killers should get a 5th perk but it's a dedicated hex perk
SWF is really making this game unbalanced killers should get another perk slot.
How about they get a 5th perk but it's for hexes only.
5 hex totems, 5 perks.
You can theoretically have all 5 perks be hexes if you really want to.
But the 5th perk is for hexes exclusively.
I feel like that's fair because you don't want killers and their 5th perk being pop, m&a, etc
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What if one of the hex perks was haunted grounds ?
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Wouldn't balancing around SWF hurt solos though?
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Solo is gonna be buffed to be as strong as SWF so it should be fine. Remember, one of those buff ideas was a totem counter so this should be fine
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Being able to bring a powerful Hex for free would not be healthy.
Hex perks are high risk high reward. An extra, "free" perk slot like this exclusively for a Hex perk removes much of the risk involved in bringing a Hex perk as, part of the risk is in the fact that if it gets cleansed you're out of a perk for the rest of the match which is a pretty big deal with only 4 base slots.
This balancing around SWF idea isn't healthy as it would completely crush poor solo queue players who, contrary to popular belief, matter.
If a 5the perk slot was added on either side it would need to be on both and even then I can't see that ever happening as it could cause too many issues.
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Ah yes. The old "high risk, high reward" myth. Told around the campfire like Bigfoot.
No hex matters if it gets blown up in 30 seconds.
And very few hex perks are "powerful" enough to deserve it. Maybe NOED, Devour, and Ruin, and NOED only applies to endgame and Devour does nothing until activated with tokens.
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Devour Hope, Ruin+Undying, Crowd Control and NOED are, in my opinion strong enough Hexes to be considered "High risk high reward" if they get cleansed before or after you gain value from their effects. Bringing most Hex perks by nature go by this rule as, if they get cleansed right away that is the "risk" factor.
Then you have Hexes which punish Survivors for cleansing / attempting to cleanse such as Haunted Grounds, Retribution and Thrill of the Hunt. These, when used alongside a another Hex perk can make for a pretty nasty build in which Survivors are screwed either way.
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Oh, but having the SWF feature is healthy?
The game being unbalanceable because the killer is constantly in limbo between being too strong for solo-q and too weak for SWF is healthy?
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swf gets comms which is not only technically their 5th perk but it also replaces the need for over 10+ survivor perks and it makes some killer perks useless like knockout.
yeah swf running around with their 5thperk (comms) is healthy
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I feel like both sides should get a dedicated 5th slot with niche perks. Something that helps but doesn't fall in line with gens, information, healing, or direct chase potential like haste/exhaustion/window sealing.
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Survivors already have more than 4 perks it's called swf which has kindred, bond and OoO built in. I love how people on here try to say "we talk about random stuff in swf not killer" yet I have faced streamers went back to their past broadcast after they go offline and watched my match to hear them constantly feed eachother information on my location, what I'm doing and other critical things like that.
Survivors in this game are carried by swf and/or meta perks without these the majority of survivors wouldn't even make it to purple ranks.
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do you know how painful solo queue would be? i already get matched with 7k hour nurses+green rank teammates
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No.
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blame SWF then because SWF is so unbalanced it caused the meta to only play nurse and spirit
nurse and spirit can't get nerfed or else the entire killer playerbase will quit because then no killer can compete against SWF
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So because SWF is unbalanced we should buff all killers by giving them a 5th perks slot?
What about solo queueing survivors? What about already strong killers?
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you have a 10 minute queue for a reason
killers don't want to play anymore because it's too hard.
Either nerf SWF or buff killers that's the only way to fix this
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survivors already have a 5th dedicated perk slot.
it's called discord voice chat
Survivors don't need a 5th perk.
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in solo queue every killer is s tier, ive seen solo queue teams get destroyed by a baby trapper with no perks or addons
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and against SWF every killer except for nurse and spirit are D tier.
trickster in Z tier.
So again, either nerf SWF or buff killers.
