Why do killers slug for the 4k so much
Comments
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It happens plenty enough times for people to be raising concerns and questions about it.
And no, they don't bleed out for 4 minutes because the moved to hide. It's because they were left alone while they go find the hiding survivor.
You seem to get tilted enough to where you won't do it and instead make it a point of contention.
And yes, it's a pvp game, there will be BM'ing. You have to have tougher skin. Not sure what else to tell you.-5 -
You don't need to tell me anything, again, it doesn't bother me half as much as you think it does.
You also answered your own rhetoric, it is indeed a PvP game, and as far as I know, there is no rule against slugging either, barring the dissatisfaction it seems to cause.
I am merely pointing out that you can't say one thing is bad for one part of the game and then say well the other side has to get over it. Doesn't work that way because that is what we call a double standard.
Thrice and done i'd say, just going to have to agree to disagree on this one.-1 -
I personally disagree that having the choice between pushing survivors out in 10 seconds while watching them tbag and waiting max 2 minutes for the game to end is nearly the same as having the "choice" of being stuck in a game with a slugging for the 4k killer for up to 10 minutes depending on how they play and getting yourself killed / eating a DC penalty and losing all your bp. At least the survivor on the ground will be able to abandon after a few minutes sat on the ground, but the other survivor has no such thing.
But even if you still think these are equal, the other difference is that the problem I posted on has clear solutions. People have numerous times suggested that in a 2v1, a survivor left bleeding out for a certain amount of time should be able to bleed themselves out quicker. Then it's done, then the survivors actually have the power to do something. Survivors at the exit gate already put a 2 minute timer on themselves, this would allow survivors to put a timer on the killer. If you really wanted to shorten that max 2 minutes further, maybe at some point BHVR could implement the collapse speeding up when all living survivors are in the exit gates or escaped, although that would have to have the caveat of not happening while the killer is nearby as it could end up killing survivors in a last second escape when they would get out otherwise.
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Rather than a bleed out mechanic i'd propose something more like this:
When two survivors remain, any one survivor who is left in the dying state for longer than 1 minute can self mori, this will not be classed as a bleed out but an actual kill.
Reasoning for that is a Killer shouldn't have their adepts ruined by a game mechanic.
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I get the intention, but how would that work exactly? Would the killer like teleport over to the mori? Or would they just bleed out and the game would count it as a mori
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Its 2026, i'd say the devs could make it look a little more flashy than a bleed out but I wouldn't have it so the killer teleports to mori, that'd be a bit goofy.
But this way it puts the onus in the survivors hands, do I give the killer this kill or do I make them wait potentially losing the kill due to bleed out.0 -
I actually think this would be a good idea to keep adept players in mind, although honestly adepts should also just require 3 kills which the community has asked for for years
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If the biggest reason for slugging for the 4k is adept runs, then why exactly is it happening so frequently in Chaos Shuffle mode where it is physically impossible to do your adept?
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Why do Killers kill in a killing game? That's your question?
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Fair enough. Have a nice day.
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It would be nice if we get the Abandon feature if someone get slugged in a 1v2 scenario. Cuz what I hate the most is getting found in a 1v2, get slugged, and wait close to 4 minutes to jump into the next game. Now, if the devs says "Hey, you can now Abaddon the game if you're slugged if you're in a 1v2 situation" then that would be nice. But I honestly don't think that will ever happen, sadly.
There also times where the killer picks me up then drop me so I can tell them where my team mates are. Which btw, is a bannable offense! If you can't find the last person, that's on you buddy, lol. I ain't getting banned for snitching.But when I play killer, I'm okay getting a 3k AND I enjoy a good hatch race.
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How can you possibly think it's acceptable or healthy design to tell someone to tab out when your opponent has decided you aren't allowed to play anymore?
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I think a lot of this can be blamed on the basekit mori.
I mean a lot of killers will sweat the 4k no matter what, but the last kill giving a mori just incentivises them more.
I have to admit, I will absolutely slug to secure the kill on the toxic tea bagger super looper torch clicker who's been winding me up all match. But as a rule I'll give hatch to the slugged survivor afterwards (if they don't dc/bleed out and weren't also mad toxic)
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Yeah I think it might be the case as well, just like how the basekit mini moris we see with Jason and such makes it easier to tunnel. Honestly thinking about it, that's something I'm worried about with the new killer as well.
But playing that way is totally fair, especially if you give the slug hatch even though you're not obligated to. I might even do the same thing. I just know that a lot of killers don't care if the last survivor is toxic or not and will do it anyways. I've been the 4th survivor many times, and unless the killer has already been humping me on the ground or has been playing in the most toxic, boring ways possible all game, I never tbag, and even then it's rare. I don't even run any super frustrating builds, I usually just run a feel good build that does a bit of everything.
