How would you rework The Deathslinger?
There's been a lot of talk around The Deathslinger ever since The Executioner changes were announced, but I can't seem to find anybody suggesting fixes. If The Deathslinger was to get a rework, how would you make him more fun to play against while also maintaining his concept?
Comments
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There's nothing to rework. Either he spears you or he doesn't.
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I wouldn't rework him, because he works quite well the way he is. If he absolutely had to have something changed I'd make it so he was slower putting his gun back down after aiming.
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But why though? Is this a clown post?
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Not, i love the guy.
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I'm not saying they SHOULD have a rework, I'm just wondering how people who say they aren't fun would rework them.
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Just add a bit of a delay when lowering the aim. 1.15 may work, so it's not spammed as much. Other than that, he's fine.
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Remove quickscoping, increasing ADS sensitivity so that you actually get rewarded for good aim. Make his TR actually exist. If he feels weak like this, maybe give him 115, but 110 during ADS.
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Increase both ADS activation and cancellation, increase ADS movement speed, increase ADS sensitivity, and decrease ADS zoom.
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Adjust his chain's behavior. Currently feels inescapable at any range. Even if it's just a skillcheck with automatic deep wounds or more resistance when pulling away.
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Id change iri coin to be when hitting a survivor 10m away from the killer, and maybe make an addon that increases the range of the gun
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People saying he doesnt need a rework are insane. Yes he domiantes in a chase. But when was the last time you saw a Slinger even come close to beating even a 4 man solo team at rank 1? I can't remember the last time I didnt see a Deathslinger get carried to 2 kills maximum with Noed in the endgame. Much like Spirit or PH and their playstyle being pretty much based around garunteed hits, these killers just reinforce genrush/stealth meta (which is so god damn boring to play against) by having no real counterplay in the chase.
He has no map pressure. Make him slightly less oppressive in a chase and give him some additional form of slowdown or map pressure. Right now hes a marginally stronger Clown. Yeah he ends chases faster but his slower move speed pretty much leaves him at the same level.
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I would nerf the reload speed. Make it so that if you want old reload speed you need to run the add-ons. it's insane how deathslinger can shoot->hit->reload and still have you in a chase with not much distance gained (since he can just shoot you again and erase any distance you gained)
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Give him good mobility and a slow wind-up.
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Personally, I would start with giving him add-ons that aren't laughable. It's pretty sad that I have 50 ultra rare add-ons but struggle not to run out of the couple rare ones that actually help him a little bit.
Quick scoping takes a lot of skill and good aim, you are literally aiming without ads while weaving and chasing with no cross hair and no COD style aim assist... it's not like we can spam-shoot over and over and it's incredibly punishing when you miss. There's a missed shot cooldown where you're slowed, plus another huge slowdown when you reload... Plus he's already a 110 killer.
People spend TONS of time learning quick scoping. I main Slinger and most good survivors can move from line of sight blocker to line of sight blocker efficiently enough that I rarely fire at all.
It's another case of "this isn't a typical m1/standard loop-able killer" so just scream "he's OP and needs a rework" rather than learn and adapt.
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He needs something. He’s awful.
How is it that I have no problems getting accurate hits with Clowns bottles, despite the arc, but getting hits with Deathslinger is so damn difficult?!
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He doesn't need nerfs, that's for certain. He's literally a one-trick pony.
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He needs buffs - add on buffs, people calling for nerfs just jumping o the bandwagon and they'll keep doing it
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Here's the thing with Deathslinger.
Strengths: -
Strong chaser due to quick ads fake outs.
Good anti-loop (sometimes, depends on the loop/map, and requires great timing and good aim)
Range.
Weakness: -
No map pressure,
Not a single good add on, even irrid ones.(only decent one is the one which increase speargun reload, a green add on).
A spear hit is not a guaranteed kill. Other survivors can break the chain, they get stuck on an object etc.
Map dependent (a la Huntress).
Hits that should definately hit don't. Lag, desync? who knows, if you play him enough you'll see.
Skill dependent as hit box isn't huntress size.
In summary he's an average killer at best. If you put a timer on his ads, you would never land a hit at range. He needs improving in my opinion, his add-ons need a complete overhaul, not a single killer i've played has such poor add ons.
End of the day though, any killer who can't pressure the map will always be lower tier as the speed at which gens can be done combined with unbreakable, ds, dh, borrowed time etc means it is impossible when facing half decent teams to hook each player 3 times each.
I feel the people who complain about certain killers are from lower ranks.
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Make it take a tiny bit longer to fire after ADS, although not by a lot, and give a cooldown like PH after putting down the gun. Make the start of his TR louder. Then, in compensation, slightly buff all of his numbers; reload time, cooldown, spear range, etc. Again, not massively. Then take a look at some of his addons (why is the hellshire iron an ultra rare), and he's set. Much like doctor, his design is intrinsically annoying, but if you entirely remove his quickscope his shot is pathetically easy to dodge. Try playing Killshooter as he was intended to be played, with ADSing. Seriously.
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Make him 115 in exchange for removing the quickscoping and scope spamming and increasing ADS sensitivity. Sorted.
