NOED needs either a nerf or to be removed.
Of all the things I have found wrong with DBD, the biggest issue I have had for way too long is No One Escapes Death. I refuse to see why this perk has went so long without a nerf. I'm not going to say to remove it, but something needs to change, because I'm tired of playing a game great only to die immediately to NOED. And it's hard to find the will to stay on the hook, since then all you do is risk killing anybody else. I'm not saying ditch this perk, because I understand that the best use of this perk comes from matches that went poorly for the killer. However, this inspires toxic gameplay. I absolutely despise the fact that you can do awful the entire game, yet still possibly net a 4K due to this single perk. Ruin was changed because people hated how annoying it was, but Ruin didn't need a change anywhere near as bad as this perk. Here are just a few ideas on how to nerf this perk: 1. When the killer runs this perk, change the design/color of the totems, that way it is worth it to cleanse dull totems, but doesn't totally eliminate the possibility of NOED actually triggering. 2. Have a requirement for the exposed effect, like only have the exposed effect if 4 or 3 of the survivors are still within the trial. This will still help Killers who've had a bad game, without entirely removing the ability for the survivors who've played well to escape. 3. Buff the survivors in some way. This doesn't have to be a big buff at all, but anything that makes it slightly easier to not die immediately is worth it. Like, how about removing all the survivors' exhaustion or make vaulting pallets and windows a bit faster. Just one of these tweaks would make playing against a killer with this perk infinitely more enjoyable, without making this perk worthless to run. Please, anybody consider this and spread it. Out of all the current balance issues, this one seems the most obvious.
Comments
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Do bones.
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Do I really have to point out that doing bones is incredibly pointless? Most other survivors don't do them, it takes time away from doing something productive, and you have no idea whether the Killer is running NOED until it's often too late. This perk rewards bad play on the killers side and punishes survivors for playing well.
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I believe solo survivors need to cooperate before the match to choose someone who will do the bones and will take specific perks or a map with add-ons.
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They're not always exactly visible now, are they?
And before you mention it, Small Game doesn't exactly help all the time. I've had it go off, but I still couldn't see the totem.
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As much as I'd like this to work, relying on others in this game can, more often than not, take you back.
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Do bones. The answer is not gonna change... right now, at least. If you make enough of a fuss, the devs will eventually cave in.
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Again. Invisible bones.
I have searched entire maps, never to find any. I'm not blind, but some of these are just too well hidden.
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Clean totems. Run small game.
I don't usually equp hexes because that's a power that rely on survivors fault.
Post edited by Saitamfed on7 -
Imagine wanting something that already has the easiest counterplay to it to be nerfed. You can literally disable the perk by cleansing the totems. "But I can do something more productive" well maybe stop being a try hard? If you're so focused on objectives that you literally want an easy way to something, it just shows that there's no reasoning to your suggestion. 10 seconds wasted by a survivor is nothing compared to a killer wasting 10 seconds, and you do realize that you have 3 other teammates, right? Just like everyone tells killer mains, I'll say the same to you. Adjust your play style.
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Have a better idea of what you should do?
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I disagree. On the game's current state, NOED doesn't need a nerf.
Gen speed and map sizes are absolutely broken, which is why 'Ruin' was overrused. Also, because 'Ruin' would significantly slow down the early game (while still active), most survivors would search for it. Therefore, looking for 1 totem, they would find a few - potentially all of them - and then at the end of the match, NOED would not activate. If survivors do not decide to cleanse a totem that is not active, well, that's on them.
Now what is happening is: survivors do not see the need to search for 'Ruin'. Instead, they sit on gens smashing M1. So, of course, NOED will activate at the end.
I've had games where I hit a survivor working on a gen and he simply carried on. That is also toxic behaviour inspired by the 'Ruin' nerf - after all, the perk do not represent any risk if you decide to stay on gens.
As a killer, it doesn't depend on your skills to win a match - it depends on relaying on survivors mistakes. In this cases, the survivors' mistake is not cleanse totems.
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I wonder how survivors can find ruine (rip) or any others totem on the first 30 s ?
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I know, right? Survivors have it so easy but they have almost zero to none appreciation. They literally have no other objective then do gens, cleanse totems and open the gates. As a killer, you have 4 survivors to chase, hit (twice), hook and (hopefully) kill while defending 5 gens and you have to really pick your fights wisely. One hook now can easily cost you two gens (and you need another two hooks to kill that 1 survivor) so you must drop chases often even when you get a hit - but if that survivor have medkit or Self-Care, your chase was a total waste.