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My hot take is that the basekit mori was one of the worst changes to the overall vibe of the game in recent history. It was way better when they were a rare surprise and not a period at the end of the match that people feel entitled to. And there's more and more mini moris making things worse.
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Honestly I agree. Not only can you argue that the final mori incentivizes slugging excessively for the 4k, not only can you argue that built-in mini moris make tunneling easier, but it also just desensitizes people to moris. Like, how many times have I watched this mori now. Even if I thought the mori was cool when the killer was released, I've seen it so many times now it's no wonder why survivors abandon in the middle of the mori if they have the option
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Not to mention basekit moris negate a whole bunch of perks. It's one of those things like visible hook states that was actually a big buff but we act like it's always been there and is no big deal.
I try my best not to mori. I hook as long as I don't expect something like Power Struggle or a still active DS, but even when I do them it's begrudgingly. I just take my headset off and look at my phone. I don't know how anyone can enjoy watching these ugly animations a thousand times on the same killer.
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I think it's rather simple. The game doesn't tell killers that they won when they get a 3k so many killers go for 4ks so they think/feel like they've won or won more.
They don't realize what a colossal waste of time it is and how not fun it is for everyone involved.
I am surprised the slug in the 2v1 scenario doesn't have an abandon option by now as they don't have any agency and are practically being held hostage unless their teammate picks them up which often they (smartly) let the slug bleed out for a chance at the hatch.
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Unfortunately even then the killer often doesn't let them bleed out in these scenarios, so even the built in timer can be worked around
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See my other reasons.
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because alot of survivors get an ego about hatch so if I slug for the 4k is see less ego survivors. Also its the same as 3 survivor going for the rescue after gates open they just want to get everyone out like killer wants to kill everyone.
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Ya survivors are toxic when it comes to hatch they act like they bested the killer super toxic.
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your right survivors get a huge ego about getting hatch even when i spawns right under them.
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Survivors complain about tunneling and slugging when it objectively doesnt happen so sorry I dont take think its as rampant as people say.
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Why do survivor have such an ego why shoudl they be able to hold the killer hostage for 2 minutes. Whats wrong can survivors not handle being on the ground just tab out or go to the bathroom its what killers are told to do. Survivors get a massive ego about getting the hatch and alot of killers just dont want to deal with that as well alot of killer challenges need killers to kill so getting 4 killer vs 3 can be the difference between finishing the challenge and starting another or having to play another match before getting to do a different challenge. Survivors are such victims complaining about litteraly everything killers do and they still gi e up under hook repeatedly.
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Sooooo the gist of what I'm seeing here is because one group of survivors were egomaniactics means that as killer you must now be egomaniactic as well to every other group of survivors even if they had nothing to do with it...did I sum this up correct cause I really only read the first two
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Its not ego they just want the kill its that simple is it ego that survivors want to 4 out. Also survivors get a big ego about getting hatch so slugging for the 4k stops that toxicity.
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First of all, survivors have zero ability to "hold the killer hostage for 2 minutes." The killer is fully able to end the game at any point by pushing the survivors out. I understand if having to do that is frustrating because you have to see some goofballs tbagging, but you have the option as the killer to end the game at any time, survivors have no such option. Secondly, literally no one tells killers to "tab out or go to the bathroom." There have been others on this thread who have echoed similar sentiments as yours about how survivors should have to deal with it because killers do, and the response is always, again "you can push them out." There is a very clear solution to survivors sitting in exit gates: wait 2 minutes max or push them out. It might not be ideal, but it's very simple.
On survivor there is no solution, and there is no guaranteed timer. Theoretically there should be a max 4 minute timer for a survivor to bleed out, but the killer truly does have the power to take the game hostage if they want to, as they can just pick up the survivor to keep the game going until they eventually find the other survivor. The only thing the survivor bleeding out can do is tab out and do something else for an indefinite period of time, the same thing you claim is what killers are told to do. The other survivor has the choice between trying to hide and do nothing for an indefinite period of time or literally killing themselves, giving up on the mechanic the killer is manipulating to never come into play, and giving up on the almost 10k bloodpoints.
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I mean it's really the same "us vs them" mentality in all of them so pretty much. This thread wasn't even about killers, it was about killers who excessively slug for the 4k, but somehow I guess it just comes down to survivors are all terrible so they have to suffer.
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It quite literally doesn't. In fact it does the exact opposite. People who think in "us vs them" like you on the survivor side will experience a match with you or one of these other slugging for the 4k killers and then take it out on a bunch of other killers that are completely innocent.
