The nerf on Sprint burst and self-care...
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I see a lot of killer mains around here talking about how good the changes are to survivors yet they cry over tinkerer on the other post. You get a perk nerf the survivors get multiple. I dont cry over them. Change and adapt. Simple as that survivors are entitled to survive and killers are entitled to kill. Im kinda sick of seeing camping killers in high ranks when I would expect it in lower ranks. If this is gonna fix the camping issue then I have no problem with it. As for " I'm camping cause I need to " no you dont that's how bullying survivors came to be. These changes are welcomed. All of them including the killer changes.0
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@Twix said:
Sprint Burst Change: I'd go about it a little bit differently, instead of not letting you recover while running - it should be changed so that it won't let you recover while performing an action. (Repairing, healing, etc)
Why? Because the main problem with SB is survivors waiting for the killer to get near them and then run away to a pallet, so by not letting them recover while performing an action it'll make it so SB won't be back up if you're repairing a generator.Selfcare Change: The current change that is being planned out is a little too much, instead, make it so you get specific checkpoints at 35% and 75%, so let's say you start healing and get to 20% then it would reset, but if you get to 45% it would reset to the checkpoint. (35%)
Why? Because if you lose the killer and go to a corner to heal and you're in at like 70% and he finds you again it would reset your healing to 0% and that's just too much of a nerf and with what I've proposed it won't let you pallet loop and heal, because it will still reset, but to specific checkpoints.What are your thoughts on this? :thinking:
I absolutely agree with that. This way the nerf on SB is way more reasonable and balanced.
And the idea with SC would also fix an other issue as well: If you managed to escape the killer and start healing yourself with SC and then one of your teammates wants to heal you (as he needs the emblem points as well) it would not have been a complete waste of time as it would only reset to 35 or 75%. It would be disgraceful if in this case it resets to 0% only because you wanted to give the teammate the cChance to heal you.3 -
About the SB change. It totally makes sense.
A cool thing to do should be to slighlty change the Vigil perk. Why not allowing the exhaustion recovery while unning if you use this perk and adding the bonus speed recovery only when you're not running.
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For the killer mains: STOP THINKING THAT YOU MUST WIN EVERY SINGLE GAME AND WHEN YOU DON'T YOU COME
HERE AND COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW POWERFUL SURVIVOR PERKS ARE.4 -
Honestly the only thing that annoys me is that they didn't have the nerf the exhaustion perks in general. The only exhaustion perk people had a problem with was sprint burst.
Hell if someone managed to time their exhaustion and get in another lithe or dead hard something that requires a lot more skill than just casually sprinting that would be on me as a killer.
I think they completely miss the point the change everyone's annoyance was with sprint burst not exhaustion perks, it was a free escape and meant that you didn't have to care about your positioning because you could rely on sprint burst to get you out of the initial hit.0 -
@Krueger1428 said:
...are awful. I do not like this changes one bit. Not being able to recover exhaustion while running is beyond stupid. And if I heal 99% with Self-care and didn't use a Medkit, I get punished for stopping and lose all my progress? Nah. Go back to the drawing board and get new ideas. These are terrible.Salty survivor detected
Exhaustion perks actually support a more stealthy gameplay instead of running in circles like idiots, I will always support that.
Not sure about the SC idea, seems a bit weird to me atm, but it definitely needs a hard nerf1 -
I never use exhaustion perks so I don't really have an opinion on exhaustion. DS change is totally fine with me, also from a killer point of view much better than the previous suggestion.
As a solo survivor who can't just easily ask my SWF buddies where they are, I find the Self Care changes too drastic, though. It should rather regress continuously than be gone instantly. My main concern is with aura exposure, like BBQ&C, esp. with Billy/Nurse ... if such a killer hooks someone while I'm healing I just have to react and move. Then if I was almost finished all progress is gone and I have to start from scratch and if I'm unlucky the same thing repeats just as I'm healing up again next time. I thought they wanted to buff solo survivors a bit, but with the SC change that seems to be definitely off the table.
