Even Tru3talent is Stomped by Genrush

2

Comments

  • Fenrir
    Fenrir Member Posts: 533
    DwightsLifeMatters said:
    Fenrir said:
    My_Dude said:

    Also he was going no perks, or add ons.

    A fully kitted out doc would have had the control needed to slow the game down.

     True but i believe even if the killer doesnt have perks or add-ons even at rank the killer should still have decent amount of control but killers are far to dependent on add-ons and perks
    Exactly. Killer needs addons and perks. And still can get stomped if survivors play optimal 
    Do you believe that killers base abilities need to be stronger in order to combat against rank 1s and swf groups?
  • Raptorrotas
    Raptorrotas Member Posts: 3,389

    @Fenrir said:
    DwightsLifeMatters said:


    Fenrir said:


    My_Dude said:

    Also he was going no perks, or add ons.

    A fully kitted out doc would have had the control needed to slow the game down.

     True but i believe even if the killer doesnt have perks or add-ons even at rank the killer should still have decent amount of control but killers are far to dependent on add-ons and perks

    Exactly. Killer needs addons and perks. And still can get stomped if survivors play optimal 

    Do you believe that killers base abilities need to be stronger in order to combat against rank 1s and swf groups?

    Wouldnt hurt testing that, but will never be tested on all killers at once , so it'd take multiple years.

  • DwightsLifeMatters
    DwightsLifeMatters Member Posts: 1,649
    Fenrir said:
    DwightsLifeMatters said:
    Fenrir said:
    My_Dude said:

    Also he was going no perks, or add ons.

    A fully kitted out doc would have had the control needed to slow the game down.

     True but i believe even if the killer doesnt have perks or add-ons even at rank the killer should still have decent amount of control but killers are far to dependent on add-ons and perks
    Exactly. Killer needs addons and perks. And still can get stomped if survivors play optimal 
    Do you believe that killers base abilities need to be stronger in order to combat against rank 1s and swf groups?
    I completely don't like how bhvr handles perks and addons in general. Perks and addons are meant to give you just a little boost or change your playstyle. Yet, perks and addons are so powerful that there isn't much space to build around it. The devs focused on balancing around perks and addons. Now, as a naked killer you will have such a hard time it's insane.
  • Bongbingbing
    Bongbingbing Member Posts: 1,423

    Kicking gens wouldn't have done much for him here, the group knew what they were doing, they would have just swapped between who's being chased and who's doing the gens.
    Most games I play get at least 2 gens done before my first hook unless I play Nurse, but 4 damn that's tough. The survivors did nothing wrong, the problem is with the game itself.
    If staying in a chase for 2 minutes is too long, when do you give up? 1 minute, 30 seconds? The amount of time it takes to catch and down a survivor on a lot of the other killers is nowhere close to the amount of time it takes to do gens.

  • DwightsLifeMatters
    DwightsLifeMatters Member Posts: 1,649
    Bongbingbing said:

    Kicking gens wouldn't have done much for him here, the group knew what they were doing, they would have just swapped between who's being chased and who's doing the gens.
    Most games I play get at least 2 gens done before my first hook unless I play Nurse, but 4 damn that's tough. The survivors did nothing wrong, the problem is with the game itself.
    If staying in a chase for 2 minutes is too long, when do you give up? 1 minute, 30 seconds? The amount of time it takes to catch and down a survivor on a lot of the other killers is nowhere close to the amount of time it takes to do gens.

    Exactly. People say he should have break the chase of the injured Laurie and go for another fully health survivor, who can sprint burst away after a hit to a save area and loop aswell. What would be the result? Even more time wasted.
    And people say that Laurie would have waste time healing but that's not guaranteed cuz we all know that survivors pump gens injured, especially if they have adrenalin.
  • Mister_Holdout
    Mister_Holdout Member Posts: 3,144

    Oh, I'll admit there are things Tru could have done better.

    But in the end, killers can't really compete with efficient survivors.

  • Rebel_Raven
    Rebel_Raven Member Posts: 1,775
    edited January 2019
    People making excuses for the gen rush saying he wasn't running perks, or some such.

    You do know there's killers out there that don't have optimal perks on all killers, right?

    People complaining that he made mistakes, well #########, we are human. 
    Blaming him for not playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 

    Also hindsight is 20/20.
    Moreover watching a game is leagues different from playing it. 
  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for  ot playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 
    Would you say that killers are overpowered because they can kill all 4 survivors in 3 minutes? Probably not. If killers can do that it's because survivors screwed it up, same with the gens.
    Yes we are all human and everyone makes mistakes, no one is discussing that, we are just pointing one of the reasons why he got genrushed like that.
  • Rebel_Raven
    Rebel_Raven Member Posts: 1,775
    Vietfox said:
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for  ot playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 
    Would you say that killers are overpowered because they can kill all 4 survivors in 3 minutes? Probably not. If killers can do that it's because survivors screwed it up, same with the gens.
    Yes we are all human and everyone makes mistakes, no one is discussing that, we are just pointing one of the reasons why he got genrushed like that.
    That's a horrible comparison. The difficulty between gen rushing, and killing 4 survivors in 3 minutes is astronomical. 