Now 4 player SWF is like 6% of the playerbase so it's kinda weird they won't nerf SWF despite the fact it's only 6-10%
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no, more perks is bad, get carried by skill and experience rather then perks
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the problem is is that the SWF system isn't the problem, 3rd party software like Discord is, the game was never meant to be balanced around the survivors knowing where the killer and each other are at all times
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I'm going to stop replying to this thread since a lot of people are just taking the discussion off the rails lol
Have fun arguing
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No. Just an extra perk slot to make some killers extra powerful. Some of them are overpowered as it is.
I don't see a problem with SWF at all. Even as a killer myself, it encourages me to GIT GOOD! And outsmart them!
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I don't see an issue here because 9/10 I'm killer and I'm still in an xbox party myself. So just because the killer has a loss a majority of time people then can't play with their mates and have a chat?
Also unless you're going on to their gaming profile how could you prove they're in a team party chat? 🤔
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I used to say Hex perks should scale with the number of totems left on the map, but BHVR doubled down on the current totem design instead. Imagine a world where Third Seal automatically hits all four survivors, and they have to cleanse at least two totems to start getting it off of survivors.
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This. Its rare but I sometimes play SWF and we don't use mics or comms. Not every player does.
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Imagine playing with friends in silence...
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well they need to balance SWF somehow
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No lol, why not give survivors a slot for an exhaustion perk either way it's a bad idea
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tell that to the devs who never balanced the game around this fact
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swf groups make up about 6% of the population yet they are in 70% of my games
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Once you pass a certain rank - about 6 - all survivors find your hex in about 30 seconds no joke ruin is a pointless perk it gets taken whilst we're still at 5-4 gens
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The way they play make it extremely obvious, there's only a certain level of coordination possible without communication. You can't see survivors auras without certain conditions and perks, and entire teams blatantly rotate around flashlight saving people.
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Not only that but at least match up the matches accordingly.
Suppose I believe this game is balanced, and it's not the mechanics but just player experience that determines matches. At rank 13 I have continuously played team after team with red ranked players. Where is the balance in that? If you have a red rank or two then match the difficulty to a red rank or purple, why would a survivors who already have the advantage of teamwork get matched with a killer who is ranked way lower than they are?
These matches are literally impossible to kill one person but I'm expected to have fun?
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What are you talking about ?
The game is mostly killer sided. Plus, SWF only represents 5% of the trials.
Honestly, this forum should be cleansed from killer fan boys creating buff killer threads 100 times a day.
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Sadly there is no way I could imagine for nerfing SWF. If you put an option in the menu to avoid SWF, everybody would activate that and It would be impossible for 4 friends to play together.
Right now, if you want to avoid SWF, you have to dodge the lobby or just disconnect and wait 5 minutes to play another game. Is easy sometimes to recognize them as they usually use haddonfield or coldwind offerings, they run one or two flashlights, one OoO, 3 o 4 BTs, and they are extremely altruistic so camping is effective against them.
And they are extremely toxic so...with all that in mind just dodge or disconnect and watch some Otzdarva videos while you have the penalty.
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it is better to actually buff killers and balance maps and perks.
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aren't killers suppose to be slightly OP anyways?
They are suppose to feel like bosses.
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So give the killer 5 perk slots and survs a totem counter. Sound fair, in this forum, of course
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Well, I'm a killer main, love the game, love the recent changes, but I haven't been on in weeks, not because its hard, but because:
1) ps4 free games last month were absolutely dope. Love subnautica, love remnant: from ashes, will definately play FF7 remake
2) I have so many games to play on my Oculus quest 2 and it is truly the superior gaming experience if I have time and energy for it
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I think there definitely is an issue with killer and survivor perk balance (Survivor perks are often more impactful AND the survivors get four of them), and with hexes, but I don't think that adding a 5th perk slot makes sense. Adding a second offering slot? Absolutely, 5th perk slot? Nah.
Hexes really need the following to make sense as a design:
- Reworked spawns so they are never in plain LOS of a generator OR an approach to a generator OR common loop objects
- They should never be 'active' until the first instance you gain value. It should be impossible to cleanse DH until you get a hook, impossible to cleans ruin until a gen regresses even for a bit, impossible to cleanse seal until you hit someone, ect. Haunting Grounds and undying can light up based on either your other totem condition if you have one, or after 1 minute if you don't.
