keys and moris
any dates on when they'll be fixed, keys are kinda getting on me nerves
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What exactly is the problem with both?
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I wasn't aware of an issue with either, unless its intermittant.
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Well keys are basically a free escape. For example, imagine you have two survivors left, there are three gens done. They can just find the hatch and dip out. Would you not feel robbed in that situation if you were the killer?
Mori's are similar in that a survivor's life can be cut in half when a killer simply one hooks mori's. Especially if they tunnel for it. Both need drastic changes or to be removed altogether.
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Don't you need surv + 1 gens done to escape with a key? Not to mention the randomness of spawning the hatch at an easily visible spot.
If you're tunneling for a mori, that's 60 seconds of wasted time for the killer, and that's just phase one.
I play both killer and survivor, so I don't really see any problems with it, since I don't use them.
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keys are a free get out of jail free card when survivors are losing. moris are basically 2 hook kills. both are unbalanced
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not by half. you still need 2 downs. So 33% less. And not free either, getting 60% of the objective done doesn't seem free.
The main problem about keys and Moris is entitled people bitching around.
The only thing that is annoying is, when you are on SWF and need to wait for your mates for 10 minutes or when you go for a killer adept and pretty much deserved it but get your stupid double pip (killer only) requirement dumped by a key. But that is just my opinion
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60 percent is still not all of their objective. they failed to get all the gens done, but the key gives them a way out that they wouldn't have had without it. Personally my issue is if you get yourselves as a team in a sticky situation then your team should be punished ( 3 gen is an example). hence why i dislike keys. as for moris i feel like they are just a offering that makes it where you only have to down someone twice instead of the usual 3. which is why personally i dislike it. its a crutch for you not being able to catch that person a third time
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I don't really see the problem with them. If I see a survivor using a key, I will go after them instead of maybe another survivor because getting rid of the key is more important than letting more gens get done while a survivor is running around with a key. It's mainly the fact ebony mori's don't really have much of a counter besides skill and luck. I feel like mori's are still okay because of the fact if the killer kills somebody on first hook, they will most likely be losing too many points, making cypresses and ivory moris better in general because they may end up depipping or not pipping up at all because of it.
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I seem to recall several posts and comments that they're getting reworked.. here we are September 2020 no date or ETA.
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Both Moris and Keys allow their respective sides to finish their objective much faster without any downside (No, needing someone to die for the hatch to spawn earlier isn't a downside) and are both very capable of just completely shutting down any amount of momentum the other side may have.
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You wont get dates or ETAs from BHVR. If they are about to change them, they will release a Developer Update or something like that. But they wont say "We will change Keys and Moris near the End of 2020" because this community would riot from July to December, if nothing is announced.
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So the riots simply continue without any kind of timeline? Kk.
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I did not say it is all of their objective, but you said it is for free.
And Bloodhound is a crutch to track people you might have lost without the perk. And Pop is a crutch to protect a gen that you might have lost otherwise. And BBQ is a crutch to give you a target you would not have without the perk. And exhaustion perks are a crutch to extend a chase or even escape. And medkits give you one or multiple free health states you would not have without. And windows of opportunity gives you perfect looping information while probably being totally oblivious without it.
Every perk is a crutch perk, for exactly the reason you equip it for. Every item and addon is a crutch. Or you could simply call it "enhancement" instead. Some are stronger some are weaker. As I said: main problem is entitled bitching. It's not like anyone loses season rewards by depips or anything. Otherwise just go ahead and blame killers for playing too well, because you lost BP you could have gotten against a weaker player.
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It really is free. You didn't complete your objective. It's all or nothing. You didn't do your objective. That's the issue. Your crutch point is irrelevant on the point of perks. And complaining about an unbalanced thing is entitled bitching? Really?. So if we brought back old nurse gave her infinite blinks and gave her no cooldown it would be entitled bitching to complain? Seriously that's just dumb. Keys and moris are unbalanced and unhealthy for the game, hence why a majority of the playerbase is asking for nerfs to both of these. Anyway I got ######### to do so I'm done here
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Well, if you redefine it for your personal view with "all or nothing" then your arguments work. I would argue with "why does the hatch spawn then before 5 gens are done?" if this is not because of "partial progress" instead of "all or nothing".
Sorry if you take it too personal, I did not want to offend you, and definitely not targeting you explicitly. It is just the basic moaning in the community that I'm comlaining about. The argumentation "did deserve the 4k" or "earned the 4k" and "did not earn the 4k by mori" is just so massively subjective and creating rules to the game that simply don't exist. This game was never perfectly balanced and never will be because the killers vary way too much and the nature of the massive perk and item amount you can combine simply causes imbalances in every match. Some minor some major.
