Tfw one man has done more for game balance in one video than the devs in four years
Honestly one of the most objective, sensible videos about balance in DBD I've EVER seen.
I've been around since The Hag came out and I gotta say I agree with 100% of what Otz said in this video, and everyone should watch it. If everyone on these forums played both roles equally maybe we'd all have this level of empathy and understanding that there's people on both teams, and both want to have fun.
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I, too, wish for everyone to get along and have equal amounts of fun. But in a community like this, it's just not possible. It just isn't. Period.
I really wish the developers interacted more with fans. Maybe some of the community members are coders and could help refine the spaghetti code of Dead by Daylight. Wouldn't that be great, even if it'd take a lot of time? Imagine an update made by the community, for the community, with ideas introduced into the game from trusted members (and fair YouTubers, such as Otz).
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I agreed with what he mostly said, I was there live.
What I don't agree with are his DS changes, he wants to gut DS without addressing the actual issue and the issue is tunneling and DS is the only perk in the survivor arsenal to fight against it.
He had great points about Iri Head, Moris and keys.
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Nothing here hasn't been brought up by ad nauseam by many other people, including on this very forum. You should try backing up your opinions without relying on some streamer to validate what you think.
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Otz often makes good points but sometimes he gives off the impression that he's trying too hard to appeal to the community, telling them what they want to hear.
Moris - I still don't think people will be happy. Their line of thinking will be "well I wasn't hooked twice why should I be mori'd?" Not to mention the 4th survivor hooked will be the one who gets killed immediately off hook which is another major complaint.
The Iridescent head change is fine but what's wrong with Pinky Finger? has anyone actually played Clown with it? it's hard to hit.
Here's how pinky finger plays out...
- Get up close behind survivor
- Carefully hold M2 lining up the shot
- Try to hit them with it, if you miss repeat until you land it
- M1 to instadown
So you have to get up close, carefully line up the shot and depending on the survivor movement may need more than one attempt at it...
How is that any different to Hillbilly's chainsaw? even Leatherface is similar to a degree.
I think people freak out about Pinky Finger because it radically changes The Clown but he's really not very different to a Hillbilly. He can handle loops better but doesn't have the traversal speed so they're about on par.
Tombstone piece - remove T3 forever, yeah I'm sure the survivor that got killed with the tombstone piece will appreciate the change. 🙄
Exhaustion add ons are fine. Considering how a tap of the E button can completely negate a well aimed shot by the Huntress player I don't think these are OP at all. Survivors are just desperate to have their no skill required ez chase extenders on demand.
Map offerings should be disabled regardless. Yeah it would stop some fun builds but map offerings are just used to radically change the balance and it's not fair. If anything I'd turn all existing map offerings into anti-map offerings. i.e. all my Ormond offerings become anti-ormond offerings so that when I use that the game loads any map but that one. No more picking the easy maps but getting rid of the maps that are really not fun for certain killers like nurse on lerys, wraith on azarov's etc etc
Making Spirit visible would kill her overnight and Executioner just got changes yet they're already talking about more.
I saw parts of the video yesterday and it just felt like Otz pandering to a chat full of DBD reddit users so I turned it off.
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This is a very solid video. Namely because he also put it together on his stream with thousands of viewers. While he obviously led the discussion, he got a lot of feedback from the stream.
Not sure if they should do everything, but this should be made mandatory viewing for all the Devs this week... at least for consideration.
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You're playing pinky finger wrong. Step 1, throw bottle to slow down survivor. While they are hindered and can't dodge use pinky finger. Pinky finger is too strong and should be nerfed.
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Wish what he said about Hag was better tbh. Agreed with a lot of other stuff.
The only other thing I didn't fully agree on was the perk changes. Feel like some could've been better.
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First of all I never said he reinvented the wheel. Before you try to disqualify what he or other people have said with your empty "reverse ad populum" try to think about why a relevant streamer's opinion matters in this case. First of all he's a Fog Whisperer, so he gets to have more direct contact with the developers of the game and reach out to them far easier than the rest of the community. Second of all he plays this for a living, which means his perspective is most likely influenced by thousands and hundreds of hours of experience above the regular DBD player. And finally there's a reason they're popular, and that same reason is why their opinion has weight and it's because their statements gain TRACTION, something most regular users of any forum without a following are unable to achieve.
Second of all you know absolutely nothing about me; I have said many of the things he mentioned in the video not just here but on Steam forums, Twitter, etc. Try to be a little less defensive when thinking other people are just sheep with no original thoughts, which is quite funny considering your comment says absolutely nothing about the video I posted.
