Macro Flashlight Clickers Harming people
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Yall remember when the blind screen was just a white screen, and flashies were instant? You would sit in your dim rooom getting strobe lighted from chain blinds and get headaches after playing 5 matches?
They finally changed that but it could be awhile before this type of thing is changed because its a survivor meme,the goal of clicking and flashing is to torment the other player, nothing to do with the game.
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Theres like a million different things in this game that could be harmful to someone with epilepsy, not trying to sound like an ass but BHVR should put a warning on their game and then those people probably shouldn't play it because there are alot of triggers like they have to DC everytime it's a Doctor as killer, they can't ever play Doctor, any time someone uses a firecracker or flashbang or blast mine they are at risk and certain maps are a risk, truth is you probably shouldn't play the game if you're epileptic and if you do then you should understand what's possible
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There are warning, people just ignore them despite having epilepsy, I would argue that there needs to be a huge one as you open dbd though. Also notice how the black one (Playstation store) has Starbreeze EULA attached to it, that means that warning is at least 4 years old.
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If there's a warning then I don't feel sorry for these people and I don't care who says I'm an ass for it, if you're diabetic you shouldnt eat alot of sugary stuff, if you're lactose you shouldn't have dairy products...etc.. people can hate me all they want for it but this person deserves to have seizures if they ignore the warning that's given to them there are plenty of things to cause seizures in this game and even if they fixed the macro you still would have this problem with other parts of the game, the people most adamant about getting it fixed are more than likely cry babies who get bullied with them in match and they just use this as an excuse to shame the devs because there's always an excuse with these people for them to get their way.
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If you have never use it then why are you defending it so much?
Seems like you use it and don't want it taken away from you.
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I use it but it's set so fast on the macro that there isn't any light it's just a click sound and affects them in no way
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Macro is unintended mechanic what is wrong with removing it?
There is zero reason to keep it in the game.
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That is fine.
The macro I'm talking about is the one that does like 13000 clicks in a second and they lose no charges because of the speed.
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This is called whataboutism.
"Why are you calling for x change when theres children dying of hunger in africa?!"
Nobody, not one killer, has ever said they're opposed to changes in the Doctors, Sadakos, or Spirits animations to alleviate their issues for epileptic players, and even if they did, that wouldn't be an argument for keeping flashlight macros!
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The devs do care. They are just working for a company that may not care enough to make it higher priority and they are generally slow for literally anything.
the color blind settings were NOT added because of the backlash or that stream fiasco. We know first hands from Mandy - who is part of the dev team - that they worked on this already long time before this and she herself is colorblind and has tested the functionality before this whole fiasco.
please don’t spread misinformation like that. Criticism is of course needed and helpful - but only if it’s constructive and not based on lies.
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So this is the flavor of the week. Ok.
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Have to agree with this. I play daily and have seen like one macro flashlight in like 6 months of playing.
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I don't care if you remove it my point is those people are gonna have other triggers in this game not only a flashlight, they should not be playing if it is harmful to them
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Actions speak louder than words, though. You can't let issues stew for years, a problem arises, and suddenly claim 'we've been working on this.' Whether or not they 'may' have been doing something, the fact that it took five years for anything to come of it, and only AFTER the community takes offense, is disingenuous.
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If OP is lucky someone will write an article calling BHVR ableist, getting called any kind of ist is the only thing that seems to motivate BHVR.
No colorblind for years so as to prevent an "unfair advantage"? One dev calling players annoying and an article later, all of a sudden they wanted to "surprise players but it got ruined"
Blackface Bubba, in the game for years and players using that for trolling? Crickets. A few black streamers complaining about it and an article later its "completely against their idealogues"
Guarantee David is only gay cause they feared the articles. Get an article written about them, that's the way.
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Eh. If actions speak louder than words, why do you still criticize them on the forums when you could stop supporting them?
you don’t actually believe that they implemented a functioning colorblind mode with settings in menu, UI, different kinds of colorblindness etc just in some few weeks? We are speaking about the same devs, right?
and I have said you can criticize them for being too slow on this, not communicating more with us on these kinds of issues etc. That’s all valid feedback and criticism. It’s just really dumb to make up something in your head and then act like that’s what must have really happened (despite simple logic telling you otherwise) and spread this misinformation instead of criticizing them for what they actually did wrong/bad.
