The Hillbilly Problem

Dude are you just really bad?

If you can't figure out how to counter him, watch OhTofu's guide. Yes, Billy is one of the better killers, but he's very balanced. The things 'most' Billys do are pretty easy to counter. If he's revving his chainsaw at every pallet, punish him and loop it again before throwing. If not, force the M1 and he becomes like every other killer. Don't get caught in the open and the average Billy can't get a chainsaw on you.

Given how you're talking I doubt you're anywhere near red ranks. If you are, you should be good enough at mindgames to counter the things better Billys do like flicks and chainsaw feathering. If you can't, you don't deserve to be anywhere near red ranks and need to get good. Stop whining on the forums and trying to ruin the game for everyone else.

Ah okay. So you literally just said using his power in an effective and smart manner is the reason why. Good to know. Also, why would he M1 you when you're out of position, why would he use his power to his disadvantage? It isn't abuse to literally use what your power was designed for.

Partial Billy Main here. Wanna clear up first; not the best killer, got lots to learn, rank 10 atm, have reached purple (cause ranks like matter yknow?? No? Ok ok I'll move on)

Is Billy, or at least Insta saw Billy insane? Needs a change? Lack skill? What about the average Billy? What about Millies? Is Billy easier to learn in general? Take more or less skill than Nurse or Spirit?

Insta-saw Billy could use some changing. There is a notable difference with those add-ons and ofc they are my favorite add-ons. In my opinion, there is also a notable difference in skill with these add-ons versus without.

Average Billy without these add-ons (really just including the insta add-ons for the most part) is, in my opinion, one of the most balanced killers in the game, aside from maybe huntress and demo. Again my opinion. I feel Billy's basekit is counterable by more than just loops. Even out in the open, you can out maneuver a chainsaw, despite a 5m distance. I know it, because I have both done it and have had it done to me. Billy isn't like bubba where position is immensely important. It matters yes, but it doesn't tremendously hurt you. Granted, a solid Billy is likely to compensate for his mistake and go again or just M1 you. The point is, without the add-ons, his kit is solid and pretty balanced.

Millies don't need a change, they just need to practice. Unless they're meming.

You mention the ratings given to each killer, but I feel those are misjudged/misperceived. Hag is labeled as intermidiate, but I find her to actually belong in the difficult rating. She is quite different and requires a different strategic setup from the others. Unless you compare her to trapper, directly, then she Should be easy, yea? I'm not hating on your ratings, don't worry <3 just explaining my side and how I view those ratings ^,^

You mention that Billyboi is the strongest killer in game... He is definitely frightening in the right hands, but he is not the strongest killer. His one hit down and Bubna's are "similar". So does that make Bubba strong too? Both require certain niche situations, but Billy can still be countered, even in his niche (otherwise known as the open range or out of position). As I mentioned above, you can out maneuver a non Insta Billyboi.

Now. Skill. Does Billy require skill. In contrast to Nurse or Spirit there is significantly less area or gap for a Billy. Howeber. This does not exclude the fact that he does require skill in order to play. Especially a regular billy. His chainsaw is in itself, without addons, his skill. Your timing, movement, predictions; all matter when versing most optimal survivors. Of course nurse requires more, she has her drawbacks with huge reward if played well. So does Billy. Granted he is straightforward, but that doesn't eliminate his skill. I didn't get him immediately, and I started him after playing just hag up until rank 13. (This is when I first started killer, not anytime recently) yes, he can be an immediate grab for some, but he isn't for everyone and he does require skill on some level.

Camping and tunneling Bullies are strange and can feel so crappy, but I am among the people who understands it can be a strategic method, even when it's used on me. When it happens and there's room for it, do what you can to outplay the killer. Not saying that's the only way to handle it, just saying when there's room for it. Not all campers, including Billy and the best camper, Bubba, are unbeatable. They're overzealous chainsaws, eagerness to smack survivors, need to try and hook grab, are all things in which your ally can make a play between. And if you know what your opponent is doing (ie the leaving and coming back for a tunnel or for a camp), time it or wait a few seconds before saving immediately.

You say there's a problem with the lack of skill with high reward. This is due to how you feel about Billy. A lot of players, not saying all, have changed their opinions because of how many Billies theyve gone against. Before nurse and spirits changes, you would see so many of that killer every match and it got frustrating. Same thing goes with new Freddy now. Opinions change the more frustrations grow. It gets boring or tedious going against the same killer over and over, so it creates those same frustrations, which causes complaints. Im sure a lot of the people now who say Billy needs a change (NOT including you or every single person) are likely people who also found him to be balance like myself and others. I remember hearing from so many people via comments, forums, etc, on how common "billy is balanced, just fix insta saw" "billy is balanced" etc before this overpopulation of Billies.

