SBMM is totally fair!
Yup that's totally fair. Level 1 pig, 3 games played on her, this is how every match goes with any new killer I try.
How do you expect people to try new killers, or even new players to start playing this game???
I get that I have experience on other killers, but that doesn't translate to new killers. And yet you think it does for some reason. You think that because they all have basic attack abilities then it just translates into the same thing. But it's already been established many times, that just basic M1 killers don't do well unless they have a strong build/add-ons.
So my only option is to wait and farm up a megaton of BP to level up my new killers with before I even get to play them?
I'm not saying I should be going against newbies by any means. But I'm going against people with hundreds to thousands of hours, while I'm using a killer I have maybe 30 minutes on. These are the same type of survivors I'd play against my doctor. And out of the few hundred hours I put into the game, 90% of it was on doctor.
A year and a half, almost two years spent too accomplish nothing but longer queue times. Congrats
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How many hours in the game overall, how much of that on killer? Or anything comprehensible of your overall game experience?
Just showing this (btw censor the other names to apply forum rules) is worthless. You could be a whatever main with several thousand of hours and just had a bad day.
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I suggest playing killers you are familiar with until you at least get some decent perks going for the ones you want to try.
But I know it is not always easy when you really want to play them.
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I already said all of that in the above post. A few hundred hours, it's close to 600, with 90% of that being on doctor. And since I had just got done playing 4 matches of doctor, and 4king each time, it wasn't really a bad day.
Also, the point is that SBMM is supposed be based upon each individual killer. And if it was actually working as intended, I wouldn't be going against the same skill level survivors with the same meta builds, as I do on my doctor. But it's very clearly not based upon individual killer. As I stated above, it's the same whether I'm playing a brand new killer, that I have no hours on, or if I'm playing my doctor.
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When you try new killers you aren't meant to go agaibst babies and new players, sbmm makes a value using an overall from all your killers, so you have a general sbmm that will apply to new ones you buy.
As you cover your devotion, but there are cells there, you aren't a new player, I would say sbmm did good. Just save points before buying a character.
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Which is what I've been doing mostly. It's just sad that I have to wait till I've farmed over a million BP, in the hopes that I get decent enough RNG to get decent perks, so that I can finally try to learn a new killer.
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As stated above, I do not expect to go against new or baby survivors. However if their system worked as intended I wouldn't be going against the same type of teams as I would my main. I understand it's supposed to take into account your other killers, but if it was working properly then it shouldn't be the exact same if I play a new killer or my main. SBMM does not do good when using killers that you have little to no experience with. Because I'm facing the same thing either way.
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So i would guess you don't know how a normal elo system works in online games.
They don't start people of at 0 but for example in online chess everybody starts with an elo of 1500 (the best players having something around 2500).
Now your doctor stands at 1800-2000 or something and normally the other killer start at 1500 which then gets increased to something like 1600 to compensate for your overall accumulated game knowledge.
While i don't know if any of those number are even remotely correct or in the right dimension, behaviour never said that you would start with the other killers at 0. And playing a new killer against what amounts to rank 20 as a rank 1 doc won't help and not be fun for the survivor.
It SHOULD place you with new killers against something like the equivalent of high green/low purple but in another thread it is speculated that MMR is based on trial length and kill/escape rates. If that is true then i guess that the data they collected prior with the old MMR is screwing many people over given that rank 1 was a mess of low skill/high playtime up to correct highskill players and killrates where highly inflated by that and trial were either gen focused short games or stomps by the killer and also too short.
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You also said you only did 3 matches, and if your value didn't decrease, maybe you didn't do that bad before, but also you barely played anything to tell the system how can you do with the killer.
Btw with "teams I would go against with my main" do you mean scary builds of quick&quiet and dark devotion?
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"SBMM is gonna make it so people can play new Killers"
"Just play Killers you're good at 4head"
Pick one.
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I'm aware it was never supposed to start at zero. But you're still not getting the point. Yes, my other killers MMR gets counted into that to increase the overall of all your other killers. But even if that happens, in a working system there's no reason why my killer with lower MMR, should be going against the same skill players as with my doctor.
I've played League of Legends, Call of Duty, and many other online games with MMR systems. I know how they work. And I know this system doesn't work as it's supposed to.
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Apparently the MMR of your best killer is inpacted on tve MMR of your other killers (take it with à grain of salt tho)
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No, those were probably the two most random and surprising perks. But it's nice that you picked the two most non meta perks to focus on, and ignore the multiple spine chills, borrowed times, sprint burst, decisive strike and iron will that are in there.
But really I don't have a problem with the perks. It's the difference in skill. I know when I'm going against really good coordinated survivors, and when I'm going against survivors who need to work on their gameplay a little.
But you're telling me, that it's so hard to tell when someone has no playtime with a character, that every new killer I play should start at my highest MMR?
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Okay then let me address your point how the hell do you know that those survivor have the same quality as the ones you encounter with doc?
Their perks, gameplay, hidden elo or what?
