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Billy try not to slug for 4k challenge (impossible)
Every single, and I mean EVERY single billy I play against, no matter how many gens are done, slug for the 4k. EVERY. TIME. There needs to be a longer cooldown between saws. It absolutely must have a cooldown. Blight doesn't have a one hit down mechanic and even he has a cooldown between dashes and gaining back dash charges. Billy has too much mobility and absolutely no downside to using his saw, infact using it more and more makes him stronger by going into overdrive which is fine IF there is a downside to missing and using it too much.
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We are slowly going to revisionism ourselves into saying overheat was a good mechanic lmfao.
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He never needed over heat just better control over turning and slightly less collision to prevent hits that made no sense. Overheat is cool but WAY to powerful for crossing the map and almost no cooldown between saws
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It feels like we're quickly heading back to the days of having a whole team slugged by Billy in the first 2 mins. There were good reasons for nerfing old instasaw. And that was in an era when maps were stronger and gens were faster.
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Well, this happens when BHVR makes a Killer strong.
When Overheat was a thing, Billy was one of the most difficult Killers. And only some Gigachads played him who did not care that much about winning.
Now Billy is way stronger, most likely Top 5-Killer. And then you get a lot of not so nice people playing him who play him for his strength and not because he is fun. And this results in some of them playing like total scumbags.
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I'm talking about overheat not overdrive, the mechanic he has before overdrive that gave him a cooldown/resource meter for his chainsaw and was universally hated and ruined the killer for the vast majority of players and made him one of the least played killersin the game.
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You know the overheat change is what started this whole thing in the first place? If he woulda never been nerfed and they only fixed his addons. Who knows what hed be like now.
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And?
It is not like Overheat was unreasonable back then. You had the Killer with the best mobility and an easy to use Instadown (not talking about Curving, talking about Backrevs, which were super easy, especially with (Double) Chargetime).
It was quite obvious that the Killer which the Community called "most balanced" was not "most balanced" anymore at this point in th game, because the game got significant easier for Killer. So it is just logical that the "most balanced" moves towards a weaker Killer than Billy.
In retrospect, removing Chargetime- and Cooldown-Add Ons would have been enough. But I can get behind the idea of nerfing more back then. The Devs also realized that they went too harsh with it, with basically making Overheat nonexistent to the point that you had to actively try to overheat your Chainsaw.
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Also eitherway like you said they needed overheat or overdrive to make more addon ideas. Im all for balancing overdrive more. But i do think its a better mechanic than overheat with the faster paced gamestate. That seems like a pretty regular opinion i see around.
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This is just the reality we face now. Gone are the days of hearing his chainsaw in the distance and knowing you were in for a fun match. Now it's mostly super sweat Billy.
I think people have forgotten about insta-saw and hook camping Billy. I think we all view old Billy with nostalgia goggles. Forgetting all the most annoying stuff.
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I dont have an issue with Billy currently. Maybe I will think that he needs more adjustments in the future, but my main gripe after the latest Rework/Buff was just that the Cooldown-Add Ons were too good. IMO they are still a tad too good and should probably not exist, but it is not that much of an issue IMO.
Other than that, I think the current version of Billy is great. And as someone who played him for years, I just love how smooth he feels nowadays. Since they messed up his animations, he was awkward to play (not even factoring Overheat or anything), plus having to use Shadowborn was a bummer.
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Sorry overdrive*
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Ah yeah. Honestly I would agree, just removing his heat and revamping addons wouldve been enough but the devs have said they sturggle with making good addons without the heat mechanic.
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I dont get the emphasis some survivors put on the # of gens and how that should dictate the killers actions. Its never a bad time to use effective tactics.
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It's a response to poor game design. Personally I'm not going to fault players for using the most efficient tactic available but I will call for changes if it substantially decreases the fun for one side. It's not the fault of the player to expect that if they lose they at least had the opportunity to play.
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Overheat was garbage, but even Bubba has charges so he can't just chainsaw all game, and a way longer object-hit cool down. Maybe Billy needs a slight nerf, but I like the Overheat mechanic. He actually feels more like a viable killer now, even for console/controller players. Maybe something where revving it and actually running build up 2 different meters, like Overheat and Overdrive respectively(?)
