The MMR win-condition
We have no idea, what counts as a win in the MMR-system.
But does it matter? Isnt killing someone as soon as possible always the best strategy for the killer? Even if you need a long game for more points (multiple hooks, chases etc.), you can just "farm" the remaining three survivor.
And isnt it problematic if 4 kills are not every time a win? Right now Tombstone Myers gets 4ks with a depip. So if there would be a way in the MMR to get always 4 kills, but you still get the same teams or even weaker ones, wouldnt it be unfair for the survivor, who need to play against that? And there isnt even any incentive to reach high MMR.
And that brings me to my third question. Should it be possible in the MMR-system that both sides lose in a match or both sides win? Would it be good if there is a possible match outcome, which results in all 5 players increasing their rating?
What is your opinion on this things?
Comments
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Its better to keep the win conditions a secret. That way no one will abuse the system.
But honestly? Some people will quickly figure out what the win conditions are... so...
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Yh some will atleast get pretty close with testing.
But whats your opinion about the three topics?
- "Farming" the survivor for the win condition after killing one early
- 4k and it counts as a lose
- both sides win or lose at the same time
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- farming the survivors for the win condition would make the game harder in the long run.
- 4k lose would become boring fast
- you stay were you are. Which is either elo hell or elo heaven.
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Would you want a high MMR? If not which incentive would change that or is there none?
For example: more bloodpoints or XP (shards) for high mmr-games, visible rank to show your experience or cosmetics rewards.
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The Skill Based Matchmaking is about having fun while still feeling challenged. I wouldn´t want to stomp noobs all day. I also wouldn´t want to get rofl stomped all day. Having nice a fair matches would be enough for me.
Bloodpoints aren´t an incentive for me. Because you can get them with normal gameplay. Auric Cells would be an incentive. Since there is no way to get them apart from paying real money.
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The most fun games are games where any side could have won. Could be a 4k at 1 gen remaining, a 1-3k game where they barely made it out. The one sided way the current MM is these route are much harder to get. I personally just want a reason to be rank 1/high MMR. Current system there is no good reason for me to be rank 1 except games where I have to sweat more often. I am fine with that if there is a reason so hopefully the rank rewards comes soon.
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So you are happy with the planned rank rewards? (500k Bloodpoints) Or would you prefer something different?
The rank rewards depend on your playtime in the month, your rating/how hard your matches are dont matter. So it will be no reward for "sweating".
I personally like also close matches more. If you know that your opponents are good, even a draw can feel satisfying. But i would want to see my rating to see how i improve.
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Okay but how am I supposed to improve if I don't know what I'm doing wrong.
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You know what a good play and a bad play is. You know you need to get as many hooks as possible, You know you get penalised for heals, hook camping, etc.
You don't need to know the specific metrics of the scoring system in depth to know what a good play and a bad play is. If you've racked up a ton of bloodpoints, you've done well.
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That's not good enough where I play.
There have been some games where I make zero mistakes, but still lose.
I need to know what I'm supposed to change. Likewise, at those higher levels, I'd like to see my MMR as my matches will be much worse overall.
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Mmr win conditions will probably be very similar to current emblem system which is trash.
Also saying that they keeping it secret because people could abuse it is a joke. They can abuse it now and they will abuse it if they feel like it even if its hidden.
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Well rank rewards are coming with MMR. Depending on what killer I am using it could still be a sweat fest. I would be perfectly fine with that if I am doing it to earn rewards. Do I feel the 250k for each side is a great prize? No I feel it cheap as ######### but it's better than what I get now for rank. I would prefer more BP or a choice to get iri shards. I'm sure they will tinker with rewards from time to time once it's implemented.
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Theres an issue with that though. BHVR NEEDS to be transparent about what is considered a win, the playerbase needs to be aware of what the system is counting. Otherwise whats the point of the MMR system? It works in other games because players have a tangible idea of how to rank up, why they should rank up, and what ranking up means. When they rank up they are aware of why they did it, so they become aware of what kind of opponents they are going to face. Say 10 wins makes me bronze MMR, i'll know i'll face other players who also have 10 wins. This is good, because i'll never feel cheated out of a victory, it'll be entirely on me for losing because were both of the same skill level. However with a "silent" mmr this is not the case, i have only an incredibly rough idea of what my enemies are capable of, and will often feel cheated out of a victory because i will be unaware of if i was fairly paired against these people or a flawed MMR win condition matched me against people way above my skill level.
A silent MMR is not a good thing, because it both lacks transparency and leads to player frustration. We should be aware of how we are ranking up, just like we are now.
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You still get awarded points and you will rank up every month.
You should also play with competent teammates and face killers of your skill level. Which should result in a better experience as we have now.
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One thing is that we dont even know if your MMR depends on your performance alone. Say, you play solo survivor (like myself).
If my personal performace counts, is an escape a win even if i never take any risk, hide, and only rarely do a gen?
On the other side, if i carry my whole team, and at the end get sacrificed to let them escape, do i lose?
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You will still pip and rank up like you do right now. Only difference is, that those ranks only serve to reward you points at the end of the month.
But the ranks will have no influence on the players you are matched with. So you will know when you won. But it doesn´t show how it affects your "elo". Or where you stand in comparison to others.
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For Survivor yeah.
My Killer matches are going to be incredibly unfun simply because BHVR doesn't want to balance high levels of play.
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I think playing for pips is the most likely way to raise your MMR as that is probably ingrained into us all anyway anyway, and you will still see emblem calculations. It might be the case that the MMR of your opponents are the biggest factor of how much your rating changes.
The fun thing is that BHVR will be able to tweak the calculations without needing a patch to do so. They shouldn't announce how it is calculated as it might change.
As long as we get fair matches and streamers continue to moan about how they can't do their 4K streaks any more I think we can be happy that it is working.
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Win condition is irrelevant when SWF's can have 3 man high MMR and 1 guy low MMrRto cheat the system and get a killer with lower MMR than they would if the 4 man SWF had all high MMR. SWF or Solo reverse boosted accounts also make the matches unfair.
The win condition matters not when there's a built-in cheat system.
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From what I can tell, it's not exactly tied to pips. Kills/hook stages seem to be the determining factor on killer. Chase time and order of sacrifice/time in trial seem to be huge on survivor. You can get tunneled out but if it costs 4 gens, that's still good. Having a good game but dying last still seemed to increase my survivor MMR.
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