I'm really amused at the various threads asking for "Punishments" and to remove player agency...
Seems like a healthy way to keep one of the most popular games on Steam alive, for sure.
I'm also amused at these 'gen-rush' and 'camping' experiments that just perpetuate the very behavior people hate seeing.
I know it is anecdotal, but I don't really see enough hard-camping/gen-rushing for it to even register on my care-o-meter.
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It's the official forums. Every loss is due to a 4 man SWF on comms and killers can't improve because every killer is at "high MMR".
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Really? The camping happens a lot for me as survivor, and Gens are so quick when I play killer its insane. My chases are not very long either.
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If killers stay near the hook for 10+ seconds they should immediately forfeit all of the bloodpoints they would earn in that match and the next one
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lmao I be sitting here wondering. They really think they're all at high MMR. How would you even know??
Post edited by Rizzo on1 -
I mean out of all my matches tonight (15 to be exact). 10 of them consisted in the killer camping while 3 other players pushed gens out of the way. I am also not counting the other 5 in which there was camping but was at times when there was nothing else to pressure.
You may not experience it but many other people do. I.E. It is more common than you think.
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The game will only be good once everyone has no choice but to play how the complaints want or quit, obviously. (Is the sarcasm obvious enough?)
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Lose = High MMR
Win = Still High MMR I’m just amazing at this game
Post edited by Rizzo on6 -
Camping is VERY common. I see it almost every game. Face camping happens less often, but I still see it quite a bit.
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Hell i'm losing all my survivor games after this got implemented I know I'm not at high mmr that's part of the problem feels like I get new players
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I don't think camping should be punished, as most matches that reach the endgame demand some form of it.
I do, however, think Leatherface in particular needs some form of change to his power so that sitting near the hook doesn't either guarantee a kill, or downing both the hooked person and the unhooker in seconds. There's simply no counterplay to it, and it's largely done exclusively to piss off the survivors.
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I don't want to see Bubba get nerfed because he's actually a fun, strong killer with some great addons. However, the way some people play him and the devs desire to reduce the effectiveness of facecamping; I really don't see how he survives unscathed. There isn't anything they can do because his power is just that good at denying the rescue or chewing through both the rescuer and borrowed time.
If he does get changed, this community will have noone to blame but itself. Though that still won't stop me being pissed about it.
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Which threads, exactly?
Maybe I missed them, but the only threads I've seen asking for 'punishments' are against hackers or people being jerks.
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So you think removing killers instant downs?, So if they did that it would make killers even weaker and make swf more powerful, Its like me saying, Lets nerf the meta perks
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No, I just think it's stupid that one killer can start the match by putting someone on the hook, and if they choose it, that person is just dead. There's no counterplay, the best outcome is just killing off that person in exchange for gen progress.
Other killers have 1 shots but nobody else can guarantee hitting both the survivors involved with zero cooldown, no buildup like stalking etc. At best you have BT and he still just trades you onto the hook, and worst he can still catch up and down after BT.
I don't think 1 hit downs, or camping, or killers need a change. I think Leatherface needs a change.
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Eh.
It's more that I (and I'm guessing a lot of other people at a roughly intermediate MMR) has far too many games against groups that absolutely stomp me and then stall the game out needlessly with ridiculous coordination, only for me to realize that I'm up against a 3-4man SWF in postgame with 10x my hours on the least experienced member.
Those 'why on earth did you match me up against that?' games tend to stay with you, particularly as these groups also tend to be incredibly meanspirited.
What's interesting about facecamping is that it's about as fun to execute as it is to play against. It's a really boring, really dull way to play the game.
The real question is - why do so many killers play that style so much? Is it the easiest route to victory, or is it a matter of them feeling like other approaches aren't as consistent? Both, perhaps?
I think a lot of killers worry that BHVR will nerf Bubba without helping him in other areas, as they did that with a half dozen other killers recently.
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The punishment talk comes because the people requesting it think killers are specifically griefing them/trying to hurt them. They seem unable to grasp the killer is taking the best strategy available to him at the time and always project weird stuff like "They do it to have power over people and to ruin your day!" No bro, I do it when it's the correct strategy for my situation. When you view something as a "BM" and not a legit strategy, you're just going to demand punishment rather than anything else.
The only actual solution that might work is incentivizing players to not do it by giving them a benefit or something better to do. Trying to tack on punishments has been tried multiple times now and NEVER WORKS. Maybe try some incentives instead of hoping the devs will take killers out back and shoot them for the high crime of camping.
The killer in your avatar can also create a a situation where a survivor is just dead. VHS tape+block a box with your body. Any survivor who got the unlucky number and needs your box is dead without any way to interact and stop you. And they never even had to down you.
But I'm sure we'll get to more Pig nerfs in the future.
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Thing is what is and isn't camping/gen rushing is pretty vague.
Be honest here, in those 10 matches you say they camped. Did they actually camp and never left the hook or did they just happen to return to the hook when a save was happening. Or were your teammates hovering the hook?
Same with gen rushing, if there weren't any toolboxes with bnp's involved you probably weren't gen rushed but failed to create pressure.
