swf should not be in the game
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The cognitive dissonance of saying SWF isn't that big of a deal and then turning around and saying killers would dodge swf lobbies to such an extent that it would kill the game is nothing but astounding. I truly do wonder how some of these people are even intellectually capable of sustaining the act of breathing.
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Even if I'm a killer main and I know how it feels to go against red ranks 4 man SWF and sweaty gen rushers, I think SWFs are actually good for the game.
Because you know, I have tried to play survivor some time, and playing solo is kinda boring. It's not the same as playing killer where you are the whole team yourself, because when you play solo survivor you depend on other people.
So teaming up with your friends can be more fun than going solo.
Once in this forum I found a guy that changed my mind about SWFs. With a really simple explanation. I'll make it short here.
There are basically 2 types of SWFs:
- Just friends playing together and having fun: when you play killer you won't even notice this type of SWFs and they will appear to you like solo survivors. Unless of course, you find some weird behavior like healing together the whole time, they are saving them together the whole time...you know. Sometimes you can notice because when you are almost about to kill somebody, their friend gets angry and crazy.
- Sweaty SWAT 4 man red rank teams: these kind of SWFs are the real problem. They are usually gods at looping and gods at gen rushing. You pretty much have no option against them, unless you are playing with a god tier killer with god tier perks and you are in a good map for that killer. Also, their mistakes will determine whether you win or not against these type of monster SWFs (by winning, I mean getting a ruthless or a merciless, if you are good killer main you play for scoring, not kills).
The last type are the real problem in this game.
Even tho, I REALLY think that the game should show the killer which people exactly are teamed up with who. That's useful information.
And I don't think killers will just easily dodge, unless they find a 4 man SWF with tons of hours at the game. And this is rare.
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A seperation would only cause longer q-times which now are even too long.
A question have you ever played solo survivor?
Doomed to failure are you kidding me? Swf is around for a couple of years and the playerbase is growing not declining.
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yes, I play solo. And I think this is the best format for this kind of games.
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Alright then you know how rarly it happens to get decent mates.
Its fine when you are a low rank but in high ranks its beyond frustrating.
I just want to play with people i know and dont want to rely on some random who thinks its better to urban evade in a corner than saving me from the hook.
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Just make it so a duo SWF you get 3 perks, 3-man 2 perks, and 4 man SWF each get 1 perk. Solved.
With comms you effectively get roughly 4-6 perks for free.
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The main reason the game is still here so far and not dead is thanks to SWF, that's something you cannot deny.
It was a need to gather people.
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When you play with non-random people, you leave the killer no chance, and there is no intrigue either. This game is not considered fair.
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If this is really your opinion then, no offense, you are not good enough and need to get better in order to win.
There are a really small percentage of swf groups you have no chance against but the majority are beatable.
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People don't want to linger in the game. Solo mode is killed, killing game is not interesting. Only swf is happy.
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You probably haven't read the posts before. I have experience with solo, swf and killer. I know what I'm talking about. In SWF I win 9 games out of 10, in solo I win 1 game out of 10. SWF almost always wins.
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I don't know what your SWF experience is. But I challenge you to revisit it and play again.
I do not think that killers DC frequently because of SWF. I have played nearly 2K hours and I have only seen about 5 killer DCs and some of those were in solo.
Yes, there are advantages that SWF have over solo, but as someone who plays both, I think there are advantages solo survivors have over SWF.
- Solo survivors do not have to deal with the extra layer of distraction that comes with people talking in your ear.
- Solo survivors do not have to deal with the challenges in communication that can come from folks who don't speak when playing SWF, speak with thick accents, communicate poorly, are verbally antagonistic, are verbal know-it-alls, etc.
- Solo survivors don't have the added pressure of altruism or objectives that come with people on comms. They can choose not to save and they don't hear about it. They can choose to focus on a challenge at the cost of the team's objectives without hearing about it instantly.
- Solo survivors can more easily DC without hearing about it. Try that in SWF when you still have hooks left and see where that gets you.
I could go on. It's all about perspective.
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They are not going to punish players for playing with their friends. No way. Great way to damage your player base.
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This is such a dumb question. If they removed SWF, it would kill the game, and the SWF that would stay in the gane would constantly dodge lobbies until they met up with each other, which would increase queue times significantly. Back then when DBD didn't have a SWF mode, the game was actually dying.
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It is different because you say so? Explanation please. There are several asym games like Friday 13th, Evolve, RE: Resistance, Deceit or Left4Dead that all have a teamup lobby. Any good counter examples of asym games that don't have? Or why DBD is different from the industry?
But I think this thread does not really encourage discussion. I see a lot of arguments against removing SWF and the only response is always the same "SWF stomps killers, no other opinions accepted". I still believe that the SWF argument is simply a loose attempt to justify a loss. Happened often enough that I was accused being in an SWF while I wasn't
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While I firmly believe that there should be Solo play and Team Play and ranked and set different.... another option would simply be that if people enter a lobby as a group it adds +1 Gen required to open the gates if there are (3) in the group, and +2 Gens if there are (4).
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why don't you understand that SWF is tipping the scales very strongly towards survival? Killer upgrades become useless. Why do you support SWF so much?
