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Honestly, new ruin isn't that bad.
I know that this will piss many people off, but honestly, i feel like the games have gotten much more "balanced" in the way that developers mean (2 escapes, 2 hooks). Before ruin my team would succeed every third/fourth game, but now its actually more balanced. Even as killer, while obviously much more stressful, you can still 4k many games.
I know however there is problems with emblems and stuff (and what defines a win).
The only thing i have felt an impact of is the rise of camping insidious bubbas, lol, see these all the time pretty much.
The thing i would like to see to make the games a little less stressful for the killers would be to increase the number of gens needing to be completed depending on mapsize. If the map is incredibly huge, maybe you need to fix 7 gens instead of 5. That would atleast help with issues concerning map sizes.
But all an all, i actually like new ruin. What is your opinons on the matter? To big of a nerf, other ideas on what should be fixed, etc?
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It’s not a bad perk, it just doesn’t serve the same purpose as old Ruin and when you remove a plasterfix without addressing the actual issue, people won’t like the changes.
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Yeah thats true. They really should have looked into the problems (the things really causing the issues, like gentimes, mapsizes, etc) before nerfing ruin. Agreed.
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This.
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The problem is old ruin served 1 purpose: slowing down the early game to a manageable level without, as the devs say, "just start with your legs cut off and give them Gena for free." Now, it's not bad, but it serves a different purpose without a replacement for the core issue: early game.
Both teams need momentum to take control of the game. Killers need that early hook before/around gen 1 popping, but prior to 2 gens, to survive. Old ruin gave you that time and momentum. This didn't mean you'd win (meaning 3k+), but it'd give you a competitive edge to survive. Now, without that early pressure, you're liable to being behind all game, and never having a chance at winning, or having a draw for that matter.
People say Corrupt is the answer, however Survivors counter this in two ways: 1, waiting it out, and now you're in the same position as Ruin breaking 8 seconds in, and 2, leading you to chase into the blocked gens, meaning the other 3 get free gen time with no pressure, and you're at square one again. You could say you don't chase them if they run that way, at which point they go find an open gen and get to work, and you're at square 0.
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Corrupt only really works for killers with traps such as hag and trapper. It's good for setting up a 3 gen but once those 2 mins wear off you really need to be hooking. Like you said most people either hide until it wears off or just find an untouched gen. It's still not fixing the problem. Also with a toolbox gens get done way too fast now.
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Yeah, i agree that earlygame has become a problem. Many times me and my team will actually finish a gen, right before the killer gets to us. So i understand that that is something that became a bigger problem. I still feel like the endresult is the same though. I just wish devs would implement something to not drive killers insane with the amount of map-pressure they need to have. (as i stated above, 7 gens instead of 5 on big maps, etc) Because killers with low mobility dont have a chance in the earlygame anymore.
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The problem isn't just map pressure, I wish the devs would stop pushing this agenda of "Just pressure the Survivors, git gud." You need map pressure AND short ttk. I could have an insta to to any gen killer get screwed because his ttk is garbage.
There's a reason Nurse, Billy, and Spirit are all top tier: they have both. Freddy has amazing map pressure, but his ttk is the same as Clowns, which isn't that great. Go through the rest of the killers, and you'll figure out where they stand.
Obviously ttk is better than map pressure, which is why Nurse was always above the other two. However, if you're ttk is at least decent, then your map pressure is effective.
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Personally, i feel like most killers need a buff, but i dont think every killer should be in the same tier either. Thats why i think adding more gens depending on mapsize would be a good temporary solution until they come up with something better. I get what you're saying though.
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I think @Nameless hit the nail on the head.
The "new" Ruin isn't a terrible perk (it has some niche uses) but because it left a void that the old Ruin use to fill, (that is now left without a replacement) it has hurt the core match experience.
If the "new" Ruin was to have been introduced as a totally new perk (without replacing the old) I could see it being used in some fun gimmick builds, but the cost of having the perk replace old Ruin came at the killers expense (and the expense of us vet survivors who actually want to see some challenge return to the role).
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The perk has no effect on survivors. It is a joke and when you do want to run an endgame totem you are better off with devour hope than this ruin.
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Yeah i totally get where you are coming from. Now ruin is gone on expense of killers fun. Makes me wonder if they are planning on implementing some other sidechallenge for the survivors (which i'll hope they do).
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While i understand that devour hope is probably a better perk in the long run, i disagree that the perk has no effect on survivors. The new ruin is useful for killers who can keep pushing people of gens (aka Billy). Had a game where Billy would keep pushing us off, leaving all gens regressing, and only hooking when we ran into him (so no chases). Working pretty well, hence we lost the match.
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You tend to feel new Ruin much later in the game now. First couple of gens/deaths, it isn't noticeable since you can afford to stay on the generator.
When you're down to 2 people and 2 gens left, you really feel it when you are shoved off a generator.
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New ruin is good for pig if the totem doesn't get destroyed (lol), and that's about it. It makes survivors choose between finishing the Gen and screwing over their teammate with a trap on their head, or not doing the Gen and letting it regress quickly. But again, that requires the totem to not be found (lol).
