The second iteration of 2v8 is now LIVE - find out more information here: https://forums.bhvr.com/dead-by-daylight/kb/articles/480-2v8-developer-update

This playerbase

AddanDeith
AddanDeith Member Posts: 54
edited November 2023 in General Discussions

there are people who say windows of opportunity doesn't need a nerf and it's fine

but then say ultimate weapon needs a nerf because they can't play when something counters their aura reading

and there are people repeating that blindness is the most useless debuff in the game doing literally nothing

Comments

  • Ryuhi
    Ryuhi Member Posts: 3,826

    I'm people, apparently

  • Astel
    Astel Member Posts: 650

    I think both WoO and UW are fine.

  • JPLongstreet
    JPLongstreet Member Posts: 5,882

    This is a fair assessment.

    Since Ultimate Weapon is absolutely checked by a perk it's mostly fine. Maybe mess around with that cooldown as needed.

    It boils down to this:

    Don't like Ultimate Weapon then run Calm Spirit. Don't like being slugged run Unbreakable/No Mither. Don't like NOED run totem builds or Soul Guard. Don't like Leathal Persurer then run Distortion. Don't like Boil Over run Agitation/Iron Grasp.

    The list goes on.

  • Krazzik
    Krazzik Member Posts: 2,475

    I think both need to be nerfed, but people saying UW is fine because Calm Spirit exists, that's not a great arguement. Calm Spirit is literally the ONLY thing in the entire game that counters Utimate Weapon. There are no other perks and not even anyway of playing around the perk. If the killer opens a locker and just walks down the centre of the map, you WILL get found unless you're running Calm Spirit.

    Aura-reading has two perks that counter it AND you can hide in a locker or crouch behind an uncompleted gen to play around it, basekit. Screaming has no such counterplay. And normally that's fine, most perks that make survivors scream are harder to trigger or have a smaller area of effect. UW however affects a large area and that area persists and moves with the killer for 30 seconds.

    Having the sole counter in the entire game to such a strong effect being a single perk, and if you don't fill one of your 4 perk slots with it 24/7 you risk being unable to do anything against a really strong perk, that's just not fair.

    If they want to have strong screaming perks like this, they need to add more anti-screaming perks and/or something basekit you can do to avoid it.

  • Phantom_
    Phantom_ Member Posts: 1,354

    WoO doesn't show the player anything that isn't already there on the map beforehand. It helps beginners learn the tiles better and most intermediate to skilled gamers don't need to use it because they already know the map. It doesn't add all that much advantage to SWF-gamers.

    The only group of people it genuinely helps is Soloq. But considering every update, perk, and add-on change just LOVES to ######### on SoloQ, might as well whine about WoO long enough until it's nerfed into the ground and is beyond useless.

    UW allows the killer to know every survivor's location, with very little to no cooldown, aside from that it even works on survivors in lockers when literally no other perk works like that. This makes it on killers with high mobility quite overpowered and its cooldown is almost negligible. It's disgusting on Nurse, Blight, and even Wesker. You shouldn't have to put on 1 very specific perk (Calm Spirit) to counter that. I don't think most people have an issue with its blindness status effect.

  • Akumakaji
    Akumakaji Member Posts: 5,458

    Ultimate Weapon is the best tracking perk right now, thats for sure, BUT in the end of the day it only gives you a singular moments picture of the situation and tells you were everyone is RIGHT NOW. Sorta like the all-knowing AI in Alien Isolation. If you never played it, in Alien Isolation the Alien itself has a normal ai, it hears stuff in its vicinity and reacts to it and otherwise does things according to its script. But it also has an director AI that periodically gives it an instinctive hunch. That AI always knows were you are and after 2min of evading the Alien like a pro might whisper in its ear "hey, why not check out the kitchen NOW". This gives the illusion that the Alien is actively hunting you and always is on your heels, never being truly thrown off your trail.

    And in a way Ultimate Weapon does exactly this: it tells the killer where the survivors are right now and where to look, but by the time they arrive there, the survivors got the opportunity to hide or leave the area. And even when you find the survivors, you as the killer still need to manually chase them and put them down. Its a cool little hunting tool that allows you to quickly get into chases while keeping the fruitless looking behind walls and bushes at a minimum, which is kinda crucial at the current meta. I totally understand that it can feel "oppressive" at times, but you always get the scream as a notification that its best to move rooms.

    I actually did never understand why the perk gave everyone blindness, though. Maybe it was meant to emulate the sort of headless panic when you are running from the Xenomorph and get this kinda tunnel vision, losing track of your surrounding? I don't know.. I value this perk for is tracking purposes and how fast I can start a new chase and I don't mind the blindness part, but I think that people overplay how strong it is. I think that I got way more undeserved downs with NowhereToHide and its exact aura reading then with UW showing me in which direction of the map I show look for a survivor, but maybe its cooldown could be tweaked with and the blindness part ditched.


    That aside, WoO was mostly overplayed because it was paired off with MFT. I really hated this playstyle, as it was mindnumbingly exhausting, running like a madman behind a survivor on autopilot who would beeline for a pallet, drop it, beeline to the next, rinse repeat. On its WoO is a-ok and I would totally leave it alone, even though it has a 45% pickrate in my games as a killer.

    Regarding Calm Spirit, I am kinda indecisive. During the time when DH reigned supreme, some killers, in their desperation, dedicated entrie 4 perk BUILDS to just countering this one perk and people on the forums where endlessly mocking with "bruh, its just a perk. Everyone can play anyway they want. If you hate it so much, just play Blood Echos and Mindbreaker. Duh." In itself I don't think that equipping a perk as a counter pick to a perk you don't like is bad. This is actually how a living meta evolves and forms over time: side a uses a strong option; side b regularly equips the counter option to side a's favorite tool; side a's favorite tool gets constantly outplayed by 40% playing the counter option, so it gets picked less and less, resulting in less counter options picked and eventually both perks fall out of the heavy rotation and the new Chucky perks become all the new rage.

    My personal opinion on similar problems is this: yes, its fun to always play the 4-6 strongest meta perks and feel very comfortable, while often forgetting that you are kinda crutching on this meta perks, but if you constantly think "maaaan, I wish perk X was basekit, because I constantly face opportunities where it would have been so useful", well, then why not just equip this perk X instead of one of the meta ones? In DBD you can do very well by playing only half meta or, shocking, totally off-meta. Of course the meta is the strongest, but being a slave to it is its very own problem that many players just fail to recognise as such.

  • Axx
    Axx Member Posts: 392

    I have been using WoO since back when it had a cooldown. It's a great perk for solo play. Running to dead zones is a bad feeling. How is the perk an issue? Good loopers already know where all the pallets are. Nerfing it would just hurt solo survivor even more, and I say this as a at heart killer main.

  • Travis_Bateman
    Travis_Bateman Member Posts: 279

    Windows does not need a nerf.