The Underground Complex (Hawkins National Laboratory)
We'd like to know what you think about the Underground Complex map, part of the Hawkins National Laboratory realm. Please leave any feedback you have concerning this map as a comment on this thread. Your feedback can be as brief or detailed as you'd like!
The Underground Complex (Hawkins National Laboratory) 224 votes
Comments
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The navigation of the map is pretty bad because of how long walls can be with closed off doors. And there's pallets everywhere. A lot of gens are very safe too.
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This is, without a doubt, the worst map I have ever seen or played on. I started playing after ST left the first time but in all the old videos I've seen of it, it looked very stupid and I didn't know why people remembered it fondly. Then it came back and it did turn out to be very stupid. Everything in this map is designed to cause as much frustration as possible. Narrow hallways, no line of sight, incredibly inconsistent collision, all the rooms look the same with no real landmarks, an inexplicable upstairs area that only exists to waste time, broken killer prop and chest spawns, and more.
The portal room is stupid with a stupid window that has the potential to be abused, a hook spawn that can be bodyblocked by the killer to make rescues literally impossible, and a gen that takes the killer a really long time just to walk to and waste so much time.
The upstairs area is obnoxious because there's no real gameplay up there you just hold W through to waste the killer's time. Defending the upstairs gen is practically impossible.
Why does the tube that you can drop into even exist? M1 killers can't hit survivors who are in there, they have to walk all the way around the catwalk and drop down into to be able to do anything, it's completely obnoxious and serves no purpose.
Despite being one of the tiniest maps in the game, navigating it is extremely painful because the rooms all look very similar and for some reason have random doors. There's one of the big long rooms that sometimes just doesn't spawn a door on the other side AT ALL so you go in and you're just trapped and have to back out again because even though the survivor is less than 5m away from you, actually walking to them is impossible.
The gameplay is really stupid. You just drop/predrop pallets and run to the next pallet. Killers are forced to break some of the better ones and can bloodlust the others but 90% of gameplay is just "drop pallet, hold w".
I hate this map with a passion. It's awful. I don't know anyone who likes playing on it, survivor or killer. I wish it never came back.
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The second floor is so bad there is nothing but death as a survivor, i never go there as a survivor at all because of how bad it is designed, for me it's inexistent, the map overall has unsafe pallets and the map itself can be confusing, it's a bad map for both sides imo
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serious question: WHY DID PPL ASK FOR THIS MAP TO RETURN!?
i wasnt around when the map existed, but i played it a handful of times on its release day... it sucks. i hate it.
its basically the small narrow rooms of rpd, mixed with the pallet count of gideon. what is this map??? its awful.
and if you play vs like a slinger or huntress or nemesis, you might aswell surrender cause other than 50 pallets which they can all ignore, this map gives you nothing as survivor.
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get rid of portal room window or nerf it very heavily and fix bugs related to killer props and map is good to go.
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Literally all i wanted to say here, 100% agree. I can't describe how much i hate this map. Probably best map aesthetic wise and by far worst map gameplay wise.
Should be #1 priority on rework, AFK is more interesting than actual gameplay on this map. Almost all m2 killers forced to be m1 here, i just can't stand it anymore.
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Part of the map has an awful super saturated green filter, that is a relic of the past map designs.
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The main room can never be called a dangerous area due to the loop that uses the windows on the second floor and the windows below, and the chase routes are diverse, so the survivor is always in control. Unless there are survivors who complete their gens in the wrong order, most killers have no chance of winning. This is a map where stealth killers can play an active role.
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I dislike the map for both sides.
50 unsafe pallets, impossible navigation, stealth killers, 0 gameplay.