    Yeah, maybe if the stars align you can kill 4 survivors in 3 minutes, but gen rushing is vastly easier.
    The survivors would basically have to charge the killer in a suicidal frenzy, and kill themselves on first hook practically . 

    Point out the reasons all you like but that doesn't change that it happens, and a lot of the reasons are more common than you would think.

    I feel bad for anyone that feels like they have to play that optimally.
  • Arroz
    Arroz Member Posts: 1,433

    A lot of players want to nerf DS but they dont fix the rush... I hate more the rush than the ds .. in a game (swf) they repaired in my face and in 2 minutes they made 4 generators (with ruin and everyone injured with sloopy butcher)

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    @Vietfox said:
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for  ot playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 
    Would you say that killers are overpowered because they can kill all 4 survivors in 3 minutes? Probably not. If killers can do that it's because survivors screwed it up, same with the gens.
    Yes we are all human and everyone makes mistakes, no one is discussing that, we are just pointing one of the reasons why he got genrushed like that.
    That's a horrible comparison. The difficulty between gen rushing, and killing 4 survivors in 3 minutes is astronomical. 

    Yeah, maybe if the stars align you can kill 4 survivors in 3 minutes, but gen rushing is vastly easier.
    The survivors would basically have to charge the killer in a suicidal frenzy, and kill themselves on first hook practically . 

    Point out the reasons all you like but that doesn't change that it happens, and a lot of the reasons are more common than you would think.

    I feel bad for anyone that feels like they have to play that optimally.
    There are a few videos on YT as well where you can see killers ending the match with 4K in so little time, the key is to slug them all first and then hook them. It's not that difficult if survivors make mistakes, same for the killers when they get genrushed.
  • Master
    Master Member Posts: 10,200

    @HURRI_KAIN said:
    I wouldn't enjoy playing if killers were not able to "win" while a couple survivors also "win". It would result in only the sweatiest and try hard -est killers all the time.

    Thats what a competitive PVP game should be.
    Have you ever seen a match of CSGO overwatch or lol where both sides won? Nope, that would be ridiculous

  • Rebel_Raven
    Rebel_Raven Member Posts: 1,775
    Vietfox said:
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    @Vietfox said:
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for  ot playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 
    Would you say that killers are overpowered because they can kill all 4 survivors in 3 minutes? Probably not. If killers can do that it's because survivors screwed it up, same with the gens.
    Yes we are all human and everyone makes mistakes, no one is discussing that, we are just pointing one of the reasons why he got genrushed like that.
    That's a horrible comparison. The difficulty between gen rushing, and killing 4 survivors in 3 minutes is astronomical. 

    Yeah, maybe if the stars align you can kill 4 survivors in 3 minutes, but gen rushing is vastly easier.
    The survivors would basically have to charge the killer in a suicidal frenzy, and kill themselves on first hook practically . 

    Point out the reasons all you like but that doesn't change that it happens, and a lot of the reasons are more common than you would think.

    I feel bad for anyone that feels like they have to play that optimally.
    There are a few videos on YT as well where you can see killers ending the match with 4K in so little time, the key is to slug them all first and then hook them. It's not that difficult if survivors make mistakes, same for the killers when they get genrushed.
    I'm not saying it doesn't happen, I'm saying I seriously doubt that the level of mistakes survivors have to make are on par with the mistakes killers have to make. I really do.
    Slugging survivors requires certain builds, or certain killers to do decently, I imagine. 

    And some of these things pointed out as doing them wrong? Some killers can't avoid it thanks to RNG. Perks, I mean.
    I've plenty of killers lacking ruin, for instance. Or monitor and abuse.


  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    Vietfox said:
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    @Vietfox said:
    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for  ot playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 
    Would you say that killers are overpowered because they can kill all 4 survivors in 3 minutes? Probably not. If killers can do that it's because survivors screwed it up, same with the gens.
    Yes we are all human and everyone makes mistakes, no one is discussing that, we are just pointing one of the reasons why he got genrushed like that.
    That's a horrible comparison. The difficulty between gen rushing, and killing 4 survivors in 3 minutes is astronomical. 

    Yeah, maybe if the stars align you can kill 4 survivors in 3 minutes, but gen rushing is vastly easier.
    The survivors would basically have to charge the killer in a suicidal frenzy, and kill themselves on first hook practically . 

    Point out the reasons all you like but that doesn't change that it happens, and a lot of the reasons are more common than you would think.

    I feel bad for anyone that feels like they have to play that optimally.
    There are a few videos on YT as well where you can see killers ending the match with 4K in so little time, the key is to slug them all first and then hook them. It's not that difficult if survivors make mistakes, same for the killers when they get genrushed.

    And some of these things pointed out as doing them wrong? Some killers can't avoid it thanks to RNG. Perks, I mean.
    I've plenty of killers lacking ruin, for instance. Or monitor and abuse.


    Well, PvP games are like that, they require grinding. It's like when you do some pvp with a crappy armor against someone running a lvl 100 golden armor...
  • Alphaphalt
    Alphaphalt Member Posts: 259

    "even"

  • DwightsLifeMatters
    DwightsLifeMatters Member Posts: 1,649
    WalterWh1te said:

    Thats what happens when you play with ruin for 2 years and actually never learned how to pressure the map by making the right decisions at the right time.