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If I'm running survivor with flashlight and killer is getting run around pretty good I'm less inclined to go for saves as it would make the experience miserable for the dude that's already struggling. It means they were queued into a lobby with people they should be playing against and it's not their fault or they are on a new killer and trying to learn. A tunneling killer is totally different as they are being toxic and should suffer the consequences.
if it's a sweaty match where both sides are fighting for their lives then I absolutely have no problem doing what it takes to win and killer should do the same. But to tunnel and slug when not a single gen has been done is extremely toxic and killers need to be punished for not playing the game as intended aka hooking survivors. There's a reason survivors have multiple hook phases and to by pass that and let people bleed out on the ground or all get 1 hooked before a single gen is done makes no sense
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What does slugging for the 4K really have to do with his power?
Against any insta down killer you are probably not going to get the pick up easily.
You have to choose between the risk of helping a team mate and self preservation.
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Did you even read what I was replying to?
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What reply, you created the thread. You open with complaint about slugging for the 4K and then wanting Billy’s power nerfed as if it’s causal to the slugging.
Basically there has been some discussion on how his power works and then just a lot of complaining about unrelated playstyles.
Yeah I read the whole thing and it still doesn’t really stack up as a sensible conversation.
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I used to play a lot of old Billy before his new rework, the addition of the overheat mechanic was extremely unfun and actually deterred me from playing him further. It felt like it stripped away the joy of being a skilled Billy player, and fun addons like using drift king or landing curves. Instead of feeling rewarded for mastering these techniques, you were constantly penalized for trying to enjoy yourself.
As a result, Billy became more enjoyable for survivors to face off against because he became easier to defeat. Only the most dedicated Billy mains continued to play him, and even they grew weary of dealing with the overheat mechanic. It's frustrating when people sugarcoat these issues or act as if they possess some kind of inside knowledge like you acting like it wasn't that bad. When in reality it really was that bad, overheat was awful.
Also, I really don't think it needs to be said, but balance wise killers are highly subjective. What one person considers balanced and fun might be seen as frustrating or unbalanced by someone else. Take the Trapper, for example, who many consider to be well-balanced and straightforward to counter. Yet, when players use top-tier addons or employ strategies shack trapper, opinions quickly shift. It's unreasonable to expect a universally agreed-upon definition of balance because there will always be dissenting voices. Or basically just say the most balanced killer is the worst performing that's how it usually goes anyway. Those are typically the "fun" killers, but only really fun when playing against not playing as.
Also even with the changes to reduce overheat it was still obnoxious to have it felt like you were actively being punished for using your power. So you saying overheat was basically nonexistent is just detracting honestly. I doubt you even played billy simply because you just lack an understanding of why it was a problem to begin with. There was a reason even the OG billy mains quit him or kept begging for the removal of overheat.
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Cant say I see any tactics that remove a players ability to play the game, maybe body blocking but thats a punishable hostage situation. Even a hard tunnel at the start doesnt remove the survivor's chances since it simply groups those chance back to back. Failing repeatedly is not evidence of a lack of opportunity to succeed.
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Nah cant agree, tunneling doesnt take anything away from the survivor. We still get all the standard chances of a typical match, the just get pushed back to back.
Tunneled or not the survivor gets multiple chances to succeed;
1. Use stealth and Avoid detection
2. Escape the 1st chase and avoid damage
3. Escape the 2nd chase and avoid a down
If unable to escape a single chase then the survivor has lost out on no gameplay and is completely dependant on teammates, not the killer, for additional opportunity. Being unable to work on or even touch a generator is the personal responsibility of that Survivor player until hooked.
Unless the killer is sending messages, I see now reason to assign malice for situationally beneficial tactics.
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I played Billy A LOT. And what made me play him less was not Overheat, but the rework of his animations, because he felt awful afterwards. Extremely clunky. So I already played him less when Overheat happened, but I still played him a fair bit during Overheat, but my main concern was always his FoV and the enormous size of his Chainsaw, which let to bumping into Objects you might not even see. That you did not notice it makes me question if YOU even played Billy.
