http://dbd.game/killswitch
So still no ghoul changes huh?
Comments
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Stop the cap We tried to fix the tunneling which in your own is universally hated but that got shut down, scrapped and made pallet density scarce by entitled Killer players afraid they can't tunnel someone out at 5 gens.
Furthermore Ghoul has a very high pick rate due to how easy of an S-tier he is you can't go without a session of having to dredge through a bunch of matches going against ghoul as Survivor. It's no over exaggeration when people say Ghoul is the most hated Killer for a good reason.
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We don't know that it was "completely scrapped" they tried multiple times with it and failed because they were going about it the wrong way. But nowhere have they confirmed that they just "aren't doing it anymore" as far as we know its still happening while they revisit the implementation of the changes for a later PTB.
Secondly, Ghoul does not have a "very high pick rate" that is massively higher than other killers. If you go by nightlight.gg, ghoul has about a 5% pick rate. That means you see ghoul in 1 out of every 20 games. While that is unofficial data, the last time BHVR released official stats, yes the data showed Ghoul's pick rate at about 5% for japan, and 4% for the world. So going by official stats across all players, its actually 1 in 25 games
There are currently 41 killers in the game. So if there were an even distribution of killer players on every killer, you'd see an average pick rate of about 2.5%. So You see ghoul a little under twice as often as you would assuming a purely even distribution. Which again, in the grand scheme of (1 out of every 25 games) that ain't it chief.
And again, looking at nightlight.gg Ghoul has a kill rate of about 49.84%, pretty much dead even at 50% (which actually if you look at the devs stated goal of 60% kill rate is quite bad, but that is a different discussion), and the last official stats didn't give us kill rates, but put ghoul at EIGHT in terms of lethal killers, with the top 10 being:
- Lich
- Freddy
- Sadako
- Dredge
- Pig
- Twins
- Blight
- Ghoul
- Skull Merchant
- Oni
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Uh there are almost 40 killers in the game, if ghoul is top 5 and he has just came out this year that is a pretty high pick rate if he is beating 35 other killers. all the other killers on this list bar spring trap are older killers.
edit; you mention nightlight, nightlight stats are useless and are fan made. I could go and only upload my loses to nightlight and just withhold all the wins.2 -
I literally linked you the OFFICIAL stats. And yeah, he's top 5, but again, do the math. With a 4% pick rate (official stats remember, nightlight actually says he's higher). That means you see him in 1 out of every 25 games. An average game of DBD lasting about 8-10 minutes, even on the low end that means you see Ghoul about once every 3.5 hours of gameplay. Which is pretty significant.
Also if you actually read my post (which it is obvious you didn't) i told you there are 41 killers, not "almost 40"
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I'm not disputing official stats as in the picture you showed, just the part in comment where nightlight is used as they are fan made and can be manipulated by the people who upload (just not uploaded matches that are lost or won)
He is still top 5 in pick rate meaning he is on the higher end of killer that are picked being tied for second/ third out of 41 is not a low pick rate. regardless I don't think if a killer is unfun to verse should be ignored just because his pick rate is low.0 -
Thats not my point. My point is that the Ghoul can very easily join their ranks if he gets kneecapped to appease people just venting their frustration instead of providing actual feedback about the things that frustrate them without any clear focus or direction. You haven't really made any points to try to change my mind, you just keep trying to shift your arguments away from my points on the subject. In case it wasn't obvious, I'd like to see the Ghoul get nerfs, but specifically ones that don't involve gutting him then putting him on the backburner for years awaiting a proper evaluation. If your main reason for hating him is frustration, you shouldn't even be arguing with me in the first place.
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Dude, I work in IT. I deal with tickets. I know the process. I've written literal essays on why things are too strong/too weak, giving videos, pictures, given examples, given tweaks in numbers that could be implemented within 1 update just to see if it has impact or not. 2 years ago, that would have 100% lead to change. Not neccesarily the suggested change, but change nonetheless to the killer. All because people who have 400+ hours into a specific killer giving feedback on why things do and dont work. And some of the changes were better, other changes made things worse and were altered relatively quickly again.
The past 1.5 years? The only times posts would lead to change, is if they reached live streams or twitter outrage. That alone is terrible indication.