Bond to find others is not really an option for me as I personally prefer Empathy, and both combined would be a bit too much. I run it occasionally in some builds, but I'm not the big Bond fan somehow no matter how many people say it's the better perk, and wouldn't like to have to use it as a mandatory perk.
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Killer perks nerf when? Why devs listen killers only?
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- SB needs the nerf, not exhaustion overall.
- The main issue with SC stays, UNLIMITED uses.
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As a toxic main survivor, i would also like some actual CHALLENGE, not looping and then blinding killer whole match. I really love those nerfs and i hope we will see them in the next patch
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Finally! It has happened to me a lot, that when I am about to down a survivor, he farts off to another pallet. Yes!1
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fcc2014 said:
Have fun waiting for 4 survivors as more players move on from the game and new players have nothing worth playing for if they don't have anything that givea them a better chance to survive.ZombieGenesis said:These are the exact changes these perks need. Period. Why should you recover from exhaustion while running? It makes no sense. And this will stop the "pallet drop, heal-heal-heal, run, pallet drop, heal-heal-heal" garbage. Nope, I love these changes. Bring em on.
Honestly, I liked most of the changes they talked about on the dev stream. I'd love to try them all on the PTB.
Got a point here! They keep balancing for the top level guys and it makes learning survivor harder and harder until no ones wants to play but the super try hards and with no casual players and the game now a stressful POS for both sides!! I'm sure all 8 of you will love the super balanced competition game you've helped to mold.0 -
Why do you feel the need to preface almost every single one of your posts with "As a survivor main.." We get it, dude. You post all the time, you're a survivor main who favors killers in nearly every regard.weirdkid5 said:As a Survivor main who has used Sprint Burst since Day 1, I approve of this change. It makes it so you cannot get clutch sprints anymore, you have to earn them by stopping occasionally.
Self Care change is also awesome, no more freedom from nonsense. Feels good m8.
What was the DS change?3 -
The changes are really needed though. But its a shame that Balanced Landing and Lithe get nerfed so hard
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ShadowClaw said:
The exhaustion change i agree with, however I feel the self care change would be more balanced going along the direction of, if you stop healing your heal state starts to degrade like if you were bleeding out over instantly resetting.
I don't hate the self care, it's fine but I think this is a way better idea!! Good thinkin'
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Don't worry despite the perk reworks they will still get eatten up by survivor mains and still complain. It will be casual players this will hurt and drive from the game.hMM said:For the killer mains: STOP THINKING THAT YOU MUST WIN EVERY SINGLE GAME AND WHEN YOU DON'T YOU COME
HERE AND COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW POWERFUL SURVIVOR PERKS ARE.0 -
@Twix said:
No wonder this game will never be balanced... Killers cry and they get all they want, hatch, pallet, perks etc and then Survivors cry and they get all they want. Back and forth between both parties will not balance anything, I agree SB/SC/DS need nerfs, but not to be nerfed so bad that it's probably better to use something else.Agreed. Everybody thinks they deserve to win 100% of the time (4K or 4 escapes) so the game developers continue to tinker around with perks instead of adjusting any of the real issues: the ranking system, the matching system, how easy it is to cheat in-game, etc, or updating the game for console. It's pretty irritating.
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@fcc2014 said:
hMM said:For the killer mains: STOP THINKING THAT YOU MUST WIN EVERY SINGLE GAME AND WHEN YOU DON'T YOU COME
HERE AND COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW POWERFUL SURVIVOR PERKS ARE.
Don't worry despite the perk reworks they will still get eatten up by survivor mains and still complain. It will be casual players this will hurt and drive from the game.
Exactly!! Ah, that's what bothers me the most about these kinds of changes, honestly. They're clearly made from listening to the most competitive player base which negates, I'm assuming, the larger percentage of people playing. There are, contrary to how the community makes it seem sometimes, a LOT of casual players that don't have time to devote hundreds of hours to learning how to "pallet loop" (and honestly, since the game pushes for chases and then doesn't have very much variety in terms of what you can be chased through, that seems to be the much bigger weakness here) or how to 'git gud'.