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Actually, to respond to this a bit more, the reason you probably see so many survivors "getting a big ego about getting hatch", considering your posts, is probably because of how you play. For example, I almost never tbag, and the only time I ever do, if at all, is when the killer is playing in an extremely toxic way. AKA some mixture of hard tunneling at 5 gens, trying to slug the entire team with a build made for doing so, humping survivors on the ground, slapping survivors on hook, excessively slugging for the 4k, etc.
All your posts have showed a pure "us vs them" mentality, where there is absolutely no empathy for the other role. In my experience, people like that have the worst play styles, in which case even players like me who never tbag will probably do so to you. When I play killer, I still play to win, but I don't play like that, and I don't experience that much toxicity. If you want to stop experiencing toxicity, stop being toxic. It's just a cycle you're perpetuating.
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@cogsturning
Ahh ok, can you point out exactly where i said it was "acceptable"?
Short answer … you can't, because i never said it was, perhaps read a bit further down the discussion where i mention that both issues being talked about are distasteful.
My point is you can't complain about one side having issues and then in the same breath disregard the other.-3 -
I totally understand it can be rough to be the slugged survivor. I have been there too.
However, i'm going to say something that for some reason people do not seem to understand:
Killers are entitled to kill as many survivors as possible the same way the survivors are entitled to try to escape as hard as they can.
Now, if that can create some unpleasant scenario, then maybe they can implement something like the 3rd survivor can bleed out faster or something.
But the killer, as long as he is not doing it just to being an ######### and just to secure the kills, he is not a "bad" killer at all.
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Personaly I will do it, if I know hwere the last two survivors are and I downed one and have info on the last one I will go for it unless they were super chill team or looked like newer players. If they were sweating hard then no, my answer to your gameplay will be same sweat.
Idk whats that narative that killers are expected to be gentlemans of this game?? like why, why should killer always give second chance and be nice while other side totaly can crap on it.
For me if they werent sweating then I will give them chance. Now hatch offerings are hidden and more grant more for the one who runs them plus hatch being closed isnt end theres rng with gates and some gates are super survivor sided like on larrys or havkins while some are neutral and some are killer sided but thats map thing the key thing is theres always something some change for escape. You can get hatch, if it gets closed then theres ioption to open it with key or open exit gate and last option is give up to the killer and he might let you get out (putting item on the ground and crouching), many people forgot that last part and run around but like theres 40% chance killer will let you out if you didnt tbag him or did something like that or you were sabbo squad etc.
If I have no info on last survivor I finish him and go and try the luck because hatch is anomaly that doesnt favor any side always unless theres offering for it.
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Its not ego they just want the kill its that simple is it ego that survivors want to 4 out.
See...that sounds exactly like double standards if I ever heard it…
It's not ego to want the 4k...but it's ego to want the 4e...like most at least try to hide the double standards they have mate…
Also survivors get a big ego about getting hatch so slugging for the 4k stops that toxicity.
Ignoring the fact of you lumping all survivors together: If they were going to be toxic about getting the hatch, they were going to be toxic regardless. I've had surviors boast random things, infact durring the banquet event one of those groups were harping about how bad i was…despite the fact i got enough downs to kill them all twice over. Slugging for the 4k is not going to fix it, it instead brings a different ego AND makes innocents miserable.
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Again, the sides aren't the same. As has been mentioned multiple times, killers can drag out the match much, much longer than survivors safely can. You can hunt the standing survivor then let the other break free right before the bleedout. Then you can find the other and do the same thing again. Killers can drag out the match a good 10 mins if they desire; the killer can just hit the survivors out.
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Actually, to respond to this a bit more, the reason you probably see so many survivors "getting a big ego about getting hatch", considering your posts, is probably because of how you play. For example, I almost never tbag, and the only time I ever do, if at all, is when the killer is playing in an extremely toxic way.
This exactly, but self reflection and personal responsibility are too heavy for this community. I'll fully admit that sometimes I spiral into tilted behavior and start playing in a less than pleasant manner, and if I get tbagged at the gates I am 100% aware that I was the problem. I don't really get taunted at the gates much at all most of the time.
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"See...that sounds exactly like double standards if I ever heard it…
It's not ego to want the 4k...but it's ego to want the 4e...like most at least try to hide the double standards they have mate…"
i was asking if slugging for the 4k is ego then wanting the 4out should be the same. it was asking if one is ego is the other.
"Ignoring the fact of you lumping all survivors together: If they were going to be toxic about getting the hatch, they were going to be toxic
regardless. I've had surviors boast random things, infact durring the banquet event one of those groups were harping about how bad i was…despite the fact i got enough downs to kill them all twice over. Slugging for the 4k is not going to fix it, it instead brings a different ego AND makes innocents miserable."if it stops some survivors from being toxic in end game chat i will slug for the 4k i already get enough death treats from survivors when i play both sides so anything that reduces toxicity ill do.
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i was asking if slugging for the 4k is ego then wanting the 4out should be the same. it was asking if one is ego is the other.