I said in another thread I would not want to have basement removed, as well as Saloon loop. Each map has strong and weak zones for both sides, some maps are in total favoring the one or the other side. So do killers, so do items, so do perks. Make maps balanced by exchanging every single tile by a TL wall. Fun. Long play motivation.
The only reason people have a problem with keys and moris is because they expect a certain outcome, they want the kill, they want the escape. They feel robbed if they don't get it. What about not talking about hatch escape but coward hole? Why not regard mori games as lazy/hard mode? Why having every game a "same ######### different day" routine?
I prefer changes in regards of interaction. Spirit change requests for example seem valid because from survivor point of view there is no interaction. You do your thing and see what happens, no feedback from Spirit. There are counterplays to bamboozle her, enough threads about that. It is simply that you get nothing out of this chase. About key and Mori changes I only hear "they don't deserve it", nothing about missing interaction or counterplay. Simply "I won't grant you that". And that is entitled bitching to me.
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I'm not offended don't worry about that. But the hatch at 5 gens would be unbalanced due to keys being able to open it and everyone escapes. However I agree with your stance on everything but keys and moris. As much as I don't like some of those killers you mentioned I'm not going to ask for a nerf because they require me to get better at the game on the survivor side. And I knew in that game because she knew where hatch was it was going to be a 3k, and i was indeed robbed of my pip when they both escaped with the hatch. Anyway about counterplay. I mean what is the counter to keys? If they are on the hatch you can't grab them while they hop in and you can't close it, what am I supposed to do its just a free escape. That's what I meant. It was free because she didn't do her objective and had to use the cowards way out. Even then I'm not angry with hatch, if you managed to get 3 kills you at least safety pipped unless you used a mori. My issue is when they find it there isn't anything you can do to stop them from leaving. As for moris? Only counterplay is to never get hooked but that's almost impossible against a good player using a good killer.
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And when I said I had things to do I was about to go to lunch
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Dont you love it when they 3gen and then key hatch
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It wasn't even a 3 gen. It just so happened they were down to 1 gen and 2 were already dead
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So, how will you solve the problem with dcing survivors? Just end the game there? Because it doesn´t make sense to keep playing if someone dcs with no gens done. But a key gives you at least a fighting chance in an otherwise unfair matchup.
Sure, you can say survivors are a team, but acting this way vs solos just makes them to swf, and you don´t want that, because thats what breakes the game.
Also, if some killer steamrolls the survivors, it might have been an uneven matchup from the beginning.
Edit: i actually have no problems with keys, only with moris. Moris allow you to shift the gamebalance in the killers favor very early in the game (even if you just take one out), while keys just allow a team to not be completley crushed. Usually, if all 4 escape, they only needed to open the gates anyway. there can 3 ppl escape, but i see that very rarely. Usually its one or maybe two who escape with a key. And i personaly belive a 3k is fine, as it is a win, and in horror movies one usually escape. But then, i am a survivor main, even though i play both sides.
What i disagree is the notion that keys and mories balances each other out. I dont think so. In my opinion, keys balance tunneling and camping, since one survivor if taken out early, but the rest has to do less work to escape. Mories are balanced by swf, because getting rid of that OoO user early is crucial to a killer.
So i belive its not just a simple matter of nerfing or reworking those items, as they are mechanics that tie in with several other issues.
However, i think the change that should happens is making those actually rare in the bloodweb, not like at the moment. I think it is great to find a key in a chest (at least if you run plunderers for it, but even then you only get a key every 3-4 games, often when its not needed).
And while killers often say they cant find a mori during the match in a chest, survivors don´t have perks (yet) that allows them to open the hatch, while killers have several that allow a mori.
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are you basically saying that if they don't use keys they will just dc? lmao plenty of players can win without them. and how does playing well make solos into swf? Unless you are saying because they are having issues winning they want to play on easy mode. Which is how i think of moris. If you want easy mode use an ebony. If you want an escape you didn't fully earn use a key. and please tell me besides myers and ph who can mori without an offering. i want to know. and i can explain both pyramid head and myers offeringless moris. if you are tormented and on last hook he can either mori you or send the to the cage, both end in the same result. Myers is the epitome of pure evil, hence how he can mori without giving 2 shits about the entity. Based on balance however, ph cages are unbalanced but myers tombstone takes a lot of evil to achieve so i doubt its unbalanced because it comes at a heavy cost.
Edit: spelling
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