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You haven’t vs a Clown until you play against someone with pinky finger and reload speed add ons, running enduring and brutal, who tunnels and tunnels just to hit you with it. Bonus points if you have, and more bonus points if it was you with actual Rank 10-20 teammates in solo queue
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I agree with a lot of what he says, though disagree with a few things.
DS just needs a slight stun reduction, I think.
Spirit moving grass? Fine. Spirit being visible at certain times? Don't think that's such a great idea.
I think Legion and Demogorgon could use some slight buffs too. I'd throw them in the same category as Myers.
Clown is the hardest to balance with simple adjustments I think. His power is great in chase, but outside of chase he's pretty much useless.
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Even so you have to get up close. Get up close and aim M2 for an instadown.....yeah sounds like another killer.
So an Iri add on makes him slightly better than another killer at basekit, except he lacks all the mobility of that killer.
Seems problematic.
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To your pinky finger statement: That was basically what Leatherface needed to do before the buff right? You could already land a lunge like 2 sec ago but need to wait to be able to rev the chainsaw, hoping the survivor doesnt get to a loop in the meantime.
Dont know, but ignoring your chase power to hope to get into attracting situations to get insta downs while most likely missing the opportunity for several hits doesnt sound that appealing to me. Surely still a strong addon, but definitely not that braindead ez insta down spamming like it is currently or how you make it sound like.
And the comparison to current Leatherface is not working that well, because he pretty much became a pallet smasher with the new numbers. You dont need to get into body contact with the survivor anymore to start revving, and Clown in the first place doesnt destroy pallets with bottles.
And I'm pretty sure that the inverted passive phasing wouldn't kill her. It depends on the frequency, and 2 or 3 short appearances, not even movements, are totally fine over 5 seconds. Add reduced appearances to her passive phasing addons, and everything is fine
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Dude, c'mon.
Otz has how many thousands of hours playing, and did this session with feedback from a stream with how many centuries of DBD experience combined in the thousands of people watching it?
You don't need to use it to make it seem like the Devs aren't good at their jobs. Given how fun this game is and the size of their team relative to a AAA company, they're doing a fine job. They should absolutely take Otz's video to heart... but they shouldn't feel threatened by it.
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Dude, are you really comparing talking how "I could do better" and actually doing job?
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Some people have more knowledge/experience and insight than others. No need to be a douche.
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Otz making a document with what he would change doesn’t mean he’s done more than any Dev and he’d tell you that himself. Also, most of his changes have been talked about for a long time and some of them aren’t very good.
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Think 45 seconds would be more than enough time for an anti tunnel. Keep the perk core as it is but make it disable when jumping in a locker or when touching a totem/generator. That's the issue most people have with it, because then it becomes an offensive perk rather than defensive one.
Agree with his wraith changes, especially the retaining the vault/break addon after uncloaking for 5 seconds for it to be useful. And maybe a slightly longer delay of the audio cue of him hitting his bell after attempting to uncloak.
With Clown i would just rather have bottles recharge over time, like blight's rush recharge system. With an additional situational ability replacing the reload button, kinda like how the doctor/freddie rework went.
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Disagree he brought some stuff I hadn't heard before Michael 99 percenting to tier 2 with one hit. And having Iri head like Iri coin. So what did you disagree with him about in the video?
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Why make a provocative statement? Of course the devs have done a hell of a lot to valance this game. Clearly they must be doing something right, if they’ve double the average number of players at any time compared to a few months ago.
Otz has an opinion. Cool.
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Of course you disagree with the DS changes and the agree with Iri hatchet changes lmao. DS is for tunneling but it definitely isn't used that way and that's a fact. Anyways, tunneling/camping can be countered in other ways and tunneling/camping hurts the Killer when someone ACTUALLY does it since so many people don't actually know what tunneling or camping is.
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Show me YOUR personal proof how DS isn't used for tunneling. Please.
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Big difference between thinking about it and theorising and actually doing it.
It was a fun thing to do but I'm positive half of these would be horrible changes once they are implented or tested
Gamers aren't game designers. No matter how much we would like to be
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You can down and hook another person and in that time the first person has ds active. You can't do anything to them because you'll just get stunned. Slug them and they may have unbreakable anyway. Hell, just ds being the way it is killers always have to keep in mind if somebody has ds if they hooked people too fast. People get rewarded for not even running ds and that justifies it being nerfed
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By this time if you down someone and DS is still active, that's YOUR fault for not paying attention.