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Billy didn't need old ruin and he doesn't need the new one. Perk is garbage.
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Devour Hope is probably the best hex perk now. Old Ruin got demolished in 30 seconds or ignored by good survivors. New ruin they don't even waste time to cleanse it. DH can have a nice surprise effect. What I've noticed is even before ruin got nerfed most survivors don't stop what they're doing and look for totems unless they know it's out there. They don't get a notice until there's 3 stacks and I hope the devs never touch it. Hex perks are so risky yet only 1 of them actually gives a reward. Lullaby is powerful but 5 hooks before the gens get done is way too much work. If you managed to pull that off those survivors are potatoes. I'm excluding NOED because if you get killed by that it's you and your teams fault. Since ruin was gutted I feel removing all notifications about a hex perk isn't asking for much. The devs have held their hands for far too long.
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Yeah, as a survivor, i can say that devour hope really catches you off guard when used. That is of course if there is a good totemspawn, because you know the saying, if it glows it goes. Especially when there hasn't been any other hexes, it really is a nice way to turn the table around as killer.
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Maybe the devs should start rethinking totemspawns, or perhaps make the cleansing time longer. Atleast that would give the killer the chance to protect it.
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What issue?
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I think they need to rethink the core mechanics of the game. They've added totem spawns left and right. Once people play a few times on each map they have the new locations memorized.
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Person with a blown off limb bleeding out = gen speed
Tourniquiet = old ruin
The devs took a tourniquiet off a person with a blown off limb without treating the blown off limb. While I really like your idea and think it should be tested, I feel that gen speeds would still be too fast
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Yeah, they should really test out some different ideas and mechanics on the future ptbs, and see which ones work best. I feel sometimes that devs don't test enough (ideas mostly) on the ptbs, after all they are meant for testing what works and what not. I would like to see more primary objectives aswell, both as killer and survivor. We hope for the future.
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True aswell. Totemspawns seem to be a problem, considering that an entire perkslot is used to be able to use them. Don't know how the devs would make anything else work except trying out randomized totemspawns, but that also seems like it would come with a lot of problems aswell. Seems like a difficult situation, especially now with ruin gone. Probably would have been better off fixing stuff like totemspawns before touching ruin, but thats life i guess.
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Maybe unpopular opinion but I think designating a 5th perk slot solely for hex items might be a good idea. This would help with the perk disparity(the killers 4 to the survivors 16) and makes it less of a cost if you wanna bring a second totem protection perk or even multiple mains so it is not as much of a cost to lose 1 totem.
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It’s to weak for a hex perk..the idea is cool but they either need to increase the numbers or make it a perk and not a hex..also they didn’t address why ruin was used so much
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4 perks and a hex perk seems OP and would be hard to balance imo
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It's good in theory. There's definitely been times where I've felt it's effect. It's nice not needing to kick the gens either. But unless you're able to keep people off the gens all the time, those things are going flying nowadays. Alright perk, ######### game balance.
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Yeah, that could actually be a good idea. That would still allow the killer to fully use his normal perks and not feel like one of them is wasted when ruin is gone within a few seconds. Cool concept.
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Agreed. They should test it being a perk in the next ptbs, so they can atleast see how it would work out.
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I guess we can always hope for another gamechanging perk in the next update?
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HEX TOTEMs are GARBAGE.
Lullaby: a dubious effect that may or may not help you much depending on how m1 experienced the survivor is that you have to build up with like 5 hooks. Gets destroyed almost every time before even reaching tier 2.
Third Seal: No idea if its helping you or not. Still got to slap every survivor to get it working. Gets destroyed very quickly. It really needs an additional effect, or it just blinds every one until its gone.
Hex Ruin: New: Dosen't have very tough competition. The only good hex is DH and Haunted Grounds since they are actually worth the risk. If you got the perks to Synergize ruin it can be very good and IF.....IF...you can lay down the pressure hard. Really hard and the survivors make some early game mistakes and the ruin hasn't been spawned next to a gen or in the open for near instant destruction.
It will drill the team down. But since new ruin makes other...better regression perks like pop, surge and maybe overcharge worthless while it's active it's not worth running more than those more stable, safe perks.
Hex Ruin has the potential to be powerful. It dosen't suffer the same fate as many hex totems. They just need to keep the good hiding spots and get rid of the horrible ones. Maybe assure that hexes always spawn a certain reasonable radius away from survivors. Ironically...old ruin at least applied a active pressure on survivors that made them totem hunt.
new ruin is easily countered with a tap to check and a m1 spree. As if gen rushing wasn't incenticized enough.
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Perks aren't gonna cut it. If we're reliant on perks to slow down gens, we're still gonna be practically limited to 2 or 3 choice perks at best. Gen speed nerf is the only solution.
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Yes, but knowing devs, i have a hard time believing genspeed nerf is gonna be implemented. I think if we are gonna get remotely close to something that resembles a genspeed nerf, a perk is gonna be it. Gen speed nerf in general would be cool, but i just have hard time thinking its ever gonna get implemented.
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