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The Dev philosophy and the PTB.
Since the PTB came out, I've been hitting it hard with my high ranked friends in KYF, with me as the red ranked killer, and them as 4 red ranked survivors. And this is what I've found. It will be long, sorry.
The Dev Philosophy: Killers shouldn't Kill
People are going to jump on me for this. Either cause they want to White Knight for the company they love, or because they're a survivor main with a biased opinion. But what I'm going to state here comes from playtesting with red rank survivor mains.
I should start with the pig, since that's where you can see this philosophy that killers shouldn't kill in action. When the EGC (End Game Collapse) was announced, buzz around the Pig Player Community was that our girl was finally going to be DECENT AT RANK 1. Not OP, by any strech, but she was going to have a strong endgame, something no other killer has without perks. Which would give our girl a unique playstyle, which would make her more fun. At no point did we think she was going to be OP. Why?
1: Once gates are open it becomes MUCH harder to put a survivor down and RBT them. Why? Because they can run out the gate if they are somewhat near it. And if they have people to body for them, escape is almost guaranteed, thanks to the auto aim.
2: RBT timers are long, but shorter then the current extended EGC timer of 4 mins. It also does not take long to get a RBT off. So they would have counter play.
But we didn't expect the Dev philosophy. Not only did they make her traps useless endgame (even more then they were, since the hatch was always a free escape for the trapped person so it made them kinda pointless endgame on the current live patch), they took the pressure off removing traps during the game. If they were just adjusting for the EGC they would have left out the TR extending the time, since that wouldn't help much during their EGC, which kills them if they stay to long.
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The Legion lost their leg.
I will state that I liked the legion before/ in the live patch. He wasn't my favorite (hag is) but I found him fun to play, and since I play him, I knew how to beat him as a survivor. Wasn't hard, bait into pallet, or bait feral frenzy into my Lithe perk. Free escape most of the time, and if he stayed on me, he was losing gens cause the Legion needs to spread dmg and flush gens, which is hard since most maps were to big for him.
Anyways, beside the point. The changes to Legion is pretty much what they did to Freddy. A killer was really good in lower ranks, but bad in higher ranks. People complained he wasn't fun to play against, and BHVR neutered them so people don't use them as much. His Cool Down build is the only really viable thing to run, which was kinda the case to begin with. So they took away all forms of tracking your target from his power, and even blind you when you come out of the power. Not that his CD build would have even been that strong with his current stats, his speed boost is still very loopable, and still super easy to punish if you understand the basics of pathing. Killers shouldn't Kill.
kewl Legion Idea cuz why not:
I mean, they could have allowed him to 'legion out' of his body, and reappear at a gen of his choice as a different member of the group, which would have given him a cool map pressure power that could be used kinda mindgamey. (Ok, he's behind me.. No #########, there was a gen in this loop and he cut me off)
There's a ton more I could go into, but this post is already to long. My playtesting group pretty much all agreed. DBD is back to survivors being the power role. They always were in a way. But now even more then before they dictate the flow of the game, and the points the Killer gets.
Comments
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Not only do they not want killers to kill but killers earn 1/2 the Bloodpoints for most scoring events during the collapse. Survivors hanging around looping you and you happen to down one? Congratulations, you get screwed in Bloodpoints because of the our shiny, new, badly designed Collapse!
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I've also played KYF with and against my SWF team and we all think the same, there is a reason why Billy and Nurse are still top tier.
The reason is because they can mess up many times and they'll still be able to have a chance against survivors, they are also strong because they can punish survivors mistakes WAY harder than any other killer, shortening the chases by a lot.
If you mess up as Legion 1 time while in Frenzy you'll get punished to hell...
Same goes for Piggy, if you decide to keep some traps for the end-game because you got genrushed too hard you wont be able to use them because survivors will just scape through the exit gates anyway... In other words, instead of making survivors use their brains to beat a tactical killer, the devs just nerfed her to the ground... She is a tactical killer for ######### sake, if she wants to keep her traps is because she probably has something that'll help her on the end-game. Dont genrush, cleanse the totems and dont get found near the end-game, it's as simple as that. But no, survivors need easy scapes...