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I get where you're coming from but the gist I was getting from that post was:
- Person regularly plays DBD, and they're normally fine so long as flashlight macros aren't present. Does make sense that Doctor would be a problem but that makes it an issue with 1/27th of the game, rather than an issue with 100% of the game, so it seems like that's very feasible to work around and much more within the realm of their control. Poster was not asking for Doctor to be deleted or changed, probably because that they can work around that to a better degree
- So to reiterate, the problem is not that DBD is giving the poster seizures, it's that macro flashlight clicking within the game is giving them seizures
- As Seanzu pointed out, there are generic video game epilepsy warnings, the same that are present for nearly every game. Mostly just CYA legal stuff, similar to how a restaurant menu says "eating uncooked meat could make you sick." Doesn't make you an idiot if you get food poisoning after eating their food - you knew there was a small risk of that happening, and you ate there anyway. We take small risks every day in our lives because otherwise, we'd be living in bunkers never going outside. The poster appears to have a very low risk of having seizures while playing the game, if flashlight macros were not present
You, yourself, are also taking a risk by playing this game. As the warning states, people with no history of epilepsy could have a seizure from playing the game. The risk is very very low though, and you've accepted that, so you play the game anyways
Kid, I hope that whenever you make a huge mistake in your life, you're still shown a basic degree of empathy, the kind you seem to be completely lacking in your posts
Again - the OP did not say DBD was giving them seizures, they said flashlight macros within the game were giving them seizures. Is your argument that flashlight macros are such a core component of the game that it's worth keeping them, even if that means preventing some players from playing the game and/or giving some players seizures?
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I also said that I could care less if they removed them, and you know nothing about me so I could really care less what you think I'm not a kid either I'm in my 40s I've been through plenty of ups and downs in my time, but playing a game like this one when you have epilepsy is like smoking while you're on oxygen, my whole point is there are plenty of other triggers in this game for someone like that and even if you removed it what's next? What else do we have to accommodate for and visually change because this can of worms get opened? If they took macros out tomorrow I wouldn't care a bit
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I think that's where we're in disagreement - the examples you've used of eating a lot of sugar while diabetic, dairy while lactose intolerant, smoking while on oxygen etc. Those are pretty much 99% of the time guaranteed to end in catastrophe. The risk level for someone epileptic playing a game like this seems to be orders of magnitude lower, although absolutely a non-zero risk for sure. The point the OP seemed to be making was that they could play the game fine (and have in the past) without this one element being present
I don't think the slippery slope argument really applies here, but just for the sake of argument, let's say it does. BHVR could just add custom options for the player - this way, no one loses out on anything. If someone wants to flashlight macro, they can, and the epileptic player can just put on a setting so that the flashlight doesn't flash visually on their screen. If someone is colorblind, they can put on the colorblind settings (obviously, already done). If someone can't rotate the thumbstick or doesn't want to ######### up their controller, they can use the toggle button wiggle option (also already done). There are simple accessibility options that BHVR could make which would infringe upon no one and would benefit everyone that has disabilities. So I don't think there would be any cause for concern that small changes like this would be the start of a slippery slope wherein the game would end up only in black and white, only with toned down sound or controls etc.
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I've seen people also saying spirit and onryo's passive phasing affects epilepsy, if they were to ever remove those even though it's not huge it would still be a nerf to those killers, like I said before though I could care less about macros sure it's fun to troll but it doesn't have any value outside of that and there are plenty of other ways
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If everybody that wanted to criticize simply left, there's just be an echo chamber, now, wouldn't there? As much as I criticize the game and the devs, I just really want it to succeed. I enjoy the premise of the game, though the execution and implementation of ideas is handled poorly.