Also while we're at it; FIX HIS DAMN TERROR RADIUS. Seriously; it's cheap.
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Deathslinger is interesting, but he is clunky to play as and against. He doesn't seem like a ranged killer as much as a mid ranged stealth killer who gets more value at faking shots than taking them. Otz and Dowsey rated him mid tier. He has weaknesses, but he's not the worst in the game. Huntress is just a better choice when picking a similar character.
Playing against Slinger
As a survivor it can feel like you have little control over the situation. Your best option is to start dodging when he is obviously lining up a shot and to stay close to walls and pallets. You never know when he's coming because his terror radius is so small and it feels like the shot goes off before see it since he can quickscope you instantly. He is dangerous when he catches you off guard or is close to you when you're not in your jungle gym, but if you start getting a decent loop on him you know you're gonna win the game really easily if your teammates are doing gens like they should.
It's not fun to place against him, but he doesn't really feel like a threat unless everyone on your team drops really quickly early, or makes poor save decisions.
You don't want to play against him because it isn't fun, but if you're in red ranks and your team doesn't suck you know you're probably going to escape and get gens done fast.
Playing as Slinger
When playing as Deathslinger, it feels clunky. It takes a while to get places. You feel like you're more a of a stealth killer (low terror raidius) with some range and it feels like there is much more value in quickscoping than lining up shots.
Lots of times latency+current projectile speed causes misses that seem they should have landed.
When you do land shots sometimes it doesn't feel rewarding. Often the chain breaks and the survivor gets away. Sometimes, when you get deep wounds on a target and continue chasing them, they camp from pallet to pallet that has no counterplay despite them apparently being in a dire state and sometimes you often impale them during a deep wounds state and it gets broken by some wall or their teammate. Then they get away during the stun duration. Unfortunately these become deciding factors in the game. Gens are done across the map so you lace up your cowboy boots for a long hike.
While you can certainty end chases extremely fast, sometimes he just feels clunky or unlucky. He is not consistently fun to play as.
The deep wounds mechanic is kinda useless other than buying time and he is easily abused in pallet areas that don't have short objects/walls (that he can aim over or in between). Additionally, despite being one of the few ranged killers who seems he should have range, it does not feels like his range is great.
I propose to rework Deathslinger by
- nerfing ADS spam faking
- increasing map pressure through range capability
- Fix clunkiness in chases and deep wounds
ADS Spam/Changes
I would punish the ability to spam ADS by increasing the time it takes the scope out. His movement speed while in ADS might be worth nerfing as well. Finally if other changes make his quickscope too powerful, perhaps increasing the time it takes to scope in would be fair.
Deathslinger - Pallet Break/Deep wound alteration
I think pre-emptive throwing/camping pallets are too strong vs slinger atm. I would normalize him in alignment with other killers. If a speared survivor hits a pallet it should break. Reeling a survivor into the pallet breaks the pallet, but also causes the normal deathslinger break chain mechanics where he gets stunned/deep wounds.
I would give Deathslinger's gun the ability to stack deep wounds on targets already afflicted with deep wounds. If he keeps shooting you, it increases the time it takes to mend by x%. It makes no sense that shooting a target in the chest that is already in a dire state should suffer no consequence. Either stack deep wounds shooting a deep wound target downs the target.
Deathslinger Map pressure
Either up his run speed to match 4.6m/s killers or increase his range lethality. I think the range option keeps him unique in his own niche. His iridescent addon that allows an instant down is a good start, but there is 3 meters of valid space 15-18 meters. On top of that every time I've ever hit a shot at max range (about 30 times now), the chain ALWAYS breaks even with an addon that supports it. Perhaps the survivor should be downed where they are hit with the iridescent addon instead. Deathslinger should be able to make some mid/long range snipes (huntress has infinite range) Deathslinger has 18 meters. Deathslinger should have up to 30 meters. He has a rifle afterall.
Latency issues and map pressure
Between latency no hit reg issues and perhaps increasing deathslinger's range I would adjust (increase) his projectile speed it out. Deathslinger's range/projectile speed is increased, his terror radius should be increased some as well. Right now deathslinger is more of a weird stealth killer with limited range who runs at you kinda slow faking ADS (I don't think this was initially intended by the devs, but it played out this way). I would like to see him stay more in line with the FPS rifle niche.
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I wouldn't. I'd delete him.
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people arguing for keeping his chase predictable and boring aswell as keeping him mid tier at best
I don't understand that POV at all. I enjoyed him for a month at launch (same with Pyramid head) but I haven't touched him outside of rotations since. Yeah, overall hes weak. People who think hes OP are morons. But the chase is dull as hell for similar reasons as PH and honestly, its so incredibly easy to get quick ADS hits due to the complete lack of weapon sway or anything compared to an actual FPS.
If they slightly nerfed his chase but made him stronger in other ways he might actually be fun and viable. He's a joke right now. A very boring joke.
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1: remove quick scoping- it doesn’t make sense how they nerfed machine gun hatchet huntress for it being too strong but then released Slinger, who is basically just machine gun hatchet huntress on steroids
2: make his terror radius bigger- having a ranged killer have a 24 meter terror radius is fine, but having a perk make his terror radius smaller than the range on his ranged attack is stupid, imo.