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I wonder how fast the players will leave the game, 60% leave? 70%?
no game should restrict you from playing with your friends in any way, shape, or form
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Then why is it a problem to give the killers who dont want to play against them the ability to know about swfs?
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You had enough examples from other opinions already. There were stats end of 2018 about survival rate of SWF and solos and there were barely 10% difference. There IS a difference, but it is not the 90 to 10 gap that you promote. SWF is not the drill team you expect it to be, also mentioned several times. A god SWF team is also capable to stomp killers without comms, by simply wall hugging and looping killers into oblivion. And if you have 4 of these, it is simply a win for survivors. Everyone knows it.
SWF is not automatically boosting teams to god level, it is about 10% max. Knowing about totem spots? Doesn't matter when no Hex is used. Knowing about where the killer is? Efficiency is not necessarily boosted by knowig where the killer is, but by "not hearing the TR".
I could also ask you "why don't you understand". It is a slight boost, but not a game changer. There are enough examples and numbers to show the difference. All you give for proove is your 90% 10% example which I for once highly question and second, from killer POV, is mostly just an assumption trying to justify a loss.
Btw you did not say anything about "this game is not industrial standard". Agreed that this was BS?
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Resistance is far from balanced lol. Just wanted to say that. More unbalanced then dbd for sure
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I agree slightly. I just played a solo match and I got hooked, the gens were all done and what did I get a sweaty red rank SWF tbagging me while I was on the hook and refusing to get me off of it because and I quote "i tried to kill his team mates" funny i remember saving 2 of them, cleansing totems, doing gens and taking the killer for a run...... some SWF players are extra toxic and basically just enjoy everyone's fun
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I had a team like that. they let me die on the first hook, because a) i brought a key and they wanted it, and b) i hadn´t worked with them on gens.
and that was true, because i kept the killer occupied for 3+ minutes, until he finally got me and hooked me when they poped the 4th gen.
But not working on gens didn´t contribute, as it seems.
You ignore the fact that the difference is excactly when you here the tr of the killer. Because the swf know they are still save, while the solo played does not know.
Still, the devs want a balance about 50% survival. SWF got 60%, so obviously killer needs to be buffed, if swf is in 70% of the games, because survivors are overperforming.
I, personaly, have a solo surviving rate of 70%. And when i played swf, it was actually more around 90 (but i only kept records for my solo games, so i don´t know for sure, just an estimate)
That seems way above the 50% survival rate, so killers need a serious buff anyway.
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And maybe you ignore the fact that "true" red ranks don't get scared by every TR. They stay on a gen, know their paths to know when they need to run and still safely reach the next window or pallet. Besides the fact that this is why pretty much every second to third solo survivor runs Spinechill.
We can discuss if SWF with bad survivors get more benefit than stronger survivors. But even weaker survivors do not suddenly turn into monster gen rushers. It is not unlikely that weaker survivors still run into the wrong direction and don't get where exactly the gen is that your mate is sitting on. Weak survivors don't have maps of each trial open on their second screen and know perfectly where they are. Just as example
To the percentage: they never reached this on point, this is an overall problem, not a SWF problem. It is simply wrong to say "remove SWF" to adress survival rates. Btw as I remember, survival rates were around 40-50%, not 50-60%. With killers like Freddy or "old nurse" having a killrate of near 70%. These are old stats of course, but just as a snapshot of how it was. And SWF was not a new invention at that time. The main thing they changed adressing survival rate was the Ruin rework, which went over the top I guess, because shortly after we had a lot of killer changes and map reworks (favouring killers)
Your personal survival rate may differ, but if we do a poll, I guess we will also see a lot of other opinions. And therefore I would rely on the behaviour stats rather than single opinions. Not offending, but a single number is never a good representation
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Because queue times already take forever with killers lobby dodging items.. We don't to give people another reason to lobby dodge and increase queue times
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But you increase queue times if less people play killer and more survivor instead. Why is that better?
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I'm a killer main, and i dont mind to play against swf (well except for the 4 Claudette with FL/TB squad cause...its obvious theyre gonna be toxic)
And i think its actually fun, SWF aint the problem, the thing is that killers cant have enough pressure everywhere with only 1 objective for them to do: gens
So most of the killers release pressure on the swf squads rather then other things.
Beside i said "when you read the forums" cause even there its still a minority of people that either seeks answers, or are mad at everything. Im rather sure that a lot of people dont actually mind going against swf, it would only suck to be forced to choose 1 queue out of another for the waiting time, resulting in solo players leaving the game or forcing them to find a group, so it would change...almost nothing
As i said i dont even check their steams, i dont care if they swf or not, i wanna play the game.
Beside if you made another queue for the groups, with only stronger killers, it would just give a bad time for weaker survivors or newer players that wanna learn the game with friends or play with friends?
Oh and before you ask, i also play survivor, i also play either solo or in swf with 2-4 friends ans its actually through this way that i learned the game and got into it, and no we dont win all the game nor loose all the game, we wanna have fun thats all.
A video game should be about fun.
Not about freaking out because someplayers wanna play with their friends
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I understand. Better to delete this game and never come back if the users themselves do not want fair matches. good luck with the game.
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The games balanced around Rank 20s, therefore Rank 1s have no place in this game. Saying otherwise is just lies.
So what's your point?
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