    He did a no ruin challenge before tho.
  • PandaChris
    PandaChris Member Posts: 140
    edited January 2019

    Ya, he hasnt run ruin for a while up until recently just to provide a little less stress while playing killer. If you put yourself in any good viewership streamer shoes, im sure they get stream sniped and you got to communicate with your community while playing the game.

    I understand it was no addons or perks and he made a few mistakes. But being devils advocate here, i think the point again was should the objective be able to get done within 3 minutes even if the killer makes a few errors? Maybe someone has a link to a recent killer game at fairly high rank where the killers kills everyone within 3 minutes?

    Cause if one side has the possibility to do all the objectives within 3 minutes (roughly) lets say and the other side has the possibility to do the objective but it takes 5-6 minutes. Then isnt that an issue? im just throwing this out there. Im not taking sides. Just saying what i see.

    Edit - I guess what we have to think about is what is a win for a killer. Are we talking about a 4k, 3k, 2k. Cause if the objective for the killer is to kill about 2 people per round, then the time varies.

  • PandaChris
    PandaChris Member Posts: 140
    edited January 2019

    I watched the video and i understand its no addons or perks and he did make a few mistakes. But just being devils advocate here, i think the point was should the objectives be able to get done in 3 minutes (roughly) even when the killer makes a few mistakes? Does anyone have a recent killer video of highish ranks where the killer kills everyone in 3 minutes?

    Like for example. If one side has the possibility of completing the objective within 3 minutes and the other side has the possibility of completing the objective but its 5-6 minutes, isnt that unbalanced? I am not taking sides. Im just trying to look at it from a whole.

    Edit - I guess we also have to consider what is a win for the killer. Is it a 4k, 3k, 2k? cause if the objective is to kill only 2 survivors (the rest is a bonus) then the time would be much different if the objective for a win would be to kill all 4.

    Maybe if a win for the killer is 2k then the game needs to revolve around that. With the end game screen changing or bloodpoints being adjusted. Maybe that would make the game a overall better experience for some people.

  • TheBean
    TheBean Member Posts: 2,320
    edited January 2019

    Streamer sets themselves up for a challenge and plays a match....

    Fan sees video.... posts it up as a debate about gen rushing....

    Forums members critique video and streamer...

    Streamer comes to forums and sees people critiquing video and wonders why their video is even being used in such a discussion, since it was done as a challenge. Has to see people critiquing mistakes made in a goof match.

    Probably thinks.... And this person supposed to be one of my fans?

    Who needs enemies I guess. Thanks... "fan"

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @PandaChris said:
    Does anyone have a recent killer video of highish ranks where the killer kills everyone in 3 minutes?
    In less than 3 minutes:
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=78uI6Q2wyAc

    PandaChris said:
    i think the point was should the objectives be able to get done in 3 minutes (roughly) even when the killer makes a few mistakes? 
    Mistakes are what make you lose and that sounds fair to me, like when you are looping the killer and get downed because you got stuck at the killer shack hook.
  • PandaChris
    PandaChris Member Posts: 140
    edited January 2019

    @Vietfox said:
    In less than 3 minutes:

    Thanks for the video. So survivors have no issue with just being slugged? Is this the direction we want to go with the game? Not to mention he is downing with 1 hatchet throw using Iridescent Head.

    I think this video just shows under the right circumstances a slugging huntress with one of the best addon combinations in the game can win a game within 3 minutes.

    If you can find another video that would be great.

    Edit - I am sure you can find Mori games also. But do survivors actually want to face insta down builds and mori builds 99% of the time because thats the only way to compete with objective time?

  • Laakeri
    Laakeri Member Posts: 835

    Tru3 has like 5k hours and still doesnt know how to play shack?

    Impressive.

  • twistedmonkey
    twistedmonkey Member Posts: 4,307
    PandaChris said:

    @Vietfox said:
    In less than 3 minutes:

    Thanks for the video. So survivors have no issue with just being slugged? Is this the direction we want to go with the game? Not to mention he is downing with 1 hatchet throw using Iridescent Head.

    I think this video just shows under the right circumstances a slugging huntress with one of the best addon combinations in the game can win a game within 3 minutes.

    If you can find another video that would be great.

    Edit - I am sure you can find Mori games also. But do survivors actually want to face insta down builds and mori builds 99% of the time because thats the only way to compete with objective time?

    What is shows is what can happen like the original gen rush video shows but it's not the norm of games or else the average ratio of kills would not be around 55-60%.

    What can happen and what does happen are always two different scenarios.
  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @PandaChris said:

    @Vietfox said:
    In less than 3 minutes:

    Thanks for the video. So survivors have no issue with just being slugged? Is this the direction we want to go with the game? Not to mention he is downing with 1 hatchet throw using Iridescent Head.

    You said before that ending matches in so little time is unbalanced, does that mean then that devs should nerf iridescent heads? I don't think killer mains would like that. I'm not a killer main and i think IH are fine.
    Some survivors don't like being slugged, but we can't please everyone, right? People need to tell the difference between something being unfair and annoying. If devs nerfed everything that is annoying Doctor would be gone by now.