They're going to have a really hard time competing with other PvP games in the future if they continue this trend. There's a lot of options coming out (including their own game, Deathgarden) and if this game starts turning into a Friday the 13th killer scenario then I wouldn't be surprised if they lose a lot of their larger, less vocal player base.
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@hill_o said:
@fcc2014 said:
hMM said:For the killer mains: STOP THINKING THAT YOU MUST WIN EVERY SINGLE GAME AND WHEN YOU DON'T YOU COME
HERE AND COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW POWERFUL SURVIVOR PERKS ARE.
Don't worry despite the perk reworks they will still get eatten up by survivor mains and still complain. It will be casual players this will hurt and drive from the game.
Exactly!! Ah, that's what bothers me the most about these kinds of changes, honestly. They're clearly made from listening to the most competitive player base which negates, I'm assuming, the larger percentage of people playing. There are, contrary to how the community makes it seem sometimes, a LOT of casual players that don't have time to devote hundreds of hours to learning how to "pallet loop" (and honestly, since the game pushes for chases and then doesn't have very much variety in terms of what you can be chased through, that seems to be the much bigger weakness here) or how to 'git gud'.
Balance has to go top down. You can't balance a game around unskilled player.
Stuff like DS is exactly that and shows the flaw. Of course 4x DS is no problem, when not even half of them can hit the skillcheck, but if every single one of them can hit the skillcheck even with UP and/or madness, this is overpowered af!0 -
@TheXenoborg said:
@Tizzle said:
Killers should prepare themselves to complain about an even faster gen rush, thats about the only these changes are doing.Which will also eventually be fixed, so please try to adapt to these changes.
I haven't used Sprint Burst in a year and a half.
I rarely use DS.
I will admit I do use self care on all Survivors but usually to provoke the Killer into chasing me again after hes hooked someone else or to save.
But sure, I'll adapt.
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I think that SC should be token based. The SB nerf is fine.
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I like 'em. You really shouldn't get sprint burst twice in a chase. The one thing I might want to see changed is for recovery from exhaustion caused by addons while sprinting. That way getting hit with one exhaustion addon doesn't make things like Dead Hard or Lithe completely pointless, but still delays them until the exhaustion wears off. Self afflicted exhaustion is fair game, I don't think you should be using sprint burst more than once unless you lost the killer for a substantial amount of time during the chase.
Self care, I'm also okay with. I never had a problem going against it in the first place, but apparently I'm alone there. The only thing this changes is healing in a chase, which is something that I'm totally okay with seeing go considering how long chases can be if someone just loops.
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@Peanits said:
I like 'em. You really shouldn't get sprint burst twice in a chase. The one thing I might want to see changed is for recovery from exhaustion caused by addons while sprinting. That way getting hit with one exhaustion addon doesn't make things like Dead Hard or Lithe completely pointless, but still delays them until the exhaustion wears off. Self afflicted exhaustion is fair game, I don't think you should be using sprint burst more than once unless you lost the killer for a substantial amount of time during the chase.Self care, I'm also okay with. I never had a problem going against it in the first place, but apparently I'm alone there. The only thing this changes is healing in a chase, which is something that I'm totally okay with seeing go considering how long chases can be if someone just loops.
I think the main backlash is vigil being much more useless, and the weaker exhaustion perks being weakened
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@Jack11803 said:
@Peanits said:
I like 'em. You really shouldn't get sprint burst twice in a chase. The one thing I might want to see changed is for recovery from exhaustion caused by addons while sprinting. That way getting hit with one exhaustion addon doesn't make things like Dead Hard or Lithe completely pointless, but still delays them until the exhaustion wears off. Self afflicted exhaustion is fair game, I don't think you should be using sprint burst more than once unless you lost the killer for a substantial amount of time during the chase.Self care, I'm also okay with. I never had a problem going against it in the first place, but apparently I'm alone there. The only thing this changes is healing in a chase, which is something that I'm totally okay with seeing go considering how long chases can be if someone just loops.