Then, that Survivors prefer easy Killers is just a lie which Killer Mains like to tell. I will not really pay attention to it, but you should learn that "fun to play against" and "weak" are not the same things.
And yes, over the time Overheat became non-existent. Which makes me really think YOU did not play Billy, because you actively had to try to overheat. Or you played Drift Billy, but this is a Meme-Build anyway.
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DwichaelJackson what have you done!!!
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This comment is how I know you don't play survivor at all LMFAO.
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Being tunneled from the start does remove the player's ability to play the game. If you wish you can add as intended. If you played VHS before it went under from treating Monster the same way. Unless, of course, you're arguing using the Monster noise after banishment to spawn kill Monsters allowed Monsters to play the game.
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More so than I play killer these days, but its fine if youd rather claim bias then address any particulars of my comment. Dont see why I should have to take playing survivor so personally that any killer using their brain is just out to destroy my fun.
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Again, another comment how I know you don't play survivor much. Don't need to adress anything, your comments speak for themselves and I'm not gunna waste my time talking to a brick wall
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My vhs experience was limited, found myself right backbwith dbd. Still I stand by my comment and will add this; when I get tunneled none of my chances are removed.
Its on me to outplay the killer and use stealth in order to provide myself the oppurtunity for gen repairs. If/when the killer spots me, thats because I failed my 1st chance.
Its on me to use the map tiles and knowledge of the killer to escape as quickly as possible before injury. Getting hit means I failed, got a boost, and now must try again with a 2nd chase.
Once on the hook all "my chances" are gone until teammates can provide another. Getting chased after the unhook simply puts me back in the situation of relying on myself to escape before the down. Nothing has been taken from me, whether its a constant interaction with the killer or someone else gets a chase inbetween to break it up, all my chances to play remain.
Im just not seeing where the killers actions have removed any of my gameplay.
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Good to know your sticking to factless claims rather then addressing laid out logic 👍
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Billy's one of the few killers who doesn't need to slug for the 4k...
They reduced the audio for his chainsaw. The person playing Hillbilly can easily zoom across the map and hear the hatch. Then they can inifinitely zoom between gates because NO COOLDOWN. They actually get FASTER at patrolling gates by zooming excessively.
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Okay, I'll try again and see if you understand. If this were an FPS, we were two equally skilled players, and my gun did 3X as much damage as your gun would you really be playing the game? The fact is that DbD is set up so that, barring a massive skill discrepancy, the Killer will outchase the survivor. That is how it should be as this is an asymmetrical game. In my analogy the Killer is now the person with the gun that does 3x as much damage.
An FPS isn't the best comparison but, for a closer one, you sound exactly like all of the Teens that argued against Monster buffs in VHS. Here, however, you're arguing for tunneling, which is an unhealthy play style, to be perpetuated.
Saying it's an issue with skill is completely false as that would only be true if Killer and Survivor were equally matched in chase. They're not by design; the Killer is the person with the much better gun in my FPS example. Just like the bloodbath that happened with 6.1 and the people who had been crutching on pre 6.1 DH Killers are crutching on tunneling. The game mechanics favour Killer in chase.
If you're going to argue it's just skill then, to be valid, Survivors would need to have a 4.6 m/s movement rate and Killers would need to be able to vault at the same speed as Survivors. They're not. It's not evenly matched. Having game mechanics favour one side is not an even match and cannot give a direct comparison.
I'm not saying that they should be evenly matched; I pretty expressly said the Killer should beat the Survivor in chase. If not, the game wouod be broken. However, since the ability of the Killer to tunnel is much greater than that of an equally skilled Survivor to avoid getting tunneled then, for the health of the game and so people can play the game, tunneling should be nuked from orbit and Killers can then receive buffs as needed for BHVR it hit its desired kill rate.
Tunneling is unhealthy and unfun. It's not an unfair expectation for people to expect they can actually play a game they log into which they can't do anymore than if they were the Monster getting spawn camped in VHS or the FPS player with the far weaker gun.
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