    Just look for more videos, i'm sure you can find them yourself.
  • Gardenia
    Gardenia Member Posts: 1,143
    You all really refuse to see there is a problem with this game and generators. The devs do need to add another objective, also why would he go for the gen almost done if even with him damaging it, survivors will go right back on it and the damage doesn't reduce much progress.
  • DwightsLifeMatters
    DwightsLifeMatters Member Posts: 1,649

    @Vietfox said:
    @PandaChris said:
    Does anyone have a recent killer video of highish ranks where the killer kills everyone in 3 minutes?

    In less than 3 minutes:

    PandaChris said:
    i think the point was should the objectives be able to get done in 3 minutes (roughly) even when the killer makes a few mistakes? 

    Mistakes are what make you lose and that sounds fair to me, like when you are looping the killer and get downed because you got stuck at the killer shack hook.

    you compared true, who did decisions which are either mistakes or not and depended on the situation and these survivors who dont even know what BBQ does. minor mistakes (at best) vs huge mistakes of the survivors. eerrr yeaaaa

  • PandaChris
    PandaChris Member Posts: 140
    edited January 2019

    @twistedmonkey said:
    What can happen and what does happen are always two different scenarios.

    I fully understand that. But you are now talking about % chance. What is more likely, getting gen rushed or having a huntress with not only Iridescent Head but with the combination that gives them 3 1 shot down hatchets. So i feel its flawed to say, ya you might get gen rushed 20% of the time (random number) but thats okay cause you might get a huntress with that loadout 5% of the time. Both can happen sure but that doesnt mean they should be compared just because they "can" happen.

    @Vietfox said:

    You said before that ending matches in so little time is unbalanced, does that mean then that devs should nerf iridescent heads? I don't think killer mains would like that. I'm not a killer main and i think IH are fine.
    Some survivors don't like being slugged, but we can't please everyone, right? People need to tell the difference between something being unfair and annoying. If devs nerfed everything that is annoying Doctor would be gone by now.

    Just look for more videos, i'm sure you can find them yourself.

    I never said that matches ending in so little time is unbalanced. Please do not put words in my mouth. I said if one side can end a game within 3 minutes and the other side also can but it takes 5-6 minutes then isnt that unbalanced? I never stated i feel its unbalanced. I was pointing out from a numbers stand point that something might be off.

    Then you showed me a video of a killer who has specific set of addons who can 1 shot down from range as a counter argument.

    The problem here is any set of 4 survivors can gen rush and we have how many killers that can 1 shot down for the whole game? Maybe if each killer had the ability to 1 shot down then then your example would hold more merit.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @DwightsLifeMatters said:

    @Vietfox said:
    @PandaChris said:
    Does anyone have a recent killer video of highish ranks where the killer kills everyone in 3 minutes?

    In less than 3 minutes:

    PandaChris said:
    i think the point was should the objectives be able to get done in 3 minutes (roughly) even when the killer makes a few mistakes? 

    Mistakes are what make you lose and that sounds fair to me, like when you are looping the killer and get downed because you got stuck at the killer shack hook.

    you compared true, who did decisions which are either mistakes or not and depended on the situation and these survivors who dont even know what BBQ does. minor mistakes (at best) vs huge mistakes of the survivors. eerrr yeaaaa

    Those weren't minor mistakes, but whatever.
    I've seen Tru3 playing and he's far from being good. Of course we can all make mistakes, but i saw him playing as a survivor and being chased by Billy. He was dropping every pallet while Billy was charging the chainsaw, what kind of experienced player does that? Any decent survivor knows that you gotta fake the drop and keep looping.
  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @PandaChris said:

    Twistedmonkey said:
    What can happen and what does happen are always two different scenarios.

    I fully understand that. But you are now talking about % chance. What is more likely, getting gen rushed or having a huntress with not only Iridescent Head but with the combination that gives them 3 1 shot down hatchets. So i feel its flawed to say, ya you might get gen rushed 20% of the time (random number) but thats okay cause you might get a huntress with that loadout 5% of the time. Both can happen sure but that doesnt mean they should be compared just because they "can" happen.

    @Vietfox said:

    You said before that ending matches in so little time is unbalanced, does that mean then that devs should nerf iridescent heads? I don't think killer mains would like that. I'm not a killer main and i think IH are fine.
    Some survivors don't like being slugged, but we can't please everyone, right? People need to tell the difference between something being unfair and annoying. If devs nerfed everything that is annoying Doctor would be gone by now.

    Just look for more videos, i'm sure you can find them yourself.

    I never said that matches ending in so little time is unbalanced. Please do not put words in my mouth. I said if one side can end a game within 3 minutes and the other side also can but it takes 5-6 minutes then isnt that unbalanced? I never stated i feel its unbalanced. I was pointing out from a numbers stand point that something might be off.

    Then you showed me a video of a killer who has specific set of addons who can 1 shot down from range as a counter argument.

    The problem here is any set of 4 survivors can gen rush and we have how many killers that can 1 shot down for the whole game? Maybe if each killer had the ability to 1 shot down then then your example would hold more merit.

    As you can see the video showed 4K in less than 3 minutes, Tru3's video shows FOUR (not 5) gens done in 3 minutes, so in this case took less time to get 4K than getting 4 gens done.