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Lots of pallets, but none of them are really safe. Strong window in the portal room, upstairs is not worth looping as a survivor. Hard to navigate on both sides but once you get to know the map it can be much stronger. I missed it honestly, no map should be taken away but it definitely needs some work
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The Underground Complex is one of the licensed indoors maps and it is the one that shares the most with Treatment Theatre. By its own nature, it has plenty of differences from a typical outdoors map, like it being smaller, having lots of line of sight blockers, hard to find generators & totems, lots of pallets (22) at loops that are unconventional as well as many drop-down windows. Similar to Treatment Theatre, the survivors' proficiency in the map and the killer power's compatibility with it play a major role to the outcome and enjoyment of the trial.
The small and long rooms can only repeat the specific type if it is a laboratory room but no if it is a storage room, it would be more intuitive if neither could repeat. The doorways are very erratic, sometimes generating dead ends where the survivor is unable to do anything in chase and that can also block killers from navigating towards a hook in time. The generators spawn logic can rarely spawn two generators inside the same long room.
The rift room counts with a window that is arguably very strong for many killers to handle; it also has hooks that are very easy to defend due to the reduced entrances and the generator is so awkward to patrol that it is usually not worth defending. On a similar note, the generator in the isolation room on the upstairs section is also not worth patrolling most of the time and that area on itself is not the most interactive (since the loops are so unsafe and the best option is to navigate it up and down with enough headstart).
The two adjacent corners to the upstairs section have hooks that are also very easy to defend, specifically the one where the staircase is far from the edge map wall (since approaching from upstairs is not an option and the fixed loop nearby is very unsafe).
Several issues could realistically be addressed, like the doorways & generators spawn logic or the room types that repeat.
Modifying the outliers in the layout may result complicated due to the licensed nature of the map & reducing the frustration from powers that aren't compatible with the map is also not an easy task.
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This map is kinda a mix bag, in my opinion.
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Love the map for nostalgia reasons and very happy it's back but there need to be some changes gameplay wise. I heard it's a nightmare to play Singularity on this map but what do I know? Flat walls and no trees and such is probably the problem for Singu.
Killer or survivor sided well I think that depends on what killer it is but most killers should do well on this map?
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It should get a fresh coat of paint, average more openings on the map maybe swap out a corner tile or two with an actual structure that were used to like a short wall or LT wall, and maybe make the gen spread more consistant, the 5 spread of gens on the ground level sometimes is more patrollable and sometimes less and if a killers smart they won't ever defend the two upstairs out of the way gens, if possible it should get some changes to create better gen spreads against smart killers
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Genuinely the worst indoor map without question.
It's a remnant of old dbd map design that still needs to be updated like every other old element still remaining in dbd.
The map needs the following.
- Breakable doors to replace the prop doors or just not have any doors for rooms.
- Realm Beyond visual overhaul.
- Better placement for things such as Xenomorph's tunnel entrances so they don't obstruct the path as seen sometimes where they spawn to close to a prop so that the path becomes blocked.
- Tiles with both double pallets and double windows being toned down in strength.
- Removal of the vault by the generator up on the catwalk in the upside down entrance room.
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I'd say this one of those maps that genuinely plays a 50/50 balance. The pallets are very easy to play around, but the sheer ability to link loop to loop makes it a good trade off.
The biggest negative to the map is the catwalks, they waste so much of the Killers time and on top of that, if the Killer downs a Survivor up there, there can be a chance that they won't be able to make a hook because of the weird hook spawns.
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I actually really like this map, though I'll admit part of it is probably for nostalgia reasons. But I liked the map even before it was removed.
While a lot of the pallets are pretty unsafe, there are a ton of pallets and that helps make up for that. While this is a bit like the brand new Greenville Square, where there are also a ton of pallets with a lot of them being unsafe, and I didn't like this balancing strategy on that map, I think it works better on Hawkins because quite a few of the pallets can often be chained together which makes them not unsafe anymore. It also feels more natural on Hawkins because there are a lot of hallways that aren't really suitable to have window vaults so pallets just work better.
