. Even if it's a green mori, killing a survivor that early is a massive benefit to the killer and will probably have a big effect on the outcome of the match. If it's an ebony, even more so. For any survivors you moried early, they're probably going to get like 5-10k points max and will almost certainly depip. Their teammates are also likely to struggle to pip, and they could risk depipping too if the killer's good and/or they make mistakes.
Pretty much the only way a mori doesn't have a big impact on the match is if the killer messes up. Either they get looped for 3-4 gens and don't even have a shot to use it until the gates are getting powered, or they're just losing a little bit and they try to follow the survivor rule book and hook everyone once before using the mori. If the killer starts average to strong or they're willing to camp and tunnel, they can get a quick mori with regularity and destroy the survivors' chances of escaping.
Keys are much harder to use regularly. Killers will often bring Franklins and tunnel you if they see you have a key. If killers start snowballing you probably won't get a chance to use the key at all. Even if you make it to the end of the game with the key, you still need to find the closed hatch before the killer can find and hook you, which is not a gimme. Killer tracking perks and the sheer size of the map that you need to comb over to find a closed hatch can make that hard to pull off.
Plunderer's is a fair way to find keys here and there, agreed, but if you're regularly searching chests just to find a key, you're essentially just paying forward your chance at a hatch escape. In other words, searching chests is usually a waste of time that hurts your team, so your results are going to suffer just for the chance at getting a key, which may or may not be something that helps you survive.
The other benefit of moris over keys is that they're offerings. Offerings are usually just for BPs. If they affect the game, it's almost always something tiny like adding mist or moving hooks a bit closer together. Moris are a glaring exception to that, and still allow the killer to use whatever add-ons they'd like. Meanwhile, if you're using a key, that means you're giving up the chance to benefit from more useful items and add-ons throughout the match. Keys of course give some aura reading if you have the right add-ons so they're not useless in the match, but usually the effect is just a crappy version of Bond. The ring is actually a great add-on for solo queue and the ember is situational but occasionally useful. Regardless though, Keys are just nowhere near as functional as something like a good medkit.
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I'm glad you don't have to deal with them. I made this post after I got a 4k stolen from me and next match I got moried. I was a little worked up, to say the least.
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If that's happening to you a lot, that's probably on you as the killer. Occasionally, yes, survivors will be able to pull this off. I can't remember the last time I've had three people escape through the hatch against me as killer, though. If it happened to me with any kind of regularity, I'm sure I'd be saying the same as you. It just doesn't.
The most common outcome is that they don't even get to use the key. Either they die before they find the hatch or they just escape through the exit gate or open hatch during the EGC. Next most common is that one person escapes with the key, and usually before the EGC (think a situation where two survivors are left and one is hooked - especially if they're injured or on death hook, the other one will often try to find the hatch instead of going for the save). Occasionally you'll see a duo get out together, but it's usually pretty easy to prevent that because they usually telegraph their intentions with the map + key combo.
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With Ebony mori it is very broken (along with the perk tombstone) Ebony should be “Kill any two survivors who are on death hook” and tombstone should be removed outright due to it being a free Ebony mori from full health. As for Key’s maybe instead of you opening it right away make it where you just complete two or three skill checks to open the hatch.
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The most common is to get out the hatch but i seen 3 a lot lately
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