    Any killer can be a 1 shot killer with the right perks.
    I, for instance, am a hag main (not one shot killer) and only 1 out of 20 matches survivors manage to get all 5 gens done.

    You haven't said anything yet about nerfing Iridescent heads.
  • twistedmonkey
    twistedmonkey Member Posts: 4,307
    edited January 2019
    PandaChris said:

    @twistedmonkey said:
    What can happen and what does happen are always two different scenarios.

    I fully understand that. But you are now talking about % chance. What is more likely, getting gen rushed or having a huntress with not only Iridescent Head but with the combination that gives them 3 1 shot down hatchets. So i feel its flawed to say, ya you might get gen rushed 20% of the time (random number) but thats okay cause you might get a huntress with that loadout 5% of the time. Both can happen sure but that doesnt mean they should be compared just because they "can" happen.


    But that's the thing if the majority of matches are balanced as the kill ratio shows then does it not come down to the gen rush as shown in the video being the smaller percentage? If not there would be no rank 1 killers and they would not on average kill more than survive.

    I think the biggest issue in this whole game is some take it way too seriously, DBD has and never will be a highly competative game, the words the devs use most and fun and engaging now what is fun to players is subjective but to be truly competative in this game you need to play in certain ways most say are not exactly fun.

    Once people realise a game is for enjoyment, you don't always win and that the game is about grinding more than anything else maybe they will learn to relax a little and stop the whole us v them, nerf this buff this attitude which has always been the game of this game.

    I posted a video earlier where tru got a 4k 18 hours before the ops video with a no perk wraith, does that mean the Wraith is not balanced and too strong? That's a laughable comment to be fair but it proves a point as if this was such a major issue a some make it out to be it could never happen.
  • PandaChris
    PandaChris Member Posts: 140
    edited January 2019

    @Vietfox said:
    Any killer can be a 1 shot killer with the right perks.

    What perks allow a killer to 1 shot down all game and finish the game within 3 minutes?

    @Vietfox said:
    You haven't said anything yet about nerfing Iridescent heads.

    Because this isnt about nerfing iredescent heads or certain addons. That can be done in another thread. You might have to reread or have someone explain the point of this conversation to you cause i cannot keep repeating. I am not derailing from the original point.

  • Vietfox
    Vietfox Member Posts: 3,823
    @PandaChris said:

    @Vietfox said:
    Any killer can be a 1 shot killer with the right perks.

    What perks allow a killer to 1 shot all game and finish the game within 3 minutes?

    @Vietfox said:
    You haven't said anything yet about nerfing Iridescent heads.

    Because this isnt about nerfing iredescent heads or certain addons. You might have to reread or have someone explain the point of this conversation to you cause i cannot keep repeating.

    You said not all killers are a one shot killers, never talked about how much time takes to get 4K. Please reread.

    This isn't about nerfing IH, but if you think ending a match in less that 3 minutes is broken, unfair or whatever then that's why i'm asking you what do you think about IH. Please reread.
  • Gardenia
    Gardenia Member Posts: 1,143
    edited January 2019
    twistedmonkey said:
    PandaChris said:

    @twistedmonkey said:
    What can happen and what does happen are always two different scenarios.

    I fully understand that. But you are now talking about % chance. What is more likely, getting gen rushed or having a huntress with not only Iridescent Head but with the combination that gives them 3 1 shot down hatchets. So i feel its flawed to say, ya you might get gen rushed 20% of the time (random number) but thats okay cause you might get a huntress with that loadout 5% of the time. Both can happen sure but that doesnt mean they should be compared just because they "can" happen.


    But that's the thing if the majority of matches are balanced as the kill ratio shows then does it not come down to the gen rush as shown in the video being the smaller percentage? If not there would be no rank 1 killers and they would not on average kill more than survive.

    I think the biggest issue in this whole game is some take it way too seriously, DBD has and never will be a highly competative game, the words the devs use most and fun and engaging now what is fun to players is subjective but to be truly competative in this game you need to play in certain ways most say are not exactly fun.

    Once people realise a game is for enjoyment, you don't always win and that the game is about grinding more than anything else maybe they will learn to relax a little and stop the whole us v them, nerf this buff this attitude which has always been the game of this game.

    I posted a video earlier where tru got a 4k 18 hours before the ops video with a no perk wraith, does that mean the Wraith is not balanced and too strong? That's a laughable comment to be fair but it proves a point as if this was such a major issue a some make it out to be it could never happen.
    Well then they need to make up their damn minds on whether they want it to be a competitive game or a casual game. I'm tired of this pseudo competitive BS, why include a rank if their going to do that. They could've add another way of separating experienced season players from the non experienced players. Why the hell is their a reset? They've been teetering on this edge for so long, and they don't change any of the core mechanics. Honestly, they themselves have encouraged a competitive playstyle and as such you have both sides going to extremes.
  • PandaChris
    PandaChris Member Posts: 140
    edited January 2019

    @Vietfox said:
    You said not all killers are a one shot killers, never talked about how much time takes to get 4K. Please reread.

    I was phrasing my comment in relation to the point we were discussing. I thought that was clear and didnt have to say every single time something to the effect of "all killers that can one shot all game within 3 minutes" because that was the point.