Yes. The same devs who can't 'fix' an issue without creating another. Midwich, as the most recent example. RPD is a big one. Haddonfield. Boil Over. Twins. Heck, even Huntress can fall into that. They are prone to reflex fixes. Furthermore, you had a dev actively criticize players for broaching color blind mode. If you have one dev 'working' on it, while another denying it, doesn't that create a discord? Granted, not every dev has to know what everybody else is working on, but you'd at least expect them to be on the same page. Which falls back to the lack of communication done, both between the devs/playerbase, and apparently internally as well.
Now, if Mandy really was working, or testing, said mode well before the whole blow up, then I'll retract my claim that it was rushed. I didn't know, as I don't actively follow the devs when they stream. However, for them to make anything official, or at least public knowledge, only AFTER the problems arose, that's where my claim of them being disingenuous stems from.
Which comes back to my point about OP's topic. Even if a fix is in the works for a game component that could cause a health issue, the amount of time needed to actually bring that fix to the game just screams insincere, at least to me personally. If something IS on the drawing board, let the community know.
And for something like macros, it shouldn't be that difficult to bring a fix to it. It's not like they have to create something like the color blind mode for this.
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That's true, wouldn't be a huge nerf but it would still be a nerf. I think that's where we're in agreement - when accessibility starts to have an impact on the outcome of a match, most people are not going to be on board with those changes. When the accessibility changes have zero impact on the match outcome, most will be on board with them
Still, there are options available to satisfy everyone. Let's say passive phasing was removed for those killers. BHVR could just give them both minor buffs to compensate. And for anyone that visually liked the passive phasing - here's where just giving the players the option to turn it on/off visually would come into play
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Lightborn dosnt stop the strobe affect of the flashlight clicks. When a Killer has Lightborn the flashlights brightness is still there it just doesn't blind them, so when a macro is used the killer gets the full brightness in a strobe effect causing said issues.
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If everybody that wanted to criticize simply left, there's just be an echo chamber, now, wouldn't there?
never said you should leave when you criticize them. Actually i said the complete opposite. You should criticize them - but only if it has some reasonable basis (as your comment actually shows you are capable of)
Mandy confirmed they were working on it way before after if was released. Almo probably wasn’t really allowed to talk about it in his private stream as nothing was officially announced.
i do agree they should have fixed flashlight macros or at least should have acknowledged the issue and assured they are working on a fix. And that years ago.
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That's exaclty what I was thinking!
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Need a photo sensitivity option fr
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And here I was thinking there was no warning at all.
If I read this and I knew I had an issue, I probably wouldn't play the game, or many games for that matter.
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I'm surprised bhvr haven't done anything about it honestly. It's not like they aren't aware of photosensitivity issues considering how quickly they fixed Sadako's static effects in the main menu because of how awfully glaring they are to some people. At the end of the day I don't see the harm in having a 1 second cooldown between uses of the flashlight anyway, it's not gonna stop you from using them for their intended purpose. The only people it'll affect are those who bind it to a macro to make 1 million clicks a second and being obnoxious knobs about it.
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Why would you bring the representation topic up? That has literally nothing to do with it. On the one hand you have people that write the lore and work on fitting cosmetics for tome story’s etc on the other hand game designers, programmers etc that would actually have something to do with in-game mechanics like flashlights and how they work…
i can guarantee you that NOT having representation/BHVR working on inclusion at all would have changed nothing about the state of flashlight macros or general photosensitivity issues.
Post edited by Mooks on0 -
Flashing lights give me severe headaches, so I wouldn't mind this being changed. And the same can be said for Doctor's power effects too (The flashing on the screen). Flashlight macros have 0 benefit gameplay wise and exist just to torment the killer. Things like this shouldn't be in the game, especially when it affects other's health.
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This was my thought exactly. Some people apparently used some weird form of adjacent racism for a cosmetic and it got removed.
But apparently putting even a 0.5 second delay on a flashlight between clicks is big brain technology.
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@MandyTalk This has been a serious issues for years can you bring it up to the devs about this problem were only asking for a 1-2 sec cooldown on flashlights that way photosensitive people can be safe it wont effect anyone but macro users
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i actually posted something in Feedback today RE: Trickster, his "speaker feedback" awareness radius, and low level frontal lobe headaches and low level nausea due to the constant low droning and buzzing.
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Exactly
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