Personally, I would like to see generator spawns on top of the catwalks be removed, such as this one:
There are 2 generators that are always on different elevation from the rest (one in the portal room and one on the 2nd floor) which are naturally harder to patrol for the killer (and are also pretty safe vs. most killers, the portal room gen is extremely safe against everyone except Nurse, the upstairs gen is safe vs. most killers except stealth killers). And 2 is enough on its own. Having generators appear on top of the catwalks creates a third (or even fourth, if there are 2 in one game) generator that is more time-consuming for the killer to patrol and they are also difficult for survivors to find - it's very easy to check a room, not see a generator on the ground, and go past it because generators on top of the catwalks are more difficult to notice.
The single pallet upstairs could be better for survivor, it's pretty much completely useless, and the portal room downstairs window could also use an adjustment, the window is unwinnable for killer if the survivor has the proper starting distance/positioning since they can prevent chase from starting by walking and there's no mindgame since you can see the killer through the glass.
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Navigation needs a bit of improvement, with less pallets being close together in certain areas.
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very bad balance-wise, I agree with most here.
but from a casual point of view, I still missed it when it was gone and like it when it’s not sweaty opponents. Can’t say I am too fond of this to be the map for Stranger Things though, would have loved some other parts of Hawkins/Upside Down Hawkins eg Wood area with Byers House and Christmas lights, or that pool (was it at Steve’s house?) or the Mall(!!)
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Really loathe this map. It's issues are well documented. The one downside with having stranger things back.
It's not survivor sided or balanced or killer sided. It's just broken. Depends greatly on the killer. Either you are in heaven or you are utterly screwed.
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I like the map but it can be a bit buggy with prop spawns and hooks in tight corridors
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This map has such an awkward layout and the navigation is so bad, the portal room window at the bottom is an infinite, and there are so many pallets but 3 quarters of them are terrible, and there is a tone of BUGS on this map and there was a pig trap box literally can't use it cuz there are some crates in the way
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You have the most detailed feedback for all the maps in each post you make in this part of the forums, keep up the good work!
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I always really liked this map. It looks great and is something different than the average outdoor map. (We need more indoor maps)
It may be a bit tight here and there but i have seen killers lose and win and survs lose and win here.
Just like everywhere else.
So, kinda balanced map for me.
I am happy it is back.
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Overall I'd say the map is better for Killers. The map is relatively small, with little to no good pallets. Usable windows are near non-existent (barring the god-window). Gen spawns always feel super bad, and I've frequently had 2 gens spawn on the same upper platform section on one side or the other. That means there are 4 solo gens, with 2 easily patrolled at the same time.
One fun sidenote is that this is a surprisingly good Trapper map. The long drop kinda always forces you to fall in the same spot, and I had 3 trap activations (I hooked from) there in a single game once. You can also block the only good locations for the Survivors to run.
The gates are one of the few things in the Survivor's favor, but only if you are non-mobility/Plague Killers.
Overall bad experience as Survivor, mixed experience as Killer.
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Arguably the map I think most desperately needs redoing from scratch. It's killer sided but not in a way that's fun or interesting for the killer.
My primary issue with it is the collision - the map already feels claustrophobic and playing singularity on it takes that claustrophobia to a whole new level, with many of the loops harboring sight lines that aren't sight lines, and that's if you can even place a biopod in a good place at all.
Gen discovery is awful (as far as I can tell there is no way to tell if an unfinished gen is in the area without seeing it, unlike other maps that have flickering lights to show the way). On the topic of gen defense, the upstairs section of the map is a waste of time to visit for the killer throughout the match. Rift room isn't much better, with an incredibly out of the way solo gen.
It also has awful navigability because most of the map looks the same, a majority of the map's usable material is unsafe pallets (including one pallet that varies between unsafe and a god pallet depending on if a gen spawn happens, which is awful) that encourage simply holding W. Upstairs is equally useless to survivor - the second the gen is done there's no reason to go back up there. The doors varying between being open or closed also seems purely RNG and whilst theoretically could make for interesting loops often just leads to corridors that survivors have to hold W through and even more easily camped hooks.