A replay system to see your match from different points of view would be a real eye opener to some people. A lot of the matches some people call genrushing still hit the 10 minute mark in which one survivor never even saw the killer and seeing how obvious the scratchmarks or crow that flew up when you went to unhook while the killer was still kicking a pallet in the area will also make you second guess any camping callouts
Camping and genrushing are real issues, but 95% of the time they are used as excuses
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The moment they start to punish people for playing the game in an intended way (because lets face it, camping was intended from the very beginning of the game). Is the moment they´ll lose a significant potion of their playerbase.
Its actually kinda ridiculous how people want the amount of players they play with to be reduced.
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You lose = l2p
You win = you're not at high MMR so your opinions arent valid.
The number of times I got flexed like this is beyond believe.
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I mean I assume when anyone shares their experience during a match, everyone speaks from their own perception of what they see through their own eyes. Which is what I am doing.
I get how certain things are viewed from a different lense, but having played the game for many hours (6.3k hours to be exact) and half of which have been playing killer. I understand the nuances and subtle differences of why/how things might go down the way they do.
If I run a killer and I feel like if I was them I would have left me a long time ago, because I understand how other people might be on a generator and I've already wasted enough time. That is an example of the why, when I attempt to think of an excuse for their actions. An excuse because that is all it is...because a strat it's not. Not when you've already lost the game and you are only face-camping because you think that is the pressure you earned.
Some of those matches had that type of killer, and yes they were staring me down the moment I went on a hook.
There were also times (as I mentioned in the other 5 matches) where I went "Ok I get it, it's EGC and it's their last hook". That is just as important as understanding how broken it can become if Camping is done when it's not EGC. That is what some of the people of this very forum choose to accept as a "Legit Strat" disregarding the specific circumstances meanwhile complain that gens fly.
I've been in matches where killers were quick to point out "Nice gen-rush" and nobody brought anything to even remotely make that true. Gen-rushing isn't holding M1 without hesitation because the killer is too focused on one survivor for too long, anymore than Face-camping is hovering around the hook because all the gens were done and there is nothing else to pressure.
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Many people believe this game can't ever die/everyone comes back to it if they quit. Since the game has no current competition and all previous competition has failed, it gives people a sort of cocky sense of "We can make any change we want and nothing serious will occur in reaction. Where are you going to go?"
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I don't doubt there'll be a change to the Video Tape to stop people dying sheerly to RNG, but that's it, there's a 3 in 4 chance for each survivor to still live even if the Pig decides to waste everyone's time doing that. Having a Leatherface stand in front of you is a complete death sentence.
Neither of those situations is far in a pvp game.
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When people are fed up, they will simply go and play something else. Even when dbd hardly has any competition, there are tons of other games that can be enjoyed. Especially when they don´t have punishing mechanics implemented.
This is a game after all. It should be fun. No one would want to play a game where they get punished because another player simply dislikes something and demands punishment.
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Where did the devs say "camping was intended from the beginning of the game"? Or is that something you're just assuming?
Because if camping was really intended, why did they create BT and DS? Why did they remove the option from the killer blocking the hook?
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People view this game as a 1v1 instead of a 1v4. Once they die they leave and ignore the overall results of the game partly because they are self centred and it is all about me me me. The other is because a gigantic portion don't play killer beyond dailies and farming challenges so they don't understand the other side to the game.
I am really trying to play survivor right now and it can be frustrating in solo q. But that is only because games take so long to find that it hits harder when you get placed on a team that goes down to a bubba at 5 gens leaving you standing there wondering what you did to deserve them for team mates.
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It's quite different being a pig and actually having to find the right box to block, following the survivor while crouched so it doesn't stop the timer etc vs standing in front of the hook and pressing m2, dont you think?
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Here you go. Timestamp 0:40
I don´t assume anything. Everything i say is based on facts.
Oh and before i forget it. Insidious also exists.
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What about the anti camping perks then?
You also think "genrushing" is intended right?
I think one of the mods posted a recent video about them doing something about facecamping, so I guess it is not "intended" anymore.
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Well it was a core mechanic for over 5 years, that was intended to be in the game from the very beginning. When they come up with a "solution" it better is something that doesn´t punish normal gameplay. But we both know it will probably be handled like the mori and key situation.
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Face camping is different from camping.
In fact devs wanting to preserve camping is why the anti face camping mechanics got tossed. Camping, as in being able to be near the hook, has always been intended. Face ######### the survivor while slapping them wasn't and changes have been made.
Saying ds and bt exist means camping = bad is like saying ruin only exists because of the equally laughable gen rushing. It's a perk to help you when a situation occurs. If the devs didn't want camping they'd change or remove the hook mechanics.
I mean does a sniper in an fps mean shotguns aren't intended? Properly used snipers can stop close ranged players before they can try, doesn't mean a shotgun is unintended. Bt and ds can shut down a tunnel or waste a killers time camping. Doesn't mean it's not intended, just a way to fight back.
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Some people just want Killers to never win.
Look at the thread where someone is running an 'experiment' on how strong camping is...Using Bubba; the Killer with the strongest camp game. If that's not 'I want my evidence to fit my bias' than I don't know what is.
They should be using the WEAKEST Killer, to prove that camping elevate even the worst to the best.
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