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On a scale of 1-10, how do YOU think The Legion rework will be received?
Comments
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@Dwight_Fairfield How? Show me proof, i have no idea why you both keep saying that , i never gave Orion a pass and i even agreed with @fluffybunny when he told me that what was said wasn't reasonable either, i feel like you and that other guy really wants to put words i didn't say in my mouth.
I said i don't find the word troll as harmful as brainless, and if i didn't, well now i did it, i never said it was right to do call others trolls tho, i just said i didn't care about what Orion said because it wasn't relevant and that Bogey was just using that as an excuse to be an ass.
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I can't imagine the word troll not meaning anything to anyone who frequents an internet forum.
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I like Legion and play against him but I agree some mechanics are annoying.
For me it's 4 because it does buff Survivors too much but I give it some chance in PTB = D
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I already added a disclaimer and explained what I meant in another comment.
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The Deep Wound nerf is pretty insane, for sure.
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There's your proof. You said you don't care what Orion said. You chose to persecute the one who made a Legion criticism. You also offered other nonsense reasoning like saying you're not Orion's mom and so forth and that's why you are not calling his post out.
No offense but every comment you made on this was dripping with bias.
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The main issue, as always, is Deep Wound. It's too weak to be a threat. It's like the Pig's RBTs, except those actually require survivors to get off their asses and do something. With Deep Wound you can just Mend at any point in time, in any corner of the map, and you're fine.
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You added a disclaimer after you were justifiably called out on it. Its a case of closing the stable door after the horse has already fled.
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I can't very well go back in time, can I? This was the best I could do under the circumstances.
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Yeah @Dwight_Fairfield, like i said, i don't care because it wasn't relevant, that's not me giving him a pass, i'm just saying not to use his words as an excuse to be an ass.
The more i look at it, the more the ones that claim others are biased feels like the heavily biased ones...
Also if you want proof of me saying that what Orion did wasn't any better:
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@Dwight_Fairfield If you've lived on the internet, you should know how pointless the word "troll" has become. It's come to describe nearly everything and quite frankly calling someone "brainless" is far more offensive, so I can understand where Plu is coming from. I can understand not appreciating someone dismissing someone else's perspective as trolling, but reacting to insults with insults isn't exactly the best reaction and while both have explained themselves, from what I've seen Bogey has just doubled down as if it's okay to insult a group if someone insulted yours first.
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No you can't. That's not my point. You made a post that said anyone who rated the change anything other than a 3 is a troll.
You don't strike me as a stupid person, so how you could believe that comment would be perceived as anything other than an insult is beyond me. I believe it was intended exactly as it came across.
I think your disclaimer was an attempt at backtracking after you were called out on it.
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For people who cannot play Killer and rely on Legion to get easy Pips and BPs: 1
"Normal" Legion Mains: 4
In General it will be around 7 for me.
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That doesn't excuse it. Just because an insulting word is commonly used doesn't make it any less insulting.
I'm not excusing the brainless comment, but the troll one was every bit as bad. The fact that a member chose to ignore one insult post, and even say they don't care about it, just to persecute another equally insulting post is both biased and unfair.
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I said "troll" with a very specific definition in mind (the first definition I'd ever heard, in fact), because it's been my observation that every time there's a nerf, the trolls come out from under their bridges and celebrate that X was ruined for a bunch of people.
Surprisingly enough, I'm still human, and therefore prone to error. I've never been very good at expressing myself, as any of my RL friends and my boyfriend can attest. You don't have to believe it, but that's all it was, a mistake. I handled it the only way available to me at this point, which was to acknowledge the mistake and try to correct it.
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I'm not ignoring it, if anything you are the one who's currently ignoring my answer, @Dwight_Fairfield
And i wasn't persecuting it, stop over-reacting, i was just calling him out and asked him to own his ######### and stop being a child hiding behind other's statements like it was a shield.
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Not too sure, im gonna wait until the PTB to form any sort of opinions on it.
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How is it not relevant? Its a post insulting anyone who rates the Legion change highly. You were persecuting a post insulting people who don't rate it highly. You then went on to offer flimsy excuses why you were persecuting it and not the other post. The change has not come out yet, you're not Orion's mom etc.
Your bias is very evident. I can't see how you could even try to seriously deny it.
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IMO it's like a better Pig trap, though. Not only can you see nearby people, but you can use it unlimited times and it injured people. They need to waste time mending and healing. It's like what someone else said, this change lends to a possibility of further buffs in the future. @Orion
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It wasn't relevant because i was calling him out, not Orion, how do you fail to understand that? @Dwight_Fairfield
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I don't think it'll be significant. It wasn't before, why would it be now that it's even weaker?
Yeah, it opens up the possibility of buffs, but only because it's weak.
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Orion, people cannot read what definitions you have in your mind when you use a word that has no meaning other than to be an insult. There's no context in which people being trolls is a good thing. Its a label that is used for bad behavior. Plain and simple.
Again you're not stupid. So how you could possibly imagine any other perception of that comment being anything other than an insult is a mystery. You're on the internet. People cannot tell by your facial expression or tone of voice in what context you are saying something. You didn't even use any smileys. What you say is taken at face value unless people are given reason to think otherwise.
I still believe your post was intended as it came across.
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This thread...
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@Dwight_Fairfield Please also note that Plu ranked it higher than 3. I'll put it another way. I'm more likely to get offended by being called ######### than by being called an animal, for instance. Both could be considered insults, but one is obviously worse than the other.
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But that's my point. You should have called out Orion, too. If you were trying to be fair that is what you should have done if you were going to call out poor behavior here. Instead you were choosing to call out one insult post, rather than both.