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I love how the answer to my "do bones" post is literally "but I'm too lazy to do bones, please nerf the perk!"
And I run small game on one of my survivors' builds and I never have troubles finding totems because I can recognize the tiles and where they spawn in them.. And heck even without the perk, you start knowing the spawn points. Some are well hidden, I'll admit, but still, your laziness isn't a reason to nerf a perk that has easy counter play.. You have the entire game to cleanse them, it's not as if the perk was active from the start.
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If the problem is that people aren't doing totems because they don't know if the killer is running NoED the solution is simple: Make NoED part of the Killer's base skillset. Let the survivors know how many tokens still need to be cleansed in the HUD, because otherwise that'd be unfair. But if NoED is base kit, then survivors aren't 'wasting time' by doing totems.
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Is it lazy if I can't see them? And I've had games where I've been running Small Game and STILL couldn't find them.
And you'd be wrong! I do have an appreciation for killer and survivor equally, because I play both. Besides, there are that many Hillbillies lately that med-kits and Self-Care are kinda pointless.
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oo so now i can only play with my friends unless i want to be guarantee no ed or leave everyone for dead every round. thats reaaaal exciting, lets face it most survivors do not cooperate with each other. only at red rank do you find that 50% of the people there cooperate with you
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"because I'm tired of playing a game great only to die immediately to NOED"
*Holds M1 the entire match*
Like everyone is saying, just do bones dude, its not an waste of time, it's one of the two survivor objectives. Its not hard, just M1 for 16 seconds on the poor thing.
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Just cleanse bones before the last generation ;) problem solved.
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saying it's pointless is bs. You guys earn points for cleansing totems just like you do for generators and many other things. In fact I think you get more bps when you cleanse a to ten than you do a skill check. Just get over yourselves and cleanse bones.
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Remove it. Or rework it completely. We already have a fair version called devour. The perk as it is is bullshit.
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There's a perk for that.
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Again, it's a small notice in a direction, and not one I have room for between making sure I don't get tunnelled out of the game.
There are WAY more problems with NoED than "Just do bones". It requires you to do NOTHING in order to get its effect, there is no warning until the first hit, and a literal speed boost that lasts far longer than any Survivor speed bonuses.
So, yeah. I'll run Small Game and get tunnelled against a killer not running one perk for 9/10 games.
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I honestly don't understand the reason for wanting a tool/perk removed simply because you can't figure out a way to beat it. I play survivor most of the time and if I get noed and die tough. I move on to the next. It's a tool just like any other perk, and you talk about a killer turning it around after having an awful game all because of noed. It's your fault for not being able to adapt to a sudden change. Learn to adapt. Players like you so focused on "winning" and not enjoying the game is the biggest problem with the game.
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I never said this to anybody but... "get good". Are you wanting the killer helps you to finish generators as well? Run small game, learn totem spawn location then you won't need to use small game anymore or when there is a gen left head to the door so when the gen is finished, you open the exit gate and then you won't get a problem with NOED.
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Except you can still literally cleanse NOED and disable it almost immediately. Its rare to take out NOED as soon as that last gen pops, but it happens.
The devs have also talked on this numerous times and said they are not going to just nerf NOED. You sacrifice a perk slot to have that extra insurance in the endgame, that can be denied by doing a short, simple objective. So yes, it does have counterplay around it.
But lets not forget the tools you have to dismantle NOED. You have, small game and detectives hunch for one. You can bring a map with the proper addons or a rainbow map. You can divide up your team to search for it as the game goes on with SWFs, or just go and find all the totems yourself if you are knowledgeable on the spawns. You can even just make an educated guess on whether or not the Killer has NOED by just deducing what perks they have.
Dying to NOED can be frustrating sometimes, dont get me wrong, but with all the game changing perks Survivors can have, you have no reason to complain about the one Killers are barely clinging on to.
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I feel that bc ruin is dead, now survivors have to do bones or Mr skeletal will insta down them and sometimes that fear makes survivors divert their attention from gens to pleasing Mr skeletal because of the implied threat that noed has on them.
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"Get good" should be a bannable phrase with how much people spout it to derail actual conversation.
Not all of us are going to commit to memory something as arbitrary as token spawns. I'm not switching onto Small Game for several reasons, mainly that it doesn't fit into my builds, and a majority of killers don't use it.
