4K Slug strategy becoming too common. Needs a fix.
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No mither is supposed to be hard difficulty for survivor.
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Difficulty without any reward.
If not buff the perk in game play, then at least reward with more blood point, like increase the maximum bloodpoint earned to 64.000 instead of 32.000
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Things that have been happening since the start if the killer really wants a 4k
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Just let flip flop fill the wiggle meter up to 80% it punishes slugging.
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Wait, people who care about pips exists? Lol
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True, the only thing why it has become more "annoying" for survivors is, that even, when the killer picks up a downed one, hook and kill them, they still can have the EGC advantage. It feels kinda like too much.
But to be quite honest, the situation when there are only two survivors left, is just problematic in general. Most of the time it doesn't make sense for a survivor to be active and non-hiding at that point. Which leads to a frustrating lengthening play for the killer as well. Hard to adress this situation. I can understand, when survivors become "selfish" and become passive and I understand, when killer slug to secure a 4k.
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The reason why you get a warning with no mither is because the unlimited chances to get back up.
It's also why unbreakable is a one-time use thing it doesn't warn the Killer so you could do it with a higher chance of being left on the ground.
What both of you are suggesting would be too overpowered and annoying there would be no way for the killer to know you have it or if it was just you getting healed.
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I've always thought it would be cool if there was an altar to the entity in the basement that interacting with would do different things like allow you to heal to full health without a medkit or self-care, and pick yourself up off the ground without another survivor's help in exchange for making it incredibly dangerous for you especially if the killer has Territorial Imperative.
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How would it be overpowered? It's like with a survivor, you don't KNOW the killer has BBQ and Chili, you EXPECT it, so you hide from it. As killer, this would only encourage killers to EXPECT Unbreakable, so they'd hook instead of slug. It's not overpowered to counter a killer's choice of playstyle, It's like a killer using NOED. You don't know the killer has it, but you have a way to prevent it. There's a way to prevent unbreakable, so in no way can it be overpowered. You make a conscious decision to leave them on the ground. They could be healed, or they could unbreakable up. If it was overpowered that would mean it would have no counterplay. The counterplay would be to hook them instead of leaving them on the ground to bleed out. There's nothing wrong with a perk doing it's job instead of being a one off perk. There're no killer perks I can think of that only happen one time per game.
No Mither's broken status effect isn't there to give information to the killer. No Mither is just a hard mode perk as it is and the ability to get up infinitely is in no way strong enough to warrant being broken all game or telling the killer that they can get back up.
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should have a random chance to hurt or help you.
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cause here is the difference between Killer and Survivor Perks. There are 16 perks on Survivor side and 4 on Killer.
Combine your idea with DS and you are ASKING people to be bastards.
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DS is a one time perk though, just like Unbreakable. It'd just force DS to work(or Unbreakable) the one time you tunneled them. You can already do this with No Mither. The difference is No Mither gives significant disadvantages, but no one really complains about this combination. Or are you saying DS should have a way to not work whatsoever if you tunnel a survivor and slug them instead of hooking?
The difference in perks is small, because when facing the killer only 4 of them are working against him, if they're evasion/defensive related perks, which they usually are. There's also Adrenaline, which does nothing for most of the game.
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Oh? And what if everyone has those perks? Then it's 4 times. It would be over powered if DS or Unbreakable worked more than once. Why do you think they haven't been changed? 60 seconds of locker jumping fun times is enough for me thanks. Unbreakable is in a good spot cause it gives you that one up for free, if you are left alone. Combo that with DS and that "Crawl Fast" perk and i'll likely not find you before you get up unless I pick you up instantly.
But whatever man. It's your opinion.
HAve fun in the Fog.
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Firstly to those who simply say. Use anti slugging perks like unbreakable or no mither. Firstly that's called hindsight. Anyone can finish a match and go. Oh I should of used this perk. Every killer is different. And you shouldn't be forced to take a set of perks just because if you don't. You will 100% lose. That in my personal opinion is poor design or at the very least poor playing on the part of killer/survivor.
Second, rank system should be scrapped. Completely removed. All it does at the end of the day is narrow down killer and survivor playstyles. Remove the system and just mix survivors of all skill levels. It let's low levels learn. Killers get games that aren't completely toxic and high ranks get games quicker.