I dont understand why Devs would do this when everyone wants the same thing, variety. Survivors cry because it's just Billy and Nurse and killers cry because they cant play anyone except Billy or Nurse and instead of making some other killers stronger they decide to just nerf them to the ground...
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@SmokePotion "The Dev Philosophy: Killers shouldn't Kill.
I agree with this statement. The newer killers released aren't viable in higher ranks but "they are fun to play" instead. Umm what??
If they don't want killers to have lethality which is implied in their role name... just rename them to chasers already.
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Yep. We've also seen Devs on these forums defend certain aspects of the game that make it easy to survive , defend it by saying that survivors need to survive. Which is just Killers Shouldn't Kill, backwards.
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At this point I'm starting to wonder why not just reframe the game's concept to a survival of the fittest style game, where the game ends at 3 dead survivors and whoever is left automatically escapes as the "Champion" of the match while changing the killer's goal from 4/4 to 3/3.
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I agree. Survivors just get so many chances. It's annoying
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If genrush wasnt a thing most people wouldnt even complain about Adrenaline, MoM, DS or exhaustion perks. Hell, if killers were all Billy Tier I would understand why that stuff is needed but that's not the case.
Survivors tools just punish low tier killers, no wonder Billy and Nurse are the most played.
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I agree with you. They refuse to address it or gen tapping.
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All they would have to do to stop genrushing is have each generator require a part to be found and placed in it before starting the timer. I've playtested that in KYF, and it works out well.
Heck, that could give "Brand New Part" a whole different, slightly less op, use.
I also want to point out something I forgot to mention. When I was testing the pig with my friends. we found that when I was chasing the distraction, the person with a RBT on could do gens. This is because my TR would pass over them during the chase, stopping their timer. Even if my TR only touched them for a few seconds here and there, those pauses added up to finished gens and no stress on the survivor.
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Agreed.
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This philosophy is very prevalent through the Q&A going on. Nothing but counterplay, counterplay, fun, not fun, not downing the first Survivor you find, but going on grand adventures to find more Survivors.
Mentioning that nerfed vaulting is fine because it adds more counterplay and they just need to adjust the animation. Just like when they had the adjust the animation for medium vaults(ignoring that they buffed medium vault speed when they did that).
Saying to just exit FF after hitting a Survivor after they massively increased the fatigue and nerfed the cooldown add-ons.
It's really disheartening to watch.
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Glad I'm not the only one noticing this on the stream.
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Yeah. They have said as much in some of their videos as well. They don't aim for Killers to be a certain power level (like they don't aim for new killers to be equal to x killer in strength) and instead try to make them fun to play.
Which is questionable. They should aim for both tbh.
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I JUST WATCHED THEM SAY IT!
live on the dev stream, twice.
They explained that killers that put in work to get certain scenarios to happen, shouldn't have those scenarios pay off. (like trapping someone durting egc, with 2 open doors, or stacking remember me all game)
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Yep, got to nerf Remember Me because of the cornercase scenario where the killer has managed to kill all the other Survivors and stacked up tokens AND got to the hatch first.
It's like saying a Survivor who has done all the gens and opened a gate can't escape . They did everything correctly to get to that point and so must be punished.
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I would not totally agree with you. Your situation is that you are against a 4 men SWF plus they are all your friends who may be familiar with your play style. So these two factors can make them counter play you super easily. Just saying that dev dont let killer to kill is a quite biased views.
It should be "devs would not let killer to kill the SWF" and it not only happens in this PTB but, sadly, is always true for all past year's updates.
Here is the circle of DBD: Killers got bullied by SWF, so they begin to dodge the SWF to bully the solo survivors, desperate solo survivors then begin to join SWF so they can bully Killers. Result: we get more and more SWF and more and more billy and nurse.
Devs just never know how to balance SWF against solo rather than killer against survivor
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Can't say that is even accomplished half the time. The Plague for example feels slow and clunky with needless down time in between uses of power.
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Sweet. Sounds like an awesome Q&A. You done good devs. Keep it up.
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I didn't even watch the Q&A, but knew the outcome. They ignored all the tough questions as usual.
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well they answered some with some variation of "Killer's shouldn't kill" but yeah, they ignored a chunk of pressing issues.
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