I complain about it because it is bad perk design 101. Followed by No Mither.
There are TWO perks that give you exposed with no warning: Devour Hope and NoED. One you have to work for. That is the issue.
I know it can be cleansed and prevented, but when I climb to red, solo about 50% of the time (usually only 1 other person in SWF, sometimes 2), relying on randoms and using perks to keep myself alive, also limited by Archives challenges, Small Game literally does not have room in any of my perk builds.
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Well Im sorry to say this but you better learn to play around NOED, even as a solo queue survivor. Killers are going to bring it without prejudice now that ruin has been changed. And I agree that NOED is not a good perk design to follow, which is why I dont use it very often, but the state of the game on the Killer side just dictates the perk as a necessary evil for Killers now that ruin is changed. So unless the maps or objectives get reworked to give the Killers more time to actually play the game, NOED is probably not going to get nerfed anytime soon.
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It's not even good.
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But really, stop rushing the generators and go look for bones. It's not that hard. Sometimes they spawn in sneaky locations, but last week I had mine down in the hallway of a map of all places. It's RNG, so deal.
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You know that in 50% of my games, a generator is done before I find one, right?
And I also have been playing a runner build where I can, to distract and occupy the killer. Even when I'm running my Stealth build, most of the totems I find are already done.
Gen-rushing is not just one survivor. And yes, it is that hard. Certain spots like a particular circular shrubbery on Bedham are kind of hard to look in when I'm trying to avoid a chainsaw to the face.
"Just find totems" isn't that easy and I hate if my game is determined by RNG. That's what I play Warhammer 40k for.
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Survivors have it so easy? It sounds like you lose a lot of survivors in chases, allowing them to get a lot done. There are perks like Ruin, Discordance, Pop Goes the Weasel, etc, etc that are geared for slowing gen progress. Not to mention the killers that slow the game down a lot, like Legion (who can often get many easy hits if you play correctly), Doctor, Pig, etc. And what about the best killers? A good Nurse, Billy, or Spirit should know how to apply pressure to more than a few gens, not to mention they can end chases quickly.
Are players still complaining about the ruin change? Yes, the change was pointless, but ruin isn't worthless now. You just actually have to apply pressure to the map and force survivors off of gens. And those of you complaining that survivors stay on after getting hit? You realize there is an interrupt mechanic, right? As in, you pull them off of the gen, immediately putting them into the dying state, no matter what killer you play.
The exposed status effect and a speed boost "isn't that good". How much do you know about this game, exactly?
So killers don't have many game changing perks? Ah, yes, let me overlook BBQ, Ruin, Pop Goes, Discordance, the Spirit Fury + Enduring combo, nurse's calling, thrilling tremors, and Franklin's. All of those are just soooo bad.
This is just ignorant. You have never played survivor if this is what you believe. A survivor who's not just out for themselves and is looking to get as many people out as once know you need to take turns distracting the killer (getting chased) as wellbas spend time on the hook to try and prevent somebody else who's closer to death on the hook.
Do you go into games looking to lose? I'm not so consumed by the idea of victory that it taints my enjoyment of the game. If that was so, I'd have stopped playing DBD long ago. I am pretty upset that it's already hard enough in the end game, that a killer shouldn't be able to win easy, breezey, beautiful covergirl. After all, the amount of times the doors spawn a stone's throw away from each other is ridiculous. I'm a Killer main and it is stuependously easy when this happens. Players like you who are complacent with everything, in spite of glaring issues, are why problems do not get fixed.
Ah, so laziness is what keeps me from doing bones? Thank you for understanding my mindset entirely. Its not that I don't want to walk the entire map ringing a dinner bell for whoever the entity sent after me here, only to do one of three things. Either I could successfully do all five dulls, yet be no benefit towards getting chased or doing gens. Or I could do all but 1 or 2, because they are super hard to find and I resolved that another survivor must have done them. Or, alternatively, I could do my one or two, and hope that all the other three people whom I've never met before and have no idea how they think do their bones.
Refer above. But seriously, don't just use that meaningless phrase. "Get good". How can I avoid getting killed by NOED? Git gud. How can I get easy hits as a Killer? Git gud. How can I avoid breaking everything in a blind fit of rage purely because people believe that by simply using a phrase without adding any ideas on how to actually " git gud", and then move on, feeling they know much better than everybody else? Git gud.