And if you know by for example playing lol like i do that such a fresh MMR system has still to triangulate itself and again for every new killer aka you will at first get better and worse survivor. To use my example again, your doc is 1800 and your pig gets rated at 1600 and the system gives you survivor at 1700. What is there to be surprised about?
And finally to your overall point that this is a sign that SBMMR is unfair, here is a picture of a match i had one or two weeks before SBMMR was implemented:
For clarity:
my killer rank should normally be somewhere in purple (never bothered to tryhard into reds) but i only play this game once a month or so at this point and after the reset bug in May in never climbed back up thanks to my survivor friendly playstyle of avoiding kills and maxing BP.
I suck at blight and played them for the third or fourth time.
So while the ranks seem correct you can't tell me that this is not a 4 men swf (profiles were ALL hidden, also a first for me) with 3 smurfs.
So tell me was this fair in the old system?
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I never said the old system was fair, or that I even liked the old system. I completely think this game could use a proper SBMM. But what was promised and what was delivered were two different things.
And to answer your question about how I know the difference between good and bad survivors is simple, how they play. Their movements, they're looping, their gen efficiency. It's very easy to tell the difference between really good well coordinated survivors, and decent survivors, and bad or new survivors. I don't want to go against bad or new survivors, that would be boring.
But back to my point, is that if it was as promised then I shouldn't be going against the same skill survivors regardless of what killer I play.
You keep trying to argue that fact with numbers that have no meaning, because there's no shown number. It could be based on a scale of 1-10 for all you know. Then you keep shrinking the difference between those numbers to make it seem like the MMR for my main should be pretty close as that for a new killer once my main is taken into account. But that's not what was promised.
What was promised and what was delivered in this system are two different things. And you keep saying I need to play more to help it 'triangulate' my place with a brand new killer. So you're saying that until I've played the 10-20 or even possibly more games for it figure my skill with that brand new killer, that it should just place me in the same matches as my highest MMR?
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First of all expecting behaviour to keep any promise they make is delusional. They have shown time and time again that they a) their word and promises are worth scrap (see console optimization in the first year, early game improvement in the third year (and this nemesis perk is not a satisfying substitute), key changes several times and many other points) and b) the devs themselves don't even have the in-game knowledge that is up to par with even mediocre players and even moreso far from the top.
Second, my point is not the undisclosed MMR number but that maybe your pig and doc aren't as far apart as you think and that the survivor that are easy on your doc are of the same quality as the hard survivor for your pig. And both timer the opponent have the same elo difference from your killers but one time below and the other above.
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Most skills translate to other killers. Pig, especially, is one of the most basic killers in the game with little to learn.
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My advice: don't play killer if you have only unlocked one perk on them. Try to get at least their three own perks to level 3 and put some addons on (even brown ones will suffice) and then maybe you won't get stomped.
SBMM doesn't take into account perks or addons because they're selected once the lobby is formed and that's a problem if you only have the basic stuff.
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Just a quick question: what do you expect to happen when you go into a match with one of the weakest killers while using 1 mediocre perk?
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Que times are a little wonky for killer right now I honestly think until that fixes this is the experience most will have. I'm sure it has the same standard as old MM meaning if in Que to long just through you in a game. My matches were different yesterday as well my killer side turned more difficult and survivor became more easy (complete flip from day before) so idk to me that's the way it should have gone for me.
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So you are putting words in my mouth and making it to look like a quote. You people are funny. Please either quote what I said or don't make stuff up. You sound very immature and emotional over this.
Nah I ain't picking anything. Also you could still play new killers and you would encounter bully squads with old matchmaking anyway. My first game ever in 2018 was against bully squad. I had zero perks, experience, nada.
You guys are just cherry picking like community always did. Because you can't stand losing one game and come raging here.
Edit: Also I just gave a guy a suggestion that could ease him up into the killer. I never said anything offensive. But I guess instead of doing something you can do yourself, it is better to rage over sbmm. That will surely help a lot.
Also you can't expect to go against totally new players with killers you never played with. Even perkless you can completely stomp new people if you have experience.
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Few hours earlier i saw a streamer playing 4 man SWF. They all collectively have over 20k hours into the game, very experienced survivors.
2 games in a row they got a Blight with one Yellow perk and only 20 hours in game. Blight dcd after frustration, couldn't catch anyone.
Next they got a Spirit with 2 perks. 0 hooks and 2 hits the whole game.
SBMM working properly.
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You are guessing at how the MMR works to try to suggest to the OP that the system worked correctly. No one knows because the rating isn't shown. You are trying to say the new SBMM system works while also saying don't be surprised it doesn't work because BHVR doens't live up to their promises. All of this speculation could be solved by them showing the ranking numbers.
As for your rank based match making example, how is going from one matching system that could produce lopsided matches better than this system that can produce lopsided matches? That is what people are expressing their frustration about. The games are supposed to feel like you were matched with similarly skilled people, which for some people it seems to not be doing for some reason.