My guess? Oh, yknow, the 95 people that were laid off about 2 years ago, mainly marketing, which includes community managers and mods that would actually read posts on here and create tickets to send them to the proper places. Not saying the current mods and managers aren't doing so, but 100% there are less people being able to do so, so constructive feedback simply isnt good enough anymore. It has to go semi-viral before it's noticed, which is why yelling works better than feedback right now.
I am not pointing at any specific part of the feedback process being at fault, but it's been broken. I've reported bugs the way I do at my own job, which includes how to repeat it, when I first noticed it, when I confirmed it, everything involved with it and even guesses what the culprit could be based on testing. And being very honest, I know for a fact the people I work with work less hard than the devs at bhvr, because we have 1/5th the amount of people, but the size of our releases are 1/10th of BHVR. Yet, if anyone sends in a report, that bug is fixed within the next year, even if it's just a typo somewhere. I've seen bigger bugs go unfixed for the past 1.5 years that would usually be fixed within 3 months. Once again, all because the feedback system currently doesnt work as it should. So despite creating a ticket the way I do at work so that it can go to a program like Jira pretty much copy-pasted, with screenshots, with details, it's odd that it doesnt get fixed or killswitched untill enough people find out to actually abuse it, people yell on live streams and twitter because now it's negatively affecting their games.
Remember the OoO bug where your aura reveal to your teammates would DC your teammates? I reported that 3 weeks before it got viral, in that same period of time, DC penalties were disabled. When it got viral, OoO got killswtiched and it was fixed 1 week later with a hotfix. Implying they were working on a ticket before it got viral and just using as muiive data to gather info on where it goes wrong. Remember the Streetwise bug? That was known and reported on the PTB feedback page, 6 weeks prior to release. Then it got send to live, 3 days later, it went viral. 2 days after that, it got killswitched and didnt get fixed for about a month. Implying that they were unaware of the bug at all, because they could have killswitched it going live, simply saying it was temporarily bugged. THAT is the difference these days. I dont know why that is such a hard concept to grasp.4 -
Hopefully the devs stop being ignorant on the matter and fix it soon, I can't tell you how many of my friends the killer has scared away from the game.
You need to deal with the s-tiers if you want a casual survivor player base.4 -
Just goes to show that the devs largely ignore Ghoul whine threads. Stay salty
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I think the hinder when he is vaulting behind you enraged should either A) have no hinder on survivor if it will stay same speed as now or B) shoul be longer than now little bit if the hinder on survivor while he is vaulting will stay.
Second thing is he should be able to hit survivor only with leap if the survivor is in 14 meters range same as objects because I believe now you can leap towards survivor after first leap with another one that causes damage into deep wound for bigger distance than those 14 meters thats like changes he needs the most plus some addons change like the iri mask.
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Those buffs she got now didnt do much only made her more usefull especialy using her power in chase because drones scan can hit survivors when they are vaulting which wasnt possible before but thats like the most significant change from those she got and she is still worth of dog …… in terms of power.
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Its truly unbelievable that this No Skill Trash Killer still exists in the game in its current state.
People keep giving up against him.
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1 in 25 games.
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Since you work in IT, lets start there. If you have an issue that is taking time to fix, and one person messages or emails you with information that can fix the problem, thats great, right? Even if they're not giving you the solution, they might be helping you isolate its cause. But instead of seeing that message, you have to go through thousands of
GOOGLE WONT WORK FIX NOW,maybe a few long winded rant sessions about how they need the situation resolved by 2pm or it'll cost them a major client, and other unconstructive junk pours in emphasizing urgency over anything remotely helpful, does that not clog up the pipeline? hell, its literally comparable to spam mail vs important messages, and the entire reason why we have filters for those in the first place.I feel like you're operating under the assumption I'm somehow defending BHVR's handling of feedback, which I have actually been vocal about on a few occasions over the years. Hell, the pallets comments in the livechat were a great example of how they tried to play off feedback as being vapid when it was about a very hot topic in the game at the time. I'm saying that the more you clog up feedback channels with insipid whining, the more you give them excuse to ignore you. Your militant perspective has had successes in the past with the game, and very rarely have they been positive for the game's health as a result. I talk about how they monkey paw user feedback constantly by not understanding what its supposed to mean, and just going off of their kneejerk reaction to it. When entire killers, who are unique across the entire roster (though some have obnoxiously copied aspects) are in the balance, your choices have a direct impact on a significant portion of the customer base. That means that regardless of how important small changes are, their further reaching consequences are equally-if-not-more important to consider, which is why these decisions should be made on actual feedback, and not just generalized dissatisfaction.