This DS rework has been out for a very long time, enough time for you to learn, if you've only have left them slugged for 10 seconds, 5 or 3 seconds before you picked them up you could have avoided the DS stun.
By THIS time, it's more your fault at not being able to keep count on who's been unhooked than the survivor.
We're heading on 2 years of this rework, at some point you have to take a good look at your IQ levels.
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I agree with most he said but most people have already bring these thing up.
be nice if we could all have fun every match but welp not going to happen.
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I see you like doing gens in the killers face.
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Yes cause everybody has a perfect mental clock of 60 seconds over multiple survivors while also playing a game that requires constant focus
I don't think DS is that big of a problem but that statement is simply ludicrous
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I'm curious, what did you have against his DS changes? They seemed to not affect tunneled survivors, and while I despise DS in its current form I'd rather the perk stay as it is than just not work
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He said any grabs and DS deactivates, what if you get grabbed off a medium vault after being tunneled before the 30 seconds?
That's a bit much. Touching a gen and DS deactivates? A bit much.
Healing and DS deactivates? A bit too much, what if you're looping the killer and you have Second Wind? What if you manage to get a locker play with Inner Strength? Technically yes, you're still being tunneled, just because a survivor has the time to heal during the chase with said perks doesn't mean they're not being tunneled off hook. What if I pop an insta-heal during the chase, it takes about 10 seconds with my build and DS is gone? Why? Because I managed to bring an addon to help me?
Some of the changes you killers want are ridiculous. Like...step TF back and think.
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Devs doesn't play their game as much as Otz and dbd community. Otz has more expirience seeing what is wrong with the game.
But I suspect this game is popular because of unfair things. This changes shouldn't be made in one patch. It make this game so different that huge part of community may quit because "this is not dbd I knew".
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He specifically said that it should only deactivate from locker grabs, because let's face it: Locker DS is absolutely dumb. As for the rest, there's nothing unreasonable about it. If you had time to work on a gen, you weren't getting tunneled. If you're getting tunneled, don't tap a gen in the first place. If you heal or get healed, once again you clearly weren't being tunneled. Sure, I can see some problems specifically with Second Wind, but nothing else. Not even an autoheal. Although he clearly didn't mean to implement everything he said, just some of the suggestions. I rewatched the clip to fact check it.
And please stop with the "you killers," I'm a survivor as well. I want the perk to fill it's clearly intended function: protecting the survivor post-unhook.
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Just look a gameplay in general for literally any DBD content creator ever. Most High level Survivors use it as a "You can't touch me for 60 seconds unless you wanna lose all your pressure. Next excuse please
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Devs: Well, YOU try balancing this game!
Otz:
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I can totally get behind DS deactivating after working on a gen for more than 1-2 seconds (just to prevent it from deactivating upon accidental gen taps that happen on controller or set ups that have multiple actions bound to the same button/key) but I definitely don't agree with the locker change.
If I hop into a locker with DS, it's because the killer is tunneling me. I do it because he came right back to the hook to shamble me and leave me slugged on the ground, mori me, or cage me as PH if I'm tormented. Lockers are the counter to the slug counterplay (and first hook moris) and they're not even always immediately available. Being slugged is THE most boring part of the game and I don't blame survivors for wanting to avoid it if possible. And I personally have had plenty of killers slug me for DS, and then without wasting any of their time, patrol my slug + nearby gens while giving nobody a chance to pick me up unless they want to get clapped, still effectively "tunneling" without the worry of getting stunned or losing me on the ground. It's not the most common occurence but it's happened to me more often than I've ever jumped in a locker with DS LMAO
Most killers respect DS and slug without intention to re-hook, rather to waste survivor's time, but I'm not bringing DS for these killers. I respect y'all and appreciate that you're not trying to ruin my game by making it last a fifth of the time I spent waiting in queue. I'm bringing it for the killers that don't care about anyone's experience but their own and are totally fine with tunneling you to death.
I totally understand the annoyance with locker DS. You either eat the stun or leave the person alone instead of still getting to down them. But I think it's one of those things that the good outweighs the bad. Survivors can abuse it but the majority of times I've seen it done or done it myself, it was to get a killer to bug off and go chase someone else. And again, it's still situational as you are not always able to get to a locker before the killer downs you.
Killers want perfect counter play to DS (slugging) but I think it's fair for survivors to have a bit of counter play to their counter play if they dedicated a whole perk slot to something that only has 2 times per match that it can even be used.
I'd much rather see a smol pp build nerf than see locker DS go tbh
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