Instead of trying to argue with people about their experience and shoot them down with assumptions, why not just try to show a little empathy and offer how your experience has been?
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What the dev should do is 3 mmr for the killer a mmr for a 115% speed a mmr for the 110% speed and a nurse mmr XD
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Sbmm totally sucks.
Previous system awarded players that playing fair to opposite side by giving them more emblem points.
"You didn't need to kill fast. You need to play with your food for that the Entity can get more pleasure by eating survs' fear & hope that they got in the trial". It made sense and perfectly worked with lore and promoted to players that were trying to "play". Even in the prev system you can have 0k, 30k bloodpoints as killer, 8/12 hooks and still got a black pip and everyone were happy.
Nowadays, the new system only reward players that KILL the entity's victims. No matter how that it was. Fast or not...
Campedsecured a kill and trying totunneleliminate the easiest victim that was hooked before for gaining an advantage. I really start to see more killers that tunneling and camping when the newest mmr system was released. It's not fun to go against as solo survivor player for sure.But in another hand, people that playing as survivor mostly of the time are starting to play together more often than before and using meta perks for gaining the advantage too. Versing these guys on the killer that's not so strong like meta killers that we have or not wearing strong perks too and add-ons. It's really hard to control the map against good swf with "2nd chance" perks. And for the killer side, it's stressful and unfun.
What the mmr system do?
- It shows balance problems that we have more clearly
- changed the "victory" meaning gives to us more situations when players use "dirty" things. (even on old red ranks, it was much rare than now to see camping/tunneling killer or 4 swf that's going to do world record for repairing 5 gens asap)
- hides the mmr points for that people don't know what their mmr is (It makes people to be unsure how the system is working properly)
- make the grade system that show to us HOW MANY the person is playing. (literally, one dude can be a high mmr player and get so many wins but a new player that haven't a high mmr can play a lot too and after some time they both can get iridescent grade)
It will be great if these experience that we have gotten, developers will use it and to bring more balance things in nearby future.
But for today situation, me personally, game gives me all negative experience that it has mostly of the time.
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"So my only option is to wait and farm up a megaton of BP to level up my new killers with before I even get to play them?"
Is this not what everyone does anyway? Why would you play a level 1 killer at all unless it's literally your first time playing killer?
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It's hard for me to tell what's going on here but from what I'm seeing is you are playing against 3 ash players and 1 bronze player while you are also an ash, so the levels seem pretty consistent. Also, the score seems pretty even across the board so the game wasn't crazy lopsided. What's the issue?
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What do you mean by the levels seem pretty consistent? SBMM doesn't use the grade system for matching so they in essence mean nothing to the players' skill level.
I would also disagree with your assessment that it doesn't look lopsided by scores. They look low to me. With those scores I would assume he didn't hook many survivors so he got low scores for not being able to down enough survivors and they got low scores because there wasn't much opportunity for altruism.
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16k to 22k is about normal for a survivor escape scores. He also killed someone really fast.
The grade system isn't used by SBMMR, however the grade system does grade you on what it considers necessary for a win. So it can still be used a rough estimate of their skill level.
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Still completely disagree on scores. If I only got 16k or 18k on survivor with escaping, it means I didn't do much during the match, or couldn't because the killer couldn't down people. And 16k on killer is really low.
You absolutely cannot use grades to determine skill. They all reset to the lowest level every month. I could be a high MMR player but because I didn't play until the 10th of the month, I am going to have a relatively low grade compared to everyone else. And now you can't depip to a lower grade. Grades are even more about how much you play in a month and less about skill than ranks were.
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Because you want to play them? Bloodpoints don't grow on trees, fam. I have to use level 1 killers all the time and I have already invested well over 100 million bloodpoints to all my different killers. I have a priority list going.
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So empathy and my experiences, hm?
My empathy tuns out when people have as if this game is the one and only and whine accordingly.
Fitting to that my experience? Especially with the new SBMMR? I don't have any. I don't know if I said it already in this thread but i play this game only very sporadically for the last 2-3, meaning once or twice a month if I am in the mood because while i like the concept and style of this game, which make it unique, i have a plethora of other games i like and still want to play.
I would get bored out of my mind playing one and the same game for more than a few hundred hours and can't comprehend many people playing a game for several thousand especially alone. The only games where I have hours even remotely close are world of warcraft and league of legends accumulated over 10 years (not 5 like people in DBD) and that also only because I had friends to play them with.
So neither my empathy nor experience match with most people here and I argument mostly from a logical standpoint not a subjective one, unlike many others that only vent their frustration while leaving logic and reasoning behind.
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But your argument isn't logical, it is based only on assumption on how the system works. And if it is based on assumption, then logically, it can be false.
Most people play games to have fun. Forums are a place to give feedback about the game. If people are not having fun but care about the game and want it to change so they can have fun, logically they will come to the forums to express their frustrations. Trying to tell them why what they experienced should have happened based on your assumed understanding of how the system works is unhelpful.
If you don't care about the game that much, why even come of the forums?
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