I'm saying you're literally giving them the fuel and excuses to do exactly what you accuse them of. If the only feedback they get is constructive, it becomes significantly harder to ignore. And since there is no transparency on how these things are handled internally past things like the dev streams and the product that sees at least a PTB, that fact is crucial to actually having your voice heard and not giving plausable deniability to it when its actually sound advice.
Edit: in regards to when it does work, I'd like you to equally consider when it doesn't. Note how your examples are about bugs and not balance. That in itself makes them much more clearly identifiable and less subjective. Meanwhile CoH stayed overtuned for a very long time, Overbrine actually saw the light of day and stuck around for far too long, and MFT eventually got nerfed by the same arguments that were being presented in its beta. The constant is that we can't control how BHVR takes our suggestions or even evidence, but if the bulk of it is just focused on general dissatisfaction, that prioritizes speed over quality in a reaction, and is why we have so much useless content in the game from items to perks to addons to whole characters. We want less digital garbage in our game, not more, and if you are willing to dumpster things without even trying reasonable solutions, you're kinda robbing people of content they likely paid for.
Post edited by Ryuhi on-4 -
Ken is fine, all of you are just showing how horrid you are at looping. If you struggle against this killer it's literally just because you were crutching on that W key against everyone else
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How dense. The main reason people have problems with things is frustration due to poor balancing and design that's Ghouls whole problem. Proper nerfs won't drop him to F tier like SM he'll just drop to A-tier so quit defending ghoul fearing for an SM treatment.
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How dense.Have a good day.
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It always does make me wonder what type of killer these types of players want to go against.
- They complain about the macro gameplay map control killers like skull merchant and knight and sadako (who then gets nerfed and reworked 10 times).
- They complain about anti-loop killers and ask BHVR to stop making those.
- They complain about the anti-shift+w killers like ghoul and blight and complain about those.
- They complain about stealth and hit and run style killers like wraith.
Like legit, at this point what type of killer do you want to play against? Because at this point it seems like you don't want to play against any of them.
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I imagine that I would prefer to play against bad killers. The type does not matter. Just make them useless so that I can escape. Please and thank you.
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So you dont want improove anything just demand that everything is given to you for free and made so easy that its hard for messing it up, your responce sounds like that.
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He is a-tier Idk why people think there is more than two kilers in s-tier, ghoul cant outplay loops so easily as blight or nurse and is even worse on some of them than billy or dracula,larry so he cant be s-tier because the s-tier ghoul is gone for long time now.
Some nerfs are needed but not nerfs like to chucky or smerchant (overnerfing quite big problem form devs used back than a lot especialy on killers sometimes for no valid reasons that created even memes like "nerf the pig").
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They just want killers who are solely M1 so they can run around pallets without needing to think about anything.
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Some people do, but I think the majority of survivors are logical and don't have issues with hardly any killers.
Some of my fav killers to verse are DND vecna, Drac, Wesker, Springtrap. Non m1s.
I cannot say the same for Ghoul and he is the only killer I would say them being in the game in current form is problematic for the health of the game. (blights are much more bearable then the ghoul, especially one without the speed ad ons, nurse is only problematic on maps like Midwhich that have different levels and aura builds, but then I also think blight and nurse takes time to learn, where the ghoul isn't that and is very easy to use at any skill level compared to them)0 -
So like the average killer player?
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Nurse is only problematic on midwitch and small maps with aura read (you said it kinda) which is true but thing is its not aura read but the fact she can see auras while using her power. I think she would need only adjustment now that she can only see aura while charging blink for 2-3 seconds and then just aura effects go blind like on spirit while phasing untill she uses her power and can see auras normaly (the small few seconds linger of aura perks is there because she cant chase like other killers so her only way of getting hits and chase are her blinks so that small few seconds window is good idea because if you nerf her aura read compleatly like its on spirit than only few will be usable on nurse and the nurse palyers will target more gen slowdown and endgame perks which isnt fun either and now we cant get maps on demand like before so its kinda justified).