Its better for everyone if the rank system is scrapped. Because if you think about it the rank system actually works against the killer. Just imagine every player as they rank up gets more skilled at the game. From rank 20 - 1. From noob to 110% sweaty mode. The survivor side gets exponentially better than killer. Killer only has himself. The survivors each get better. In the end. The survivors together are 4 times better than a killer (in theory) every survivor can loop, hide, evade and save consistently and are coordinated. Even without swf. The killer can only get better to a point. He's still out numbered. And all it takes is one person to keep is attention for a few minutes for him to lose. Even if he switches targets it matters little. All the survivors are just as good. There's no weak link. Where as in a random game. You'll notice these weaker links and can focus them down. Skill matters little to a gen. Skill doesn't make you do a get a whole lot faster. But skill does determine how long you can keep the killer busy. And low level survivor will likely have to hide or evade the killer at first.
Hope that made sense. On why the rank system should be scrapped.
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Gen rushing strategy becoming too common. Needs fix
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You want the 4k slugging to stop? Then look to the culprit - the emblem system.
In the red ranks, you are pretty much required to 4k if you want to rank up. Ask for that to to change, and I can guarantee that more killers will risk the hatch.
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Maybe, once all remaining Survivors are in the Dying Health State, they can then vote together to have the Entity kill them with that End Game Collapse kill animation. 🤷♂️
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Your fault if all 4 of you somehow manage to be close enough to be 4k slugged.
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Wait, how's tenacity help with being slugged (especially when there's two survivors left)? Unbreakable and No Mither both let you get up by yourself.
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Using certain perks to counter killers is a bad idea though. Besides No Mither keep you injuried all the match wich is a bad idea. Unbreakable just work one time.
Besides it's like asking killers to bring Ruin every match just because some SWF teams pop gens too fast.
I guess some people are frustrated that in the role that they enjoy more (killers) they are "forced" to bring it. It's not necessary to bring hex: ruin every match, also it's not necessary to be in red ranks every season, I mean, seriously If you don't enjoy being in red ranks because you face so many sweaty survivors. Why are you trying your best to get in rank 1 everytime? Just because you want to say "I am a red rank killer" so I am good in this game and know what this game needs? Play casually with rank 10 guys.
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Do you tunnel people four times? Because if you do, then yes, it'd be 4 times, one for EACH survivor that you're chasing after they were immediately put off the hook, but those four perks don't all work at once, they work for every 1v1 instance. And yes, I used to think a minute for DS was far too long like you, but then I started playing survivor more, and got into higher ranks where I started feeling how short that minute actually was after I started HAVING to use DS because of all the tunneling(which I originally thought was a survivor mistake, but then found out that killers actually commonly wait outside of hook range and come back to the hook within seconds and down you again). It wouldn't be OP, it'd just allow perks that you can nullify by slugging despite actually STILL tunneling. If you don't, then you'd never see the DS and could still pick them up and put them on the hook like normal. You're basically saying "Survivors should only have 2 working perks otherwise it's OP", if you count every survivor having Adrenaline. That has nothing to do with unbreakable being allowed to happen every time you're slugged, and would not make it OP in the slightest. As I said, you could never see those DS if you didn't tunnel them, and then both perks would be useless if you hooked them after downing them. Or you could risk the DS or the Unbreakable. Both are counterable, even if they were infinite use perks, they would still be counterable.
I don't really see how this would make anything OP. You're trained in this game to expect the unexpected, so that you're not surprised by anything. If it became unlimited, Unbreakable wouldn't feel so bad about being taken. Even with Unbreakable, you'd still left on the ground for most of the match if they slug you more than once. If you expect Unbreakable, you're not hit by it. If you expect DS, you're also not hit by it, so there's no way this would be overpowered unless you went out of your way as the killer to make it overpowered.
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best idea yet
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0 gens finished and yet hooking the third survivor means the last has a chance to escape. If you are playing to rank up this is detrimental with how the killer emblem system works. Sadly slugging for the 4k is one of the few ways a high rank killer can push for a 1 pip game and avoid being screwed over by the emblem system. Trust me its not fun on either side but the 0 gen hatch spawn mechanics has made it the only viable way to maintain and obtain that pip.
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That would just be a waste of a perk slot if you ask me. I mean you will take a chance and use a perk slot for a possible slug that’s not most likely gonna happen
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What you're forgetting is the second the killer hits somebody with noed or Devour even if it's with their secondary ability or if the survivor is already injured it will still tell everybody.
Some Killers will just leave them slugged to waste time or if they simply have other things too preoccupied them not every time you down a survivor is it the most optimal thing to pick them up.