Both posts were bad form, but you picked the one that was critical of Legion. Combined with the rest of your aforementioned comments, and that you have a Legion avatar (I'm sorry but it does show your favoritism towards Legion), it all screams heavy bias.
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Because, as I mentioned in the comment where I explained what I was thinking about when I wrote "troll", I was annoyed. If you expect me to be 100% perfect 100% of the time, regardless of my emotional state, you've come to the wrong human.
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The legion change will be an infinity out of 10. They legion right now, is a bad killer assuming that the legion player isnt toxic. After the patch, legion is still bad, but wont be the DC king/queen anymore. How is this a bad thing?
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Please note that Bogey still hasn't closed those doors and is using "someone was mean first" as an excuse as to why he's not.
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Of course there are some insults labels worse than others. But at the end of the day an insult is an insult. Brainless, troll......they're both insults. Both were bad posts. They both should have been called out instead of just one.
There was a definite case of bias going on here.
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One of the two already acknowledged the mistake and tried to clarify the issue, but you don't believe in the apology and keep coming after him (me). The other has only excused his behavior by saying "he did it first!", but you're giving him a pass.
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What difference does that make? I don't understand this. Does it magically erase that Orion's post was just as bad? Of course not. One person behaving more badly than another doesn't give the other person's bad post a free pass.
Its like saying a person who murdered one person is off the hook because there's another person here who murdered two.
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@Orion It was weak before and couldn't be buffed without being largely unfair to survivors and making it more unfun to face.
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Dude, I already apologized, acknowledged the mistake, and clarified my intention. What more do you want? Must I whip myself? Say five Hail Mary's? Sacrifice my firstborn child to Zeus?
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As my friend always says. Think about it and then think about it again and then you can write it. I always try to remember it myself.
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The same applies now, because Mend is just another "hold M1 until completion" interaction.
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Orion, I never once excused what Bogeyman said. Not once. I'm calling out the nonsense reasoning that because he behaved more badly, that makes your insulting post ok to ignore and give a free pass to. It doesn't.
Your post was in equally poor form to the brainless one. I don't believe that anyone with an ounce of intelligence, and you're quite intelligent, would say what you said and not believe for a second it would be seen as anything other than insulting.
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I think it completely depends how the add-ons are reworked since people's annoyance often stems from them rather than Legion himself.
And from hearing Frank's Mix Tape is getting a flat numerical nerf instead of a rework, I don't see ANYBODY liking the new rework since it ultimatrly just creates a worse, but equally annoying killer.
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I'll bet both you and your friend sometimes forget to do that because you're in an agitated emotional state. Nobody's perfect.
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Plu didn't give me a pass either, he just focused on one comment. Since you think I'm a liar, there's nothing more for us to discuss.
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Wait till PTB comes and everyone will see why Legion rework is bad
The nerfs are too overkill
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@Orion Yes, but it's a quick first hit and a tracking possibility if people are nearby. If everyone's nearby, that's no one doing gens as you chase down the last person you hit. You can chase them down normally, too, since you're normal speed now and smack them down normally. There's some things about the changes I'm not too sure about, but I'm waiting to try it to see if it's for balance sake.
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You don't need to do anything, Orion. You apologized, you clarified what you said. If that makes you feel vindicated for your post then good for you. I still don't believe your original intent was not to insult. I think this is all just backtracking after you were called out on it.
Your apology and explanation isn't going to change my mind on that. I'm not buying it. Furthermore you shouldn't care what I think. If you feel you've done right here then that's all that should matter to you.
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Ofc That's why I wrote try to remember it myself. It's just a piece of advice that has helped me.
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I'm willing to try it as well, but I get the feeling any negative feedback is going to be ignored.
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That was my point, I was agitated by something that happened IRL and didn't stop to think. Apparently, that's not good enough; you must be perfect all the time.
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Yes he did. He also said "I'm not Orion's mother" and that's why your post was not put under persecution.
I mean these reasons are so comical that I'm half thinking our legs are being pulled.
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FMT did get a complete rework - It instantly removes 25% of the timer and no longer interacts with subsequent FF attacks.
Also, for pun reasons only,
"Dwight Knights, am I right?"
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What I was saying was that he may not have seen the use of "troll" as an insult. If you call me useless, I'll likely get upset. If you call me a dummy, I'll likely go "Fair enough, I'm dumb sometimes." Does that mean everyone works this way? No. Does that mean I'm bias and mean when I call out someone for hurting my feelings or offending me? I don't think so. Plu was reacting to what they found offensive. Plu also would have been considered a "troll" by Orion's definition and didn't seem to care. People often don't like being called dumb or brainless for an idea or a belief. It's understandable.
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@Dwight_Fairfield , since you keep ignoring my answer but insist on calling me biased, which is hypocritical, I'm quoting it again.
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I don't agree its understandable. If you're personally comfortable with being called a dummy because you think you're dumb sometimes. That's fine. That's your choice. But if someone called a bunch of people dummies, whether it bothers you or personally or not to be called one, still should not be seen as anything other than an insult. Calling people trolls, which has nothing but negative connotations, is insulting. Whether Plu himself is not personally offended by that is beside the point. Just like if I don't care if someone calls me a troll doesn't mean I am blind to the obvious fact that its still an insult.
Then to add to the fact that Plu added to the show of bias by saying nonsense like they are not Orion's mother so they don't care what he's saying paints a crystal clear picture of the blatant bias of one side simply being personally annoyed by a post that was critical of the Legion. That's all this is. Its very clear.
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