Speaking of easily camped hooks, the rift room has a hook that is unrescuable if you stand on the stairway up to it (which doesnt grant antifacecamp).
I would suggest finding ways to improve the loops, but I think what's best for everyone is starting over and finding a new angle to take the map. Tight corridors and cluttered rooms simply aren't fun to play in.
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The most chaotic and wonky map there is.
RPD doesn't even come close.
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The worse playable map atm. Actually just needs a from the ground rework.
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The map looks great and has the best atmosphere in the game. The loops are also good and fair in my opinion even tho they are better for killers. The upper floor windows are also cool and fun to play on.
Sadly you removed the walking on the railings, I wish you would bring them back. For new maps please make more things that you can jump on and then walk on, which you can‘t access from below.
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strong if survivor knows how to utilize loops. weak if survivor plays loops in unsafe way.
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The wall openings being so rng makes playing this map infuriating. Many powers cannot be used as normal (wesker, larry, billy etc) and make for a painful time for the killers. Other powers completely nulify the loops (dredge, knight, artist, unknown) and make for a painful time for survivor. Nothing can really be changed about the map to fix its issues though.
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The portal room basically has an infinite window, has you cannot start chase through the glass wall it makes it so if you don't run while in Los the killer cannot start chase, making this window a literal infinite if the survivor knows what he is doing, sure a lot of killers can play around it but not all of them.
The layout suffers from similar issues as Lerys in the sense of doors being open or close and therefore not that many direct ways to enter a room, but also the part about collision issues and rendering killer powers way weaker, because of clutter and small entrances ro rooms.
Once again cutting people off or tracking from afar are hard to pull off because you oftentimes cannot see further than you can throw. Resulting in the inability to use crows or far away scratchmarks for tracking.
The map enables quite the boring playstyle for killer in the sense of most pallets being so weak that it is easier to get an m1 than to use your power... Also the total amount of pallets on this map is just ridiculous, as it can spawn up to 30 or so...
The map is a little less bad for stealth killers but I still don't find it enjoyable for either side.
As survivor hiding is once again super easy, same as on every indoor map...
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It is very difficult to navigate, as it's sometimes impossible to see from afar whether a door is open or not. Unlike RPD the doors aren't fixed, and unlike The Game the doors are rather small. This can lead to you wanting to go from A to B and completely wasting your time going to the end of the room, just to realize that you can't leave it there. This can lead to Gens popping in your face as Killer or Unhooks you don't reach as Survivor and it feels very frustrating, because if it was clearer what doors are open, you would've reached your goal in time.
Additionally. the area upstairs is so unnecessary when it comes to gameplay. I NEVER went there in chase or when trying to hide or whatever. It is just there, to exist. The gen there is also terrible. As Survivor if the Killer finds you there, you are dead. As Killer it's impossible to defend the gen realistically.
What I like about the map though, is that it is randomized where the rooms are. This leads to variety in gameplay.
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The map has some core issues but as they bother both sides I think it's balanced. (I still know it from when it released)
1. Navigation is really bad depending on RNG.
You see a hook right next to you in one of the large rooms, but you can't get to it because all doors next to it are closed. The other hooks are too far because they are in rooms too. Same goes for survivor when trying to unhook. It has a similar problem in that regard as old RPD but not as bad.
2. The ceiling lights indicating unfinished gens are not flickering anymore. They are just turned off. Make them flicker again to help survivors find gens.
3. The glass-wall window in the Upside-down room is an infinite for 90% of killers as you cannot get into chase, which means the window will never be blocked.
4. The Isolation Cell Gen and Upside Down Gen are almost impossible to defend because they are so far up and on opposite sides of the map.