For example you down a survivor and you know this someone's destroying your hex totem the best thing to do is to chase person maybe even down or hook them.
Also that removes any optimal use on the survivors part if you decide to blow your unbreakable that's your fault.
Also killer perks that only happen one time per game
Blood warden
Haunted grounds
Corrupt intervention
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If you hate being slugged and you don't bring any of the handful of viable perks that help counter the tactic, then I have no sympathy for you.
You can't have everything 100% your way. DBD is unique in that it will give you perks that allows you to specifically tailor yourself to deal with things you don't like. Pick the things you don't like dealing with, and build against them.
But you dont' get to refuse to build against something that has a counter perk then whine to have it removed, that is unacceptable.
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at this point, let's just say we both have our own opinions on it. You don't wish to see my side, or it seems you don't, and I can't understand your side.
Side Note: I don't tunnel or camp or even slug that much and have hours of footage to show it. I still get hit with DS cause I down someone and opps! They still had a few seconds! Or you get those people that get unhooked and walk in front of you to block you while you are chasing someone else cause they have BT on them and prolly DS to boot. Or the Locker thing or so on and so on.
No mither has a draw back cause you CAN get up unlimited. Unbreakable is once cause you Don't have a draw back. I'm not saying "survivors should only have two working perks or it's OP." and frankly im not even sure how you got that from my post. All I was saying is you can't just think about the 4 survivors perks in a vacuum cause they (over the whole team) can have the same perk more than once or have 16 different perks (as rare as that is)
I do not know how to explain this clearer, so if we still can not agree, I think we should just live and let live on it.
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I could live with this. Seems like a good compromise to both sides.
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This is the reasons perks exist, bring unbreakable and you have the potential to waste a ton of the killers time.
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Those perks tell all survivors for one reason. Unbreakable is nowhere near the same power level as NOED or Haunted Grounds or Devour Hope. Those perks tell everyone because they are extremely powerful and if no one knew that the killer had it outside of the person who was hit with it, then they would simply play as normal and the killer could EASILY get a 4k. Like so easily it's nothing. Do you know how easy the game becomes once Devour Hope is triggered? The game is pretty much won. Yeah, it takes a while to get the ball rolling and doesn't happen very often, but when it does, you don't even have time to look for the totem(plus the killer knows where it is). With NOED it's the same thing. A 3 escape would turn into a 4k EASILY if no one actually knew the killer had NOED. This is the same as a survivor using Dead Hard. Once they use it the first time the only thing they can do is use it to close distance, and even the first time most killers expect it(as I said, you should always expect the unexpected, and if you did, then all of these thoughts of it possibly being overpowered would go away).
As for the one time use perks you mentioned, they all happen at a specific point in the game. Haunted Grounds happens when you cleanse the hex(and it's a hex perk, of course it's a one time perk). Blood Warden happens after the gates are opened, and I don't think I need to explain WHY Corrupt Intervention is a one time use perk. It's literally impossible for it to be made a multiple use perk. Unless they made it where they were blocked off when you hooked someone for significantly less time, but that'd basically be Thrilling Tremors. That said, if you want Blood Warden to happen multiple times in the end game, I'd be totally fine with that as long as Unbreakable was made multi use. I thought that was strange that it only happened once anyways but I can kinda see why it is the way it is, it's still miles more powerful than Unbreakable.
I said that, because if a survivor has Unbreakable and DS, and you don't want either of them to work against you(as in you don't want to be hit with DS or Unbreakable despite them bringing it), then you're saying they should only have 2 working perks, and that's even discounting Adrenaline if they brought it, which is essentially not a perk until endgame. THAT is how I got that from your post. You're saying you don't want to be hit by Unbreakable or DS, and claim they'd be OP if they were multi use. If you don't tunnel or slug, then you will never be hit by either. Also trust me, one minute is NOT a long time. Most games last probably around 15 minutes. If you hooked 4 people 3 times and ended chases by one minute per survivor that'd be 12 minutes for all four survivors(and we know that doesn't usually happen, someone usually dies on second hook or even worse first). If you're hit with DS, you may not have intended to go after them, but they didn't have enough time off the hook for you to hook them again. If you think of it like that, then it's easier to understand. And if you slugged someone right after they were unhooked, it's still tunneling. This is why unbreakable would not be OP if it was multi use. I'm not saying you DO do this, obviously, but if you were hit with DS, you tried to hook them ENTIRELY too early(You couldn't have even given them a full minute off the hook if you were hit with DS). As for the "locker thing", if you're not chasing them, then they wouldn't have had to run into a locker to get you to be hit with DS to begin with, which again, would imply tunneling. They only get into a locker because people leave them on the ground AFTER tunneling them so they aren't punished for doing it. It's not some bully tactic, it's actually a defense AGAINST a killer related bullying tactic.