    Post edited by PandaChris on
  • twistedmonkey
    twistedmonkey Member Posts: 4,307
    edited January 2019
    Gardenia said:

    Well then they need to make up their damn minds on whether they want it to be a competitive game or a casual game. I'm tired of this pseudo competitive BS, why include a rank if their going to do that. They could've add another way of separating experienced season players from the non experienced players. Why the hell is their a reset? They've been teetering on this edge for so long, and they don't change any of the core mechanics. Honestly, they themselves have encouraged a competitive playstyle and as such you have both sides going to extremes.
    How players interpreters the game is up to them, personally I haven't heard them call the game competative in a hardcore sense, yes they put a killer versus survivor but how competative it is comes down to how you perceive it is.

    The rank system has never been competative it has always been about how much time you had to play, its a  grind to give a sense that you are achieving something nothing more, anyone that has played more than 50 hours should see that and most posters here will argue rank means nothing.

    The emblem system also shows they want you to do more than just the sole objective, what does this say to you? To myself it says they want more interaction with all the players not simply down and dead or do gens and out.

    Now in a highly competative game you would be highly rewarded for doing your sole objective with optional extras so how the players choose to take the game is down to each one of them.
  • Theluckyboi
    Theluckyboi Member Posts: 1,113

    @Fenrir said:
    This just proves that this game is truly unbalanced

    Lets face it, genrush is just a poor excuse bad killers use when they are uncapable of applying enough map pressure, you must be blind to not notice all the mistakes he made in the video

  • Fenrir
    Fenrir Member Posts: 533
    Theluckyboi said:

    @Fenrir said:
    This just proves that this game is truly unbalanced

    Lets face it, genrush is just a poor excuse bad killers use when they are uncapable of applying enough map pressure, you must be blind to not notice all the mistakes he made in the video

    Nobodys perfect and if you have to be literally perfect and cant make a few mistakes the game seriously needs some fixs
  • ChesterTheMolester
    ChesterTheMolester Member Posts: 2,771
    edited January 2019
    Theluckyboi said:

    @Fenrir said:
    This just proves that this game is truly unbalanced

    Lets face it, genrush is just a poor excuse bad killers use when they are uncapable of applying enough map pressure, you must be blind to not notice all the mistakes he made in the video

    That'd be true if all Killers could apply the same kind of pressure equally. 
    You cannot chase and pressure gens at the same time, or even switch within a reasonable timeframe due to the hooking, maps and mobility.

    BHVR often balances out chasing potential with poor pressure, most notably Freddy and Huntress.

    Freddy has an ability that easily pressures multiple people at the same time, and perhaps the best stalling in the game but lacks any chasing unless the survivors either don't know how to mindgame or are dumb enough to run into deadzones during a hit and run.

    Huntress is the opposite by being among the best chasers, but the frequent locker visits and 110% mm with a giant directional lullaby that makes it easy to hide basicly risks giving up any and all pressure fast, and you can only perform as good as the map allows you to.

    Same apply to Clown, Hag, Wraith, Doctor and Myers. All Killers who viability vary the most depending which you ask.
  • jordirex
    jordirex Member Posts: 204
    You Talk about true like he was good or top. He is a decent player, but not more
  • BACKSTABBER
    BACKSTABBER Member Posts: 1,809

    @Fenrir said:
    This just proves that this game is truly unbalanced

    TT played awful there anyways

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068

    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People making excuses for the gen rush saying he wasn't running perks, or some such.

    You do know there's killers out there that don't have optimal perks on all killers, right?

    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for not playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 

    Also hindsight is 20/20.
    Moreover watching a game is leagues different from playing it. 

    Speaking of people making excuses you just dropped some big whoppers of ones.

    We're not talking about other killers here but nice Red Herring there since Tru has all the optimal perks and he chose to play without them or addons on a mid tier killer.

    Well that's funny since quite often you people use Tru and others as examples when it fits your argument but now it's he made mistakes because he's human.

    Again you use him and other streamers as examples but when he's doing well as a killer it's because the survivors were potatoes. It's not because they weren't playing optimal or that they're human and so make mistakes.

    Oh good grief the excuses are so bad it's funny, stop making excuses for why he did badly.

    Also more excuses since if he did that as a survivor you'd use a different excuse.

    Lastly more excuses and fallacies because you just can't accept yours and the ops arguments are full of holes.

  • Rebel_Raven
    Rebel_Raven Member Posts: 1,775
    powerbats said:

    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People making excuses for the gen rush saying he wasn't running perks, or some such.

    You do know there's killers out there that don't have optimal perks on all killers, right?

    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for not playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 

    Also hindsight is 20/20.
    Moreover watching a game is leagues different from playing it. 

    Speaking of people making excuses you just dropped some big whoppers of ones.

    We're not talking about other killers here but nice Red Herring there since Tru has all the optimal perks and he chose to play without them or addons on a mid tier killer.

    Well that's funny since quite often you people use Tru and others as examples when it fits your argument but now it's he made mistakes because he's human.

    Again you use him and other streamers as examples but when he's doing well as a killer it's because the survivors were potatoes. It's not because they weren't playing optimal or that they're human and so make mistakes.

    Oh good grief the excuses are so bad it's funny, stop making excuses for why he did badly.