I can't help but agree. Small game doesn't help against any other non-hex perks, making it ineffective way more than half the time.
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Another survivor who hasn't even play 100 hours yet. 😂😂
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😂😂😂 Bud your posts screams noob gamer. Get gewd kid
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I competently agree, buff survivors and you know what, just because ######### it? Remove killers altogether i lose about a third of my games and that's bullshit i should win everytime as survivor
But i dont think they'll remove NOED because its not a good perk but a vital tool for new killers since survivor even at the lowest ranks somehow tend to be toxic #########. NOED allows baby killers the motivation to keep going. If youre getting team wiped by a killer with noed…...literally how lol. Unless its an end game build i guess but if that's the case that's the whole point of the build
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I'm pretty sure I'm older than you, and I'm in red. I do not need to "get gewd".
Killers need to stop relying on a few select, stupidly powerful perks. I do it and I perform just fine.
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Noed is pretty balanced
So
Just
Uninstall
Bye
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"Are players still complaining about the ruin change? Yes, the change was pointless, but ruin isn't worthless now. You just actually have to apply pressure to the map and force survivors off of gens. And those of you complaining that survivors stay on after getting hit? You realize there is an interrupt mechanic, right? As in, you pull them off of the gen, immediately putting them into the dying state, no matter what killer you play."
Copied the quote pertaining to me.
Personally Im actually ok with the ruin changes, I think the perk is still good. The problem is that now the early game pressure that ruin provided is now gone. Not to mention a good chunk of killers dont have the map pressure needed to make the most use out of the new ruin as well. Some maps are just not well balanced at all, and can guarantee a loss in most instances with even semicompetent survivors. You ever play Shelter Woods with Legion or Crotus Penn Asylum back to back with Myers? It's not fun, its frustrating. If they arent going to shrink the maps they need to atleast fix the generator spread. Maps shouldnt be killer or survivor sided to these extents, it's pure frustration for the other side.
As for the interrupt mechanic, it doesnt help that half the time you go to grab the survivor, dedicated servers intervene and just completely negate the grab into a swing. Besides, any survivor worth their salt will atleast let go before the killer goes for a grab anyhow. Take it from any high rank killer player, survivors dont let you get free grabs off a gen unless they're baiting for DS or are completely oblivious. Or T3 Tombstone Myers, but thats a different case. Regardless, Killers need any tool to pressure survivors as much as they can right now, because its a numbers game for the Killers.
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Nice, a post with 0 value. I never understood people crying about Hex: NOED. It is not that hard to cleanse all totems.
Destroying a totem just takes around 12 seconds I think. If that task is too hard for you or this easy counter is too hard either then maybe leave this game alone.
Like it is not like we talk about DS there you can just get DS'd, slug or leave this person. I mean you even get points for that simple sht. And don't come me with fairness. DbD is not about fairness. Either you want to survive or kill, this is never a question about it is fair or not. I am sure some people don't think Adrenaline, Borrowed Times or BBQ is fair.
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The whole point of doing bones is to prevent this. NOED is fine. Survivor main who runs small game in his normal set up by the way. Bones are important too. Not just gens. This is why.
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What does older have to do with skill level? 😂😂 And if you think NOED is OP and needs nerfed than yes you do need to get gewd
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Survivors comeback mechanic:
If you're last survivor standing, hatch will ALWAYS spawn, even if 0 gens and you don't have any perks.
If hatch is closed you then get the exit gates powered.
Killers to get their comeback power need to:
Spend a perk slot.
Not have totems cleansed.
Find a survivor.
Hit said survivor.
Hope perk isn't cleansed.
Honestly, they should just add a totem counter and see how much that one change helps tho.
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I AGREE 100% #TRUTH
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We need noed
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Noed is good
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Exactly you right
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Simple. You called me a child, and I said that NoED is stupid, BS and badly designed. I did not anywhere say it was OP.
Maybe learn how to read before accusing me of anything.
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I like how most arguments in this is "NOED dumb" followed by "Just do bones" and in response "I don't wanna". Believe it or not Totems are hard to find, that's why small game exists to make the search easier. Cleansing totems has been a thing since the Hag was released, so you should be used to it by now, see a totem, break it, it's not rocket science.
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It penalizes ignoring totems and it gives the killer a second chance. If they need or remove killers one second chance they better do the same to all the survivor ones.
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