I understand you think it might be too strong when combined, but I honestly think it wouldn't. Unbreakable rarely even gets to be used the one time, which is why I don't bring it. At least with DS I have ways to make sure it gets use if someone is trying to tunnel me while also avoiding it. As for No Mither having downsides, I'm sorry, but No Mither's downsides FAR outweigh it's plus sides. Like so much that people call it the "Hard Mode" perk. If that doesn't tell you just HOW BAD No Mither is, then I don't know what to tell you. So if the ability to pick yourself back up unlimited times is so strong, why is No Mither considered a "Hard Mode" perk? If it's so strong, it would be meta, despite it's downsides. The ability to pick yourself back up is minor. So much so that even Unbreakables rarely actually happen the one time. But sometimes you might rarely run into that one killer who slugs everyone all game, and when that happens, you need to unbreakable more than once, and without No Mither, which again, is a perk that literally gimps you so far that it's not worth taking if you actually want something to BENEFIT you, that just isn't possible. It doesn't help that No Mither basically tells the killer "Don't leave me on the ground or you'll regret it!". Those types of games are 10 times more miserable than any game you could possibly have as killer, and there is no way to counter them without taking a perk that halves your chances of survival.
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My friend, I think you read what I was saying wrong. I do want to point out I never Slug, Tunnel, or Camp if I can help it and have many hours of footage to show you if you do not believe me AND I STILL GET HIT WITH DS. I don't mind DS and Unbreakable being used at the same time. It would be silly to be upset with that. It's two perks that work together. But having them work more than once would be very very bad balance wise. You could just get up forever or DS every time you got picked up. That would be very very unfun for the Killer and very very OP.
The "locker thing" is used on me when i patrol gens and the person that got unhooked hops into a locker. What am I to do? Leave them so they can work on the gen? Eat the Ds? How am I bullying them when I am patrolling Gens? You seem to not understand that people abuse in game mechanics on both sides. Like using BT to body block for someone else, or DS to do the same. Not even counting the Locker thing and then Headon after the DS for giggles.
I am glad YOUR games last 15 minutes. I've never had one get that long, Myself.
60 seconds is a very long time if you consider that a gen, being worked on alone with no perks, toolboxes, or great skill checks can be done in 80 seconds.
Unbreakable being multiuse would be OP. It has no drawbacks and the Killer would have NO idea you had it.
You can miscount by 2 seconds of 60 and get hit with DS.
No mither has such a downside BECAUSE you can get up infinitely.
Also, have you felt the misery of being a Killer that gets bullied or has 2-3 gens pop after catching and downing one guy cause you arn't one of the Meta-killers and Loops are insane? I don't think picking a perk willingly is more miserable then that.
I think you are looking at this one one side way too heavily, and I'll admit I might be doing the same, But I can not honestly understand WHY you think it's okay for them to be multiuse. How you can't see how that would be abused. I would like to see your feed back on my reasons.
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I suggested Unbreakable alone being multi use. You'd likely only be able to get off one DS per game anyways. So how would it be OP if you didn't slug? As for people getting in lockers, again, they haven't had even one minute off the hook. If they hop in a locker when you patrol gens, then yeah, if you want them, you should eat the DS. That's not abuse of a game mechanic, that's just making sure the perk, which they used a perk slot for, does it's job, as you can actually have a perk not work the entire game by taking it.
As for "abuse of in game mechanics", BT body blocking would only work if it was at the end game, because as a killer you move much faster than survivors. You may get 2 seconds of someone body blocking you with BT, and that would only really work in the end game. If they're using DS to body block, then they're kind of idiots, because they'll just get slugged. You get MORE pressure off that because you got one on the ground while you're chasing another. That's 3 people at least off gens.
As for gens being done in 80 seconds, that is almost never the case. There's always Ruin, Thanataphobia, Pop, or Dying Light going on(and in most cases a combination of two of those perks). There's no way you'd ever get a gen done in 80 seconds unless they found Ruin at the beginning of the game. Even the best DBD players fail skill checks at some point, and in some cases several times to where they actually end up looking for Ruin.