I think the main backlash is vigil being much more useless, and the weaker exhaustion perks being weakened
I'm not too worried about Vigil. Given how some of the worst perks in the game are getting changed with this balance update, I'm sure Vigil will get some love if it ends up being terrible in the next one (or further down the line).
The weaker exhaustion perks might need some tweaking, but between making addon afflicted exhaustion recover and lowering their exhaustion timers, I can still see them being useful.
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@Krueger1428 said:
I liked Deja vu, Calm Spirit and Ace in the hole changes. Those other two though..nah.Of course YOU LIKED the buffs to the bad perks, and dislike the nerfs to the OP ones. Hello survivor main, nice to meet you.
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Self Care is eh... Sprint Burst should be running while in a CHASE but otherwise stay the same.
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@Jack11803 said:
@Peanits said:
I like 'em. You really shouldn't get sprint burst twice in a chase. The one thing I might want to see changed is for recovery from exhaustion caused by addons while sprinting. That way getting hit with one exhaustion addon doesn't make things like Dead Hard or Lithe completely pointless, but still delays them until the exhaustion wears off. Self afflicted exhaustion is fair game, I don't think you should be using sprint burst more than once unless you lost the killer for a substantial amount of time during the chase.Self care, I'm also okay with. I never had a problem going against it in the first place, but apparently I'm alone there. The only thing this changes is healing in a chase, which is something that I'm totally okay with seeing go considering how long chases can be if someone just loops.
I think the main backlash is vigil being much more useless, and the weaker exhaustion perks being weakened
They could just buff vigil by 5% across the board I guess.
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@Lowbei said:
the changes are fine. adapt or die.If a survivor said this to every killer post there would be a riot on the forum. This kind of response is not helpful.
I don't like the fact sprint burst and self care are a must on every perk set up...so im happy for the change (I play both survivor and killer and I see a benefit for both teams)
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@ShadowClaw said:
The exhaustion change i agree with, however I feel the self care change would be more balanced going along the direction of, if you stop healing your heal state starts to degrade like if you were bleeding out over instantly resetting.This is a good shout.
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Spring Burst should not charge while being chased and running maybe. What I don't want it to see all my damn teammates walking around. Maybe that won't fix the walking ######### that'll happen though. Also what about that exhaustion recovery perk, won't this make that funky? Self Care reset sucks for one reason, nobody will let me heal them. They'll be like, I already have it to 25%, I'm fine, I'll just finish healing myself. Same thing maybe? Only reset when being chased.
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@TeambossFloze said:
@Lowbei said:
the changes are fine. adapt or die.If a survivor said this to every killer post there would be a riot on the forum. This kind of response is not helpful.
I don't like the fact sprint burst and self care are a must on every perk set up...so im happy for the change (I play both survivor and killer and I see a benefit for both teams)
Well you must be new since it's what survivor told (back in the day) when killer complained about infinite like this one
Or when people complained about old ds that was instant for every survivor
Or when people complained about old borrowed time
Or when people complained that all the window of the wretched shop where open making it litteraly impossible to catch someone there
Or when people complain that looping is boring
It even created meme with people answering any complaint by just break the pallet because at one point some survivor where unironicaly saying it to answer complaint about pallet looping.
Most often than not the people that tell other to adapt to those where also people that declared every single killer OP and voted for the doctor to be reworked thinking it meant nerfing him.And yes it is unhelpful
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@Dragonredking said:
@TeambossFloze said:
@Lowbei said:
the changes are fine. adapt or die.If a survivor said this to every killer post there would be a riot on the forum. This kind of response is not helpful.
I don't like the fact sprint burst and self care are a must on every perk set up...so im happy for the change (I play both survivor and killer and I see a benefit for both teams)
Well you must be new since it's what survivor told (back in the day) when killer complained about infinite like this one
Or when people complained about old ds that was instant for every survivor
Or when people complained about old borrowed time
Or when people complained that all the window of the wretched shop where open making it litteraly impossible to catch someone there
Or when people complain that looping is boring
It even created meme with people answering any complaint by just break the pallet because at one point some survivor where unironicaly saying it to answer complaint about pallet looping.