    Also more excuses since if he did that as a survivor you'd use a different excuse.

    Lastly more excuses and fallacies because you just can't accept yours and the ops arguments are full of holes.

    You just wasted a lot of time saying a whole lot of  nothing, there. 
    I mean that was pretty pointless. 
    "Wah! Excuses! How dare you complain about an unfun tactic, and defend someone who didn't play robot perfect with a stacked loadout!"

    And?

    It's not full of holes, you're just grasping at your usual "take responsibility, git gud" approach that is basically useless against me because I don't have the sort of ego you hope I do.
    I have enough sense to see that gen rush isn't fun, and killers aren't all robot perfect players with perfect loadouts.
    I have enough sense to see that this game isn't perfect, survivors aren't all angels, and not everything is entirely the killers fault.

  • powerbats
    powerbats Member Posts: 7,068
    edited January 2019

    @Rebel_Raven said:

    You just wasted a lot of time saying a whole lot of  nothing, there. 
    I mean that was pretty pointless. 
    "Wah! Excuses! How dare you complain about an unfun tactic, and defend someone who didn't play robot perfect with a stacked loadout!"

    And?

    It's not full of holes, you're just grasping at your usual "take responsibility, git gud" approach that is basically useless against me because I don't have the sort of ego you hope I do.
    I have enough sense to see that gen rush isn't fun, and killers aren't all robot perfect players with perfect loadouts.
    I have enough sense to see that this game isn't perfect, survivors aren't all angels, and not everything is entirely the killers fault.

    Translation you once again CAN'T refute my points so you resort to more of the excuses and deflections.

    It's amazing you say you have enough sense but then go the typical troll route and use logical fallacies like they're candy.

    You claim you know yet when the killer screws up it's not the killers fault it's the take responsibility deflection.

    When the killer does good, it's not the killer was good it's the survivors were potatoes excuse from you.

    Each and every time you come up with excuses, deflections or blame anything but where the problem lies in that situation.

    Oh and I've faced some rank 2 killers today running no perks and no addons and they still managed to 3 and 4k us because they didn't play like tru did in that video.

    Proof that when the killer plays right they win oh and the people on ehre that 4k as perkless Freddy say hi oh and Monto says hi with his over 100 straight 4k games.

  • PiiFree
    PiiFree Member Posts: 1,160

    The depip squad has already proven that even perkless survivors have no problem stomping fully slotted high rank Killers.

    At that point it's just ignorance of the community and developers, nothing more.

    Remember the discussions pre depip squad?

    "Killer mains be like; We can escape all the time... If that's true I want proof!" A typical statement of Survivors.

    Few weeks later the depip squad provided results from their "experiments", the proof everyone sceptical asked for.

    "Not everyone plays like that!" was the new excuse.

    Then we see No0b3 getting 23x escapes in a row in high rank.

    "He got carried by a friend!" the next excuse.

    This made me realize that you can't make a point in a community full of pure ignorant. Every high skilled survivor will agree that Killers have no chance against coordinated high skilled survivors, the Killers skill is mostly irrelevant.

  • weirdkid5
    weirdkid5 Member Posts: 2,144
    edited January 2019

    @PiiFree said:
    The depip squad has already proven that even perkless survivors have no problem stomping fully slotted high rank Killers.

    At that point it's just ignorance of the community and developers, nothing more.

    Remember the discussions pre depip squad?

    "Killer mains be like; We can escape all the time... If that's true I want proof!" A typical statement of Survivors.

    Few weeks later the depip squad provided results from their "experiments", the proof everyone sceptical asked for.

    "Not everyone plays like that!" was the new excuse.

    Then we see No0b3 getting 23x escapes in a row in high rank.

    "He got carried by a friend!" the next excuse.

    This made me realize that you can't make a point in a community full of pure ignorant. Every high skilled survivor will agree that Killers have no chance against coordinated high skilled survivors, the Killers skill is mostly irrelevant.

    Any Killer that isn't Nurse, Billy, Huntress, or Clown pretty much requires the Survivors to make mistakes, and even Clown has problems. Pretty much 75% of the Killer selection is unviable against top level Survivors, and unless it's Nurse, you're still gonna have to sweat as Billy or Clown.

    The reason I dislike the game currently is because it is far too easy to play and win as a Survivor. Even when I die, it doesn't really matter as long as I get enough to rank up. All I lose is Bloodpoints, which is irrelevant for me as I only play one Survivor and have everything on her already. Why would I want to grind out on someone else?

    I pretty much need to go perkless if I want any modicum of a challenge in this game as a Survivor. The game was fun for the first 800 hours. But after pretty much having a win ratio of about 80%, the game has exhausted all sense of reward from me. This is the most glaring issue for long time players.

    This is why I feel many usually just resort to troll tactics and other shenanigans, because the Killers can't reasonably do anything about Survivors who taunt them with their skill and superior mobility around tight objects. I use the term 'skill' very loosely here, because even without looping, it isn't very difficult to run the Killer around for 3+ minutes if you have good navigation around the map.