Some may suggest nerfs for nurse I think only rework is here to do actual good and wont harm her as nerfs because people forget she is only killer that is 100% dependent on her power she cant just run you down like trapper (115% speed killer) or 110% killers like hag she is slower than survivors so she cant even build bloodlust to catch up, thats why nerfs wont help here much only the aura one I mentioned (she cant instadown because her blink attacks are special attack and she has charges on blinks).
Nurse is still way less forgiving compare to blight esecialy without that addon that makes her lunge after second blink 30% longer she just has to be very precise or she wont get anything compare to blight who still is effected by pallets but has strongest power in entire game with cooldowns that are joke compare to other killers like chucky or spirit (only argument we can make here is that blight is harder to use which is true mechanicaly he is hard but not that much to have so small cooldowns or being 115 speed).
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What is average killer player, see you put here question that doesnt have simple answer compare to one I reacted to before.
Who is average killer player blight,ghoul,trapper compare to you he clearly stated what are "bad killers" he wants to face so take your wide spectrum and make it clear.
If you mean that majority of killer players doesnt want to improove thats your oppinion but I think you only put almost 50% of killer players into one bag generalizing them and only making akward us vs them comment. Did I made something generalizing statement on survivor? I didnt only summarized his comment that clearly states he just wants to play against weaker opponest so he can win which clearly means he just doesnt want to improove, thats like if I would say "the second pallet density update that made loops super weak should have stayed because i want ti have easy games" but to your luck I was clearly against both of them (excluding few maps like haddonfiel from the first pallet density update that were needed to maps that had bad loops or some coldwind maps).
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They nerfed Hillybilly into the GROUND for having less mobility than Ghoul.
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I dont think so they just made overdrive speed little bit smaller but billy still has great mobilityand catch up only thing is he has way worse turn rate especialy without boots addon (purple one that was nerfed from like 44% to 30% trun rate and made higher rarity so its less common in blood web from green to purple now its blue to purple), billy goes fast but more in straights line so maps like larrys or even now midwitch (so many random lockers and bs in the halls its so bad for his mobility) are bad for his mobility but he is very strong killer capable mayn things and has huge skill requirement probably higher than blight (same mechanical from the start) but once billy and blight players progress billy is still hard compare to blight who gets way easier after like 10-20 games where player understands how his dashes work.
Ghoul and blight have more options in terms of turning or changing direction which is something billy doesnt have and than his mobility is way more map dependent and can feel way worse than these two killers but in terms of numbers billy in straight line without obstacles (and especialy in overdrive mode where his speed increases) he is faster than these two getting across the map but only in straight line which isnt happening often not even on farm maps where are random objects in corn fields now too compare to old days.
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Quite funny. Youre just assuming things on his post and accuse me of "just generalizing". Quite the doublestandadrs, dont you think?
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That assuming was just a space for him to explain it more because thats post I reacted on
AlanWoke:
"I imagine that I would prefer to play against bad killers. The type does not matter. Just make them useless so that I can escape. Please and thank you."you can clearly see that he just cares about escaping with no interest of having some chalange or working for his escape and didnt expalin it thats why I put assume word there.
Back to your post of me generalazing here. Did I used some words like "average survivors" or average killers" or anything like some bigger group here?
I didnt you did.
I only reacted on him and him alone not using some larger group and putting all of the people from that group into one bag and generileze them there? I didnt unlike you did so stop your gaslighting here.
You reacted on my answer to him with these words:
"So like the average killer player?"Which is clear question that is generalizing some group of people and quite off the track, so your gaslight isnt quite well done and only one who is generalizing here is you I just reacted on one and only person and gave him some space to explain it but he didnt and them you came with your
"So like the average killer player?"quote here.0 -
I think it's less "these types of players" and more you are taking complaints from multiple players and treating like its near enough everyone who has a problem with the killer.
Most people I know and play with only really truly hate Ghoul/Blight when it comes to playing. Nurse too but you barely see her rn.
I do see people making the complaints you talk about, but its hardly the same type of players, most core survivor players agree Ghoul is the worst thing they've added in a long while.0