Why does a perk need drawbacks? Unbreakable is not overpowered. It has a solid, clear counter, which is picking up the survivor.
Why are you counting for seconds for DS? That just says you're looking to rehook a survivor at exactly 60 seconds after they're off the hook, and in the case of what you said earlier, that's not even the time a single gen can be completed.
Yeah, No Mither has a down side because you can pick yourself back up infinitely, but you cannot honestly tell me the that if No Mither is balanced to be a perk with a good thing, and a bad thing, that it is balanced to where the good thing is better than the bad thing. The bad thing is probably 20 times worse than the good thing. The only reason people take No Mither is for a challenge, or to better their gameplay because they have to play even more carefully.
Yes, I have. I've actually felt the misery of not finding a single person until right when last gen popped as well. Doesn't compare even slightly to the misery of playing survivor against a killer who leaves multiple people on the ground all game. Hell it doesn't even compare to facing a killer without DS. Just had a game earlier where I had to escape with Jeff(ritual). He's level 1 so all I had was Breakdown, and guess what happened? It was against a Ghostface with stalk increase addons and he downed me, waited for me to be unhooked, chased me again, downed me, waited for me to be unhooked again, and downed and hooked me yet again. Imagine how fun that was for me? Sure, 2 others got out(because he camped the other person), but do you really think I enjoyed that game? I'd rather play killer and be bullied, because at least I have some control over what I do. As a survivor, you don't if the killer decides to be a dick.
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Meh. You have your opinion and I have mine.
Also yes, gens getting done in 80 seconds is never the case cause of Great Skill checks, Toolboxes, perks and someone helping you. So you list the negatives and i'll list the positives to speed.
Unbreakable is not overpowered AS IT IS NOW. If you could do it infinitely it would be. That is the exact reason "No Mither" makes you injured, as I have told you a few times now.
Why am i counting the seconds? Cause I don't wanna get hit with DS cause they have 3 seconds left, not cause i'm following them and breathing down there neck the whole time. You want footage of how I play? I can put it on your wall.
It's obvious neither of us will change our mind. Let's agree to disagree and both drop it. I hope you have good games, and if you play PC I'll see you in the Fog. Other than that, have fun in the Fog on whatever console you have.
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Yeah, I don't think either of us will change our minds either, and yeah, there are positive things, but I will say a toolbox without socket swivels and BNP doesn't do much(maybe like 12 seconds off a gen total), and great skill checks do nothing with Ruin(except prevent regression), and a lot of people suggest not using Prove Thyself because it actually helps the killer more than the survivors. I'll also mention that if you DON'T have Prove Thyself, there's actually a penalty to gen speed(and this happens a lot) when working on a gen with others, so I didn't list all the negatives. Heck, I bring Prove Thyself just to get gens done at all, because most of the time, other survivors don't do gens well with Ruin. Prove Thyself helps create less skill checks, which in turn allows a chance of opening the doors. I die far more times than I survive(unless I get a killer who isn't super good but also isn't a complete dick), but I still pip on most occasions, unless something happens like I mentioned earlier, and a killer is on my ass the entire game as soon as I get unhooked.
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Well, at least you didn't insist to see my footage or anything otherwise i'm a "Tunneling Killer noob." I've had people do that then they see how I play and they shut up. I hope you get better games in the future man. Have fun in the Fog!
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My mentality is I never slug the third survivor, because it's boring as hell trying find that blendette while #3 bleeds out going for the 4k, with the only goal being to pip up so that I can face even more bastardly toxic survivors then are in the current game.
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Never seen a killer actually use territorial imperative unless its a huntress going for adept. I used it once on KYF in a trapper basement build tho.
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Dedicated servers are making it worse.
Since the ECG was introduced, if the killer found the hatch before sacrificing the third survivor, he usualy had enough time to close it and the last survivor couldn't do anything about it.
Now with the latency caused by dedicated servers, the last survivor can jump in the hatch while the killer is closing it and escape with complete impunity. So any killer who care about pipping is forced to slug enven more than before.
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You basically just named my tap build... Slug away punks i gots you
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It lets you crawl an still heal
Hopefully losing killer to get up
Deerstalker makes that irrelevant
But who runs that.
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Slugging is for sweaty players, and I agree OP... they should implement a built in unbreakable at some point if you've been slugged twice or something.
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loooooooooooool
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UNBREAKABLE
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😂🤣
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