  • Rebel_Raven
    Rebel_Raven Member Posts: 1,775
    powerbats said:

    @Rebel_Raven said:

    You just wasted a lot of time saying a whole lot of  nothing, there. 
    I mean that was pretty pointless. 
    "Wah! Excuses! How dare you complain about an unfun tactic, and defend someone who didn't play robot perfect with a stacked loadout!"

    And?

    It's not full of holes, you're just grasping at your usual "take responsibility, git gud" approach that is basically useless against me because I don't have the sort of ego you hope I do.
    I have enough sense to see that gen rush isn't fun, and killers aren't all robot perfect players with perfect loadouts.
    I have enough sense to see that this game isn't perfect, survivors aren't all angels, and not everything is entirely the killers fault.

    Translation you once again CAN'T refute my points so you resort to more of the excuses and deflections.

    It's amazing you say you have enough sense but then go the typical troll route and use logical fallacies like they're candy.

    You claim you know yet when the killer screws up it's not the killers fault it's the take responsibility deflection.

    When the killer does good, it's not the killer was good it's the survivors were potatoes excuse from you.

    Each and every time you come up with excuses, deflections or blame anything but where the problem lies in that situation.

    Oh and I've faced some rank 2 killers today running no perks and no addons and they still managed to 3 and 4k us because they didn't play like tru did in that video.

    Proof that when the killer plays right they win oh and the people on ehre that 4k as perkless Freddy say hi oh and Monto says hi with his over 100 straight 4k games.

    Your arguments are extremely poor. I don't care if I refute them or not because they are meaningless. 

    If I'm trolling you, then it's unintentional. If you don't like it, stop replying to my stuff. Simple as that.

    Killers don't always play robot perfect, and/or have the perks you'd recommend. 
    Not sure why that is so hard for you to grasp.

    I didn't say ######### about survivors being potatoes, or most of the other stuff you heaped upon me over the past few posts, bluntly. I'd appreciate it if you didn't lump me in with other people. I am an individual with my own view.

    Your bravado doesn't mean ######### to me. At all. No one's bluster means anything to me.
    Infact the better you do, the more out of touch you are with what I run into which really hurts your arguments. We're looking at things at 2 different ends of the spectrum.
    Again, your bravado means jack ######### to me. Especially if you can't prove it. Relying on it so much is going to make it harder to just take you at your word.

    I've stated my point clearly. I'll do it again.
    Killers don't always have the perks you would recommend, don't always play perfect, and survivors are not Angel's and are capable of unfun tactics.
  • Master
    Master Member Posts: 10,200

    @jordirex said:
    You Talk about true like he was good or top. He is a decent player, but not more

    Its not as if the survivor he versed were good or top

  • RepliCant
    RepliCant Member Posts: 1,436
    edited January 2019

    @Rebel_Raven said:
    People making excuses for the gen rush saying he wasn't running perks, or some such.

    You do know there's killers out there that don't have optimal perks on all killers, right?

    People complaining that he made mistakes, well [BAD WORD], we are human. 
    Blaming him for not playing ultra optimal at all times?
    So a killer has far less margin for error? 

    I want to point out the fact that in Tru3's video description, it reads

    " They did the objective very optimally thus making the game unwinnable without being lame and them running into an unsafe hook."

    If he dictates that the Survivors had done their objective optimally, while everyone pointing out various mistakes made by Tru3, this video becomes irrelevant. Tru3 was NOT playing optimally and therefore got outplayed.

    Mind you, the depip squad's experiment is out of date. DbD has undergone various (and many) changes since then and is no longer in a bad state.

  • PiiFree
    PiiFree Member Posts: 1,160

    @Brady said:
    If he dictates that the Survivors had done their objective optimally, while everyone pointing out various mistakes made by Tru3, this video becomes irrelevant. Tru3 was NOT playing optimally and therefore got outplayed.

    Mind you, the depip squad's experiment is out of date. DbD has undergone various (and many) changes since then and is no longer in a bad state.

    I was waiting for something like that.

    What about No0b3's 50 consecutive escapes in red rank? That was a month ago.

  • RepliCant
    RepliCant Member Posts: 1,436

    @PiiFree said:

    @Brady said:
    If he dictates that the Survivors had done their objective optimally, while everyone pointing out various mistakes made by Tru3, this video becomes irrelevant. Tru3 was NOT playing optimally and therefore got outplayed.

    Mind you, the depip squad's experiment is out of date. DbD has undergone various (and many) changes since then and is no longer in a bad state.

    I was waiting for something like that.

    What about No0b3's 50 consecutive escapes in red rank? That was a month ago.

    I can pull that off. Anyone can. A good Killer could pull off consecutive 4ks in matches if they're good enough.

    That's when it comes down to skill? Also, if you followed him, then you'd know there were countless people who let him go, and (I could be wrong on this one) he was in SWF atleast a 2-man from my understanding.

    Alas, are we forgetting what optimal means?
    op·ti·mal
    /ˈäptəməl/Submit
    adjective
    best or most favorable; optimum.
    "seeking the optimal solution"

    If the survivors are playing in the best way possible, and the killer isn't, of course he's going to lose (sh00k). It means they played their role better than he played his.

    I've had killers demolish with a 4K at ease, and others struggle it was a 4 minute match. For all roles, for the entire game, I recommend Dr. Herman Carter's diagnosis.
    Git Gud