3: give more chain resistance to the survivors- as it stands, at any distance the survivor is just dead no matter what even if they have things in front of them since slinger has so much control over the chain
buffs: make slinger reload faster, increase the range on his speargun, implement an ADS sensitivity slider in the menus, and rework his addons to he more useful
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Rework his gun so the spear fires faster/farther the longer you aim down. This would add bonus incentive for a well timed shot, and turn quickscopes into higher risk/reward.
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Yeah cuz on real life you last the same as current pyramid head cooldowns in low down ur weapon and attack with a bayonet (knife in the gun)🤷🏻♂️
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aybe cuz you were out positioned .
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115% speed TR and TR of 28m I buy it!
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Make him 115, remove quickscope, increase ads sensitivity, and remove reload.
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IF
Make an addon that works somewhat like fishing... Give Deathslinger an addon that allows him to yank at the survivor speared, would be pulled forward 1/4th the distance at the cost of 25% of his chain (an active ability for Slinger)
ADS will take .5 seconds and a cooldown of 1 second (no ADS spam)
Have an ultra rare addon that removes his chain and applies deep wounds that can only be removed by another survivor but DW lasts 20-25 seconds
I think that's all I'd do
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If he were to get a rework I think he should
- Have the aim down sights take a second or two
- Make the range of the spear from 20m to 32m
- Make hooked survivors hit by melee insta down
- If slinger cancels his ads it takes a second or two to recover
- Reeling time is extended to make up for range
- The reeling is more powerful to pull survivors around objects
- The reload is extended by 2-3 seconds
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He's fine although maybe give him sometime to ready his gun would be nice
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Make canceling his ADS take a second before he can do a basic attack, keeping his movement speed reduced until he is completely out of ADS. This will prevent ADS spams.
Slow his movement down more when reloading.
Make his spear shoot farther and faster the longer he aims.
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See, I hate slinger and the change I want for him makes him more fun to play against and as. :D
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That would be as broken as iri head tf? It's VERY easy to shoot someone at 10 meters, it's not a far distance at all (it's easy to shoot people as Deathslinger in general at all ranges but that's besides the point)
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My idea was to emulate widowmaker or the TF2 sniper's scope mechanics into his weapon: the longer you aim in, the farther it goes and at max range you and the survivor hear a "click" to let you know it's fully charged. So you can still pop-shot but you'd have to be very close (maybe 4m or something) but to hit someone further away you need to aim in for longer) then buff his reload speed to compensate or hell make him a 115/32m killer at that point
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Ole Limpy is fine. He's middle of the pack as far as strength IMHO.
If he's accurate with his shots, he's going to make some plays and probably get a few kills. Still not nearly as oppressive as a good Nurse, Hag, PS or a few others though.
If he's not, you'll get to dance a 4 man Teabag boogie in the exit gate. Just watch out for a sneaky quickscope and NOED. Wouldn't be the first game I've ended by shooting a late game teabagger and instant-downing him after reeling him in.
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The majority of his addons need a buff or rework. Deathslinger is pretty much on the same boat as Ghostface where the base power is good but all the addons are bad to the point where they're not even useful as a fun gimmick.
He may get free zoning but in this case I honestly wouldn't touch him because he's a bit more delicate to touch than Pyramid Head. For Pyramid Head and the free zoning I'd hope that they'd buff other parts of him because Pyramid Head is a complex killer with many sub abilities. With Deathslinger he's a one trick pony and that trick needs to be left alone.
I believe the Pyramid Head change is a good one but I also feel strongly that they shouldn't just patch out the nerf on its own. PH needed other buffs to accompany the change that's upcoming.
To elaborate on Deathslinger on his features and why I wouldn't change them (For basekit)
I wouldn't change range of spear at all because
- Too many things would get in the way the farther out you are making reeling in difficult even if you manage to hit that 32m shot
- Would be too easy for survivors to break it grouping up
- Durability would need to be adjusted
- Reel speed would need to be adjusted
I wouldn't change the aim down sight speed because
- Too easy to fake Deathslinger out and juke him at that point. I'm sure there's a compromise but an outright value change for the aim speed in my view isn't the way to go.
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What I learned is either he's too weak or too strong.
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The last time I saw a Slinger 4k at rank 1 against rank 1's was about... Last night, when I played a couple of Slinger games and 4k'd each one at rank 1 against 2 SWF teams, a 3-person and 4-person. The other games were crossplay games, so I couldn't check their friends lists.
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Yeah, it’s an Irish addon, it’s meant to be strong. Nowhere near as broken as Iri Head, iri Head can have 3 hatchets and can hit at any range
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After all these months i still can only shake my head when i think about the smartass who had the idea about a Cowboy who can shoot around with a harpoon... by quickscoping... Sorry but if this would be my company i would fire the person who has this little understanding of the game.
How to rework him: I would not rework, i would delete him. I thought about Deathslinger and honestly I dont see a way to make him fun or at least decent for both sides while not making him totally weak...so just get rid of him.
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