5. Hooking people on the 2nd floor can be tideous and very hard if survivors bring certain perks.
6. The 2nd floor is "empty" besides the Gen. There is no real loop, so nobody ever goes there except for the Gen and maybe a chest/totem
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I feel that the ascetics of this map kind of lacks their identity. Glass room is cool but all the other looks too similar. The name says "laboratory" so the rooms should look more like laboratories/offices and not storages and only storages.
Balance wise I really dislike how unintuitive the logic of doors is on this map. On Meat Plant for example it is far better: Sliding doors are closed if there is a unrepaired generator on one of their sides. I wish it would be similar on hawkins. I have also noticed that sometimes generators spawns on the catwalks and I dislike that because they are hard to find
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The layout of the map is a little strange, with very long walls, making it difficult to enter some areas
It needs a general review since its return, as some new killers have problems with the map's hitbox, for example Wesker, who hits any corner
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The map just stinks overall
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Too may pallets, but all of them very unsafe, also the second floor is a death sentence for survs. Also, very uncomfortable to navigate.
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Huge. Maybe shrink a little and it's brilliant?
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I don't really have much to comment on regarding gameplay, however I'm still shocked that Hawkins was brought back the exact same way it left. Like I was surprised it received neither a graphical update or a layout change in the time before it was brought back.
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Absolute worst map in the game by at least one order of magnitude.
For a long time I thought RPD was the most confusing/impossible to navigate in the game. But then the Stranger Things DLC came back and I got to experience it for the first time and now I wish the ST DLC would disappear again forever ASAP. Every area of the map looks more or less identical with virtually zero distinguishing characteristics. As a survivor here it's impossible to find gens to work on without walking face first into the killer by accident. As killer it's only barely tolerable at all because you can see generator auras so you have at least some way to find your way around. I can't even suggest any way to make it better. Please god, just scrap the whole map. I don't even care if you replace it with a new better version, just remove it from the rotation and end my pain!
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A map with too many line of sight breakers and too many pallets, albeit unsafe pallets, makes this a balanced map, but in the worst way possible.
Stealth killers have too much of an edge on this map, with a lot of the generators being very easy to approach without being seen. Theres just too many walls and unsafe generators, overall making it a little too oppressive for stealth killers.
These multiple walls and common unsafe pallets also make a lot of killer powers barely usable. Wesker, huntress, blight, singularity, Oni, Bubba, amongst MANY others feel terrible to play on due to a lot of the map having too many walls to effectively use movement abilities (Wesker Blight, Oni) or have unsafe pallets, when predropped, can outright deny power usage (Huntress, Bubba, Deathslinger).
The top floor is also pretty awful for survivor. There's pallets and windows up there, but they lead to unfavourable positions on the survivor side, so theres no real reason to use them unless its a last ditch effort which doesn't feel good.
Remove a bunch of the walls to both weaken stealth killers, while also incentivising chase killers to use their power, overhaul the second floor and it could be a much better map. In it's current state, its probably one of my least favourite indoor maps.
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A big cramped confusing glitchy mess that's obnoxious to navigate, let alone play. It needed a serious overhaul before being brought back.
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I love this map. The atmosphere in the control room with the upside down rift is stunning. The corpses and the sounds giving me the feeling to see a scene, where something happened before. It has animated hooks, funny surprise/escape holes. On the second floor the scene continues with the rat cages and the wardrobe from the employeers.
It's the best stealth map. You can't defend everything and there are many pallets. But It feels more balanced than other maps.
For me, the third best map.
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Love this map for its balance. It nerfs top tier killers while not hindering lower tier killers at all. Lots of unsafe pallets and unique structures adds for interesting gameplay. The biggest and i mean biggest issue with this map is vaultable window connected to the glass window. That window if shift teched correctly is a literal infinite. The upstairs gen is very unsafe to try to do since you cant see the killer coming, not including there isnt anything safe loop near it. I think if you want a out of the way unsafe gen, that is fine but it should make so the survivors can react with out comms a little bit easier to the killer approaching.
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