- Survivors should be encouraged to cleanse unlit totems so that if you run a hex its more likely your hex totem is 'out of the way.' Like making some sort of end game mega-buff for the killer based on remaining totems makes sense to help even out game times: if you rush gens the killer is so deadly in endgame that they probably can secure a down or two, if you cleanse totems the killer has more time to try to get early pressure.
You do all that and hexes are coherent. They are still perks that can be removed from the killer, but they aren't nearly as often a 'dead perk' because survivors can't just see a glowing hex totem on a hill and remove it before you even get your first chase.
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After a while in this forum, I can no longer differentiate sarcasm. Can you give me a hint?
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They should just make dull totems more of a part of the game than they are. Let just having dull totems up give some sort of passive effect that's not too strong but does something for the killer.
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Assuming you're killer main then. Pretty sure you wouldn't be so against it and would have a different opinion if you were survivors? I play both so I honestly don't see any reason to nerf swf to be fair... got a killer fan boy club on this forum I guess
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I really don't agree with that. A fifth perk is not the solution.
But I do think swf should be signalized to the killer somehow. Because it's one more advantage to a role that is already stronger than the other. It would give more awareness to killer and more power to choose if they want to dodge or not. Specially because klillers are not allowed to switch killers anymore (which doesn't really make sense).
And killers who don't mind going against swf would still do so, while those who do mind would simply move on to another lobby.
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Sure, with a 65-75% of kill rate including SWF this game is balanced against solos
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I'm literally not reading that whole wall of context bruh. You don't know who I play. I'm 50/50 mate. I just play for fun, a laugh. And so what if I'm beaten. It's a game. Unlike people like you sitting on here pissing your pants and crying how the game is so "unbalanced" I'm not delusional to sit and think what I think. My opinion you don't have to agree with me nor do I with you. Personally I think you're one of these that's literally wants everything to be nerfed to make the game easier for yourself. Then again that's none of my business pal. You do you, crack on with the game and have fun or simply uninstall it if it annoys you that much. Not everything needs go be nurfed in this game buddy just because YOU clearly can't handle a 4v1 probably suggest you sit and play Mario Kart instead.
Anyway as I said enjoy. Farewell.
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it would be cool, but i dont even think it is just swfs that are dominating anymore. SWFs are strong, but good survivors even solo together is also very strong. I think if survivors had to cleanse a singular totem as a part of the game, that totem would be gone within a minute.
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thats not only a bad idea, its also not possible due to the existance of Haunted Ground and the therefore emerging problem of being able to create builds that require 6 Hex totems, when only 5 exist.
4 Perk slots are definitely enough.
if you want a Hex, sacrifice on of those. its a high risk - high reward kind of deal, where you risk the perk blowing up and you not getting usage from it, but in return you also get rewarded with a perk that is much stronger than the non Hex Perks (at least in theory, there are a few exceptions ofc - e.g. Blood Favor or Third Seal).
you basically have to ask yourself: do i want lots of power or do i want consistency?
personally im all for consistency, so i never run Hexes. Though i can also not deny how god damn strong they are, considering ive been carried by my Devour Hope more than once (used to run that on Pig when i had no alternatives, it either blew up right away or it basically won me the game).
also your idea would, funnily enough, be a shadownerf to all Hexes.
because with having said 5th Hex-only Perk slot you make it so every killer always runs at LEAST one Hex, as there no longer is the downside of you having to sacrifice a Perk slot for it (which in itself just completely contradicts the concept of Hexes). This means every Survivor is gonna go on a Hex Totem hunt when they spawn, screwing over Hexes such as Devour or Lullaby that require a buildup - or NOED, as that requires a Dull Totem to stand when endgame hits, so not only do you draw unwanted attention to those, you also make it so if there is no other Hex Perk, everyone immediately knows you run NOED, so that wont ever activate either.
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But their 5th perk is comms so they have free room for an exhaustion perk instead of wasting it on kindred or something
so no they don't need a ######### 6th perk.
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Not at the current moment in time with totem placements.
It's easy to find totems and break them, it wouldn't change much unless you had it on a good totem map.
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