I would recommend choosing your words more carefully then as that is not how it reads. If you want my answer to your question above, they are actually not quite the same. Different roles remember.
As survivor you are trying to help another person escape and "win" as it were. You "win" when you get out regardless of everyone else yet are going the altruistic route in trying helping someone else. It may have some ego depending on person but its also being put to a cause for others AND doesn't stop the game in its tracks since this creates a risk of more death and losses.
As killer you "win" at a 3k and are trying to get a tiny bit more for you alone. The killer is actively "hurting" others when slugging for the 4k with nothing to go on (I specify "nothing to go on" as something like seeing the last person as you down the 3rd or similar would mean your not explicitly wasting time looking/waiting for the 4th) and practically stops the game for however long is left on the slug's bleed out timer. You have the grand total risk of one survivor getting lucky while you as killer win with most the reward if you'd simply kill off that 3rd survivor. There are a few cases where this isn't pure ego (mainly adepts) but the majority are pretty much so, at minimum for me and my friends (and a whole discord server), as seeing things like pain res on a Nemi, a blight with quad aura, or something of the sort whos then goes slugging for that 4k kinda shows they aint doing it for the adept.
if it stops some survivors from being toxic in end game chat i will slug for the 4k i already get enough death treats from survivors when i play both sides so anything that reduces toxicity ill do.
…and when i explicitly pointed out it wont reduce any toxic behavior or when others point out it may increase toxicity it flies right over your head…
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This may be a personal thing but if there is something to go on that wasn't specifically triggered by the killer (ex: 3rd down and THEN goes hunting with "Phantom Fear" or old "Ultimate Weapon") I do not count that against the killer whos slugging for that 4k. The survivor who just ran by as the chase finished, a gen popped as the 3rd went down, that stupid survivor that thinks theyre hiding behind that rock in view. The killer has a lead, they can go at minimum check it as long as they don't take forever as searching. I do not expect either side to play "stupid" as long as "smart" isn't actively harming or stalling for "stupid" reasons.
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4Ks and 4Es are not the same scenario, not even close.
In the 4E scenario it's Endgame with all four survivors left alive, and usually only 2-3 minutes from start of Endgame to the game being over. If all survivors are up, it's a max of 2 minutes, less if the killer endures the gate teabags and pushes them out. If 1 survivor is on the hook then the survivors heal each other up and do a team save and then the killer chases them out and the game usually ends promptly and in an engaging fashion. Also in these scenarios the killer has much more agency than a slug.
In the 4K scenario it is almost always not Endgame and the slug usually has a close to 4 minute bleedout timer which the killer can choose to extend by putting them back on their feet. It's not uncommon for these matches to drag on for 5+ minutes if a thirsty killer without info perks/power is up against survivors that don't sell each other out. If the killer has a way to find the other survivor quickly then it's not really a problem but we often see this play out where a killer slugs for the 4K with no tools (many adepts are like this) to find the last survivor and they search fruitlessly while keeping tabs on the slug or worse having the slug sell out the other survivor. Usually this scenario wastes a lot of time for everyone involved and it's not engaging if the killer fails to find the last survivor. The slug has virtually no agency unless they sell out their partner which shouldn't be an option.
I find the concept of "hatch ego" ridiculous. A survivor with an ego is going to be toxic and the hatch has little to do with it except if they get the hatch they can go "ggez I got hatch." If they don't get the hatch they'll hit you with something else such as calling you out for perceived survivor rulebook violations or perks or just hit you with slurs or worse.
Slugging for the 4K as a response to "hatch ego" is just punishing yourself and those last 2 survivors left, who most of the time don't have egos. It's a colossal waste of time that is better spent in the next match.
A better strategy is to laugh at the post-game chat or hide/ignore it.
I don't entertain the 2v1 scenario on either side. As killer I hook the third one immediately unless I know where the 4th one is and I have reason to dislike them. On the survivor side if I am not the slug I am easily found and if I am the slug I don't sell out my teammate. I want to maximize my time in matches where both sides have a chance and not in ones where the outcome has already been decided.
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If they were going to be toxic about getting the hatch, they were going to be toxicregardless.I think this is a good point. Toxic players are going to be toxic - they don't need a reason because they'll make anything into their reason.
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I slug just because I can. I've 4k slugged at 5 gens just because. In some instances you have to ask yourself how much you care about the match and the people playing. Slugging is also better than hooking. Only thing I won't do is slug for the 4k without out knowing where the last person is, unless I just want the other person dead in which case whoever I had slugged waiting I'd give them hatch if they hadn't dc'd already.
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Its core of their personality being toxic so no wonder they are like that even when theres reason.
It like thinking crocodile tears mean something, no they dont they will still want to get you.
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