You said you have played him and you are in green ranks. You said he was easy and you are against red ranks seeing you are in console like myself. You finding no survivors trying to not outplay you? In my opinion, a killers ability to kill shouldn't be based solely on survivors who offer no potential outplay.

Sadly though, because he is in the hatelight, so to speak, there is a HIGH chance they will look at him, if nothing else. Considering his standing with so many people, survivors and killers alike, if they change him immensely, there will be more annoyed people than we already have. Of course this is just speculation.

Just my input on the matter. I play killers in variety on who I own and again, not ze best killer around, still got lots to learn. I do, however, play a lot of Billy.

aahaha, Hillbilly OP 🤣

Every time I read it, it's just hilarious. You can tell a survivors skill by what killers they think are OP. Or that they think any are OP at all xD

That's understandable because of the notable difference in skill between those three killers. But that wasn't my only point in my comment. I was giving a counter to your points, I tried to bring them all up and when I mentioned your rank as killer, I wanted to see how often you used him and what the survivors are like. You say it takes now skill, I was saying it does, in a gist of things.

But I am not here to just blatantly argue, nor do I want to come off as doing so. I'm a lover of Billy, and I feel I have played him and versed him enough to give my opinion about him. Not saying you weren't allowing me to do so, just me rambling.

Not specifically you. But there's a lot of it in this thread. I fully acknowledge you didn't say he was OP.

I disagree with him not taking skill. If they were the case, a rank 20 would be 4king every match with him. Hell, I face rank 1 Billy's who get looped to oblivion. On Coldwind maps, where they have an advantage. Since rank 20s aren't doing well with him, and Billy's win rate is not consistent, and he can be looped on the most open maps in the game....well, your entire rhetoric can be represented by tinky winky down below:

A rank 20 Billy is only doing well against other brown/yellow rank survivors. Period. A red rank Billy is getting looped and bullied as much as any other killer. If you want to talk about contributing, let's talk about the fact that you've been told he has a cooldown, and you refuse to acknowledge it as a cooldown, because it happens during an animation. Even though MANY killers have a cooldown animation. You just refuse to call it a cooldown because it destroys your entire argument. THAT'S what I call not contributing. Disregarding things that go against your view.

I understand. When you look at it from the average survivor/killer, it can be a different story. This is because of the skill differences between high and low or veteran and new players. Your average player isn't going to fully understand the looping/position/etc, this goes for both sides. The killer won't necessarily understand what he or she is doing, just that the pallet is their enemy and it's breakable, which is why so many unsafe pallets are broken via an average killer. Billy's add-ons also enable that ability to just do as @ClickyClicky states; run around instadowning until you get the 4k. This normally only goes for those add-ons though. Ive noticed we can all agree his addons are the problem.

I feel we do need to take in account of player skill when analyzing these killers. Not necessarily as our main catalyst or how we view it specifically, but it does need to linger in the back of our mind. Billy is strong, rather can be strong in EITHER the right hands OR his addons. At least, this how I see him. I consider myself an average Billy, despite being a partial main, and I can account for several losses e.o *shivers* them some dark days. Some where I made many mistakes, didn't apply pressure, or it was just out of my control.

Also, for everyone, if a player isn't contributing, just pay them no mind. You'll honestly get a headache trying to have them give their pov instead of being blatant. This is towards both sides. Where there's a debate, continue the debate, as long as it has standing ^,^ and by standing I mean an actual intellectual counterpoint, not just blatantly arguing or leaving no room for discussion.

NOW you're on to something that makes sense. MOST killers need Buffs (clown and bubba most of all). Doctor just got a really good one, and he's in a perfect spot right now.

Billy, as others have said, in terms of potential power, is where ALL killers should be. He has a strong side, but his weaknesses are crippling. If you run into a loop and are even half decent at working the loop, even if it's just running around a rock or a tree...Billy may as well be Wraith, or Clown at that point. His chainsaw is now useless.

If people weren't forced to face Billy's so damn always (and Freddy's) because they are really the only 2 killers with the ability to apply a strong amount of pressure, there'd be a lot less complaining. So yes, the solution is to buff killers.

Oh clown lol that killer. I know he isn't a top tier killer, but I haven't learned the best counter to him, like effectively, and it can get annoying at times. I'm like "eeeek stop making my screen all fuzzy! Already have trouble seeing!"

This. All of this.