Most often than not the people that tell other to adapt to those where also people that declared every single killer OP and voted for the doctor to be reworked thinking it meant nerfing him.And yes it is unhelpful
It really is.
ppl complain too damn much
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@TeambossFloze
Not only do they complain to damn much but more often than not like I pointed the people that say to the other side to adapt (that be either for new thing no matter if they are fair or not or actual gameplay flaw) tend to be huge hypocrite that will only say to people to adapt to a change only when the change doesn't affect them.
To go back on topic now
Imo the change to SC, Exhaustion perk and DS are fine, they where long waited and I hope the meta will finally switch around since it as been stall for pretty much over 1 year and a half now.I also welcome the change to whisper as a stealthy survivor but I think they should also do something incase the last survivor doesn't try to do objectif or get out since finding a survivor that doesn't try to do the objectif is pretty hard and I had multiple time survivor hide for 30/40 minute to spit me because I managed to kill every one before enought gen popped for the hatch to spawn.(funny enought most of the time those survivor had username that related to Ochido)
Same goes for calm spirit that way maybe the survivor that complain about the doctor 24 hours a day will finally stop complaining and slot it instead.
The only change I don't really like is the tinkerer one I find the new effect doesn't go well with the name of the perk and the effect sound more like what Surveillance should have been.
And the change to freddy they talked about like reducing action speed to 0% during the dream transition and speeding up the dream transition will make it so he can actually defend gen and totem instead of having them being fixed in his face.
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@intothefray said:
Spring Burst should not charge while being chased and running maybe. What I don't want it to see all my damn teammates walking around. Maybe that won't fix the walking ######### that'll happen though. Also what about that exhaustion recovery perk, won't this make that funky? Self Care reset sucks for one reason, nobody will let me heal them. They'll be like, I already have it to 25%, I'm fine, I'll just finish healing myself. Same thing maybe? Only reset when being chased.Yeah I'm not sure about this with Self Care.
Why would anyone reset their progress bar to zero just so someone else could heal them, counterproductive.
The healing bar should just degrade, not completely reset.
It's meant to stop healing at pallets, not completely reset all progress if another Survivor comes to heal you.
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We’re finally getting the changes that we needed over a year ago. These are long overdue.Molotow said:Killer perks nerf when? Why devs listen killers only?
Devs don’t only listen to Killers. If they did, then Calm Spirit, Dark Sense, Deja Vu, and Ace in the Hole would not have gotten a buff at all.2 -
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The only stupid things about the changes you mentioned is that great, balanced Perks like Lithe & Balanced Landing will suffer from Sprint Burst being way too strong.
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@MegDenson said:
As a toxic main survivor, i would also like some actual CHALLENGE, not looping and then blinding killer whole match. I really love those nerfs and i hope we will see them in the next patchFirst toxic survivor main I sympathize with
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@Wolf74 said:
Balance has to go top down. You can't balance a game around unskilled player.
Stuff like DS is exactly that and shows the flaw. Of course 4x DS is no problem, when not even half of them can hit the skillcheck, but if every single one of them can hit the skillcheck even with UP and/or madness, this is overpowered af!You can't balance a game around the outliers of the game either, though? You can't just balance around Rank 1 survivor/killers or other people with a thousand hours into the game and assume it'll trickle down and work for the majority of the playerbase. That's how you lose most of your playerbase.
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Wolf74 said
I agree. i would have preferred to see them say you can get 2 SC full heals out of it then the way they are doing it now. the problem with the way they are doing it is if you are SCing and I walk up, what are the chances you stop to let me heal you now? zero as any progress you made is reset and while my heal is faster by the time you see it reset it probably works out to the same length of time. if they gave us 2 full SC heals then I start SCing and you walk around a corner I will definitely stop to save my SC and let you finish the heal.- The main issue with SC stays, UNLIMITED uses.
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The thing about the exhaustion nerf is that it actually makes sense. If you get tired in real life and keep jogging, you don't really recover to full strength, do you? I guess it adds a bit of realism to the game.1
