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NOED is not a "training wheels" or a "baby killer" perk...NOED is not an issue... Want to debate?
Rank 1 trapper main, Rank 1 Bill Kate and Dwelf mains, Xbox
The game hasn't ended when you repaired 5 gens, the game ends if you escape.
I'm not a NOED user, but, as a rank 1 member of a 4 men red ranks SWF, if you see the killer having trouble against you, he's gonna have NOED, if you're so good at the game you should know he's probably a NOED user, and that's not a noob perk, that's an End Game Strategy perk.
"He didn't have a single hook until the end game, that's a training wheels perk"
My man... did you just say you got owned by a training wheels perk...? Did you just tell me that you managed to fix all gens without getting hooked or barely getting hooked as a SWF and you can't handle a Hex perk...
Now, there are two types of NOED users:
End Game Builders: His build is meant for you to die at the End Game, whatever happens before was extra, NOED is part of his strat, not a baby killer perk
Insurance Perk Builders: This killers use this perk as an insurance to get those Ks, his objective is to KILL YOU, regardless of when the kill happened.
Now, if the Insurance Perk Builder Killer face camped you at the end game after downing you for the first time, ask yourself, "where were my teammates?", "Is a Hex really that hard to find?", "Why didn't y'all comunicate to know how many totems were cleansed?". If you were solo, "why did you risk your escape when the killer probably had NOED?"
Saying NOED is a "training wheels perk" is the same as saying "Adrenaline or DS are a training wheels perks" for survivors to have one last chance with two hits before actually dying.
Comments
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DS is not an issue either. Well put, friend.
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Yep, it isn't. I actually have no problem with any perk on both sides, more with maps and killers that need buffs.
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NOED isn't an issue, okay, is there any perks that are an issue?
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I was starting to like you but then read you’re a Dwelf player. Ewwww! Didn’t you know all the sexy Dwight players equip the Dwightstache and Managers Vest!
As for NoEd, yeah, nothing wrong with it. People who have a problem with it are those who want to rush gens and tbag at the gate.
Its not hard to do bones either.
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Nah, not for me, but just to please the community, maybe make keys work after 10 seconds on top of hatch and Ebonys to work after you hooked all survivors at least once?
I don't know, maps and some killers need a rework
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Ofc it's not
People don't do totems, it's their fault.
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I have to confess... I use P2 clothes even though I'm a P3 level 50, but for the head I use the Dwelf... Because... because... Ok... Here it goes...
I LOVE THE LEGEND OF ZELDA AND THE DWELF HEAD MAKES ME THINK I'M LINK! THERE! I SAID IT!
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You know, I actually like when killers have noed(unexpected), makes the game far intense.😱 (that is if the killer downs another person, not me)
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Ok, I excuse your transgression and will now try to love you more.
Would be nice if you’d be able to wear the ears and the Dwightstache though.
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The only perks I have a problem with is DS and BT.
DS should deactivate if the survivor fully healed, healed a teammate, searched a chest, interacted with a gen, or unhooks someone.
BT should be based on how long the killer has stood next to a hook. It shouldn’t work if I just hooked someone and they unhook right in front of me 2-3 seconds right after I hooked someone. Happens all the time when I manage to take someone into the basement. I can hear them following me ready to pull off the hook the second I turn around.
There should be a stall implemented to the mechanics of it. Like in order for it to activate the hooked person should have been hanging for 20 seconds or something. It would help with the bastards that use the “hook tech” that they love so much.
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The Dwightstache with the Dwelf hat? That'd look pretty funny actually
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I agree, DS deactivates as soon as you start an interaction that's not a locker.
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If by funny you mean hott, then yes, I agree.
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Noed is fine. People who hate it need to "adapt and git gud" I believe the term is. Now that ruin is gone, what else do we killers have
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I do agree, with keys, you should have a 10 second mending, it fills like a bar.
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It goes down if you let go? or it keeps progress?
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Goes down unlike mending I would hope
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I agree with you about the mindset around NOED, likewise when people say it "punishes survivors for doing gens fast" these arguments are also absurd. Even if you do gens slow NOED can still activate, seeing as its difficult to quantify how many totems were done in any less than a 4-man SWF.
Regardless, my only two concerns about the perk ATM is that as the devs roll out better hiding locations for totems, NOED gets quite stronger. Consider totems go from being a thing that "you see between generators", to something you "Won't notice unless you're looking", that's quite a strong buff.
Secondly, NOED just feels bad to lose against. Blood Warden on the other hand doesn't, it makes you go WHOOAAAAA HE HAS BLOOD WARDEN!!!! As opposed to the more lackluster reaction from a NOED reveal.
I think if NOED gets reworked, the strength is less important compared to the way it feels to lose against it. I have some ideas about how it could be reworked but I haven't really refined them through discussion, and that isn't what the thread is about anyway.
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BT would be better if it didn't activate until after 10 seconds of the survivor being on the hook and that it gets based off of distance rather than the TR
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If you let go at all, you have to restart.
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NOED makes the end game so much fun. I love it as a survivor.
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Your first type is the 1% who are meming. 99% of people who use it use it as an insurance policy. It's not training wheels because it's not actually helping them learn how to play the game more effectively but it is a baby killer perk since killers who use are overwhelmingly baby killers. And that is just a fact.
Anyone who plays survivor long enough sees the pattern. Very rarely is there a game that a killer gets 4k before the end and it turns out they had noed. Very rarely is there a game where the killer cant get a hook before the end and it turns out they dont have noed. Noed is used a lot by bad killers and that's why it has that reputation.
I'm not even arguing whether its overpowered or not, I dont think it is but there is no denying it's a baby killer perk.
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I agree that noed is fine as a perk. But what I hate about it is that the majority of people that run the perk don't run it in any kind of build that helps the perk. They just run it to be scummy, toxic and get away with camping in the endgame most of the time. Which is a scummy move on it's own. I had a round recently where a bubba brought nothing but noed. it was tier three so he would have had other perks available. And he was rank 1. Noed isn't the problem it's the people that use it. Same with people that use ds solely to be able to run around the killer for 60 seconds tea bagging them and then jump in a locker. so i disagree that it's not a training wheel perk because the majority of people that run it. Run it because their bad at killer. I know people will probably disagree with me. But this is my opinion on the perk. P.s I also have been seeing a lot of tea bagging ghostface's and billys with noed. which makes no sense to me cause they have one shots lol.
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I like it as it is and only use it with Freddy as a combo for remember me and BW
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Theres exactly one time where I thought NOED was a cool thing to go against, and that was when I was going against a Demogorgon with pretty much exactly the build you said. Thing is he was actually an okay player, and it was clear he was building up to an end-game massacre, I think that is what stopped it from feeling lame, (kind of like you said in the opening post).
I just think it would be better if there was a way to keep it from feeling lame in other contexts, but still keep its potential as an end-game perk as part of an end-game build.
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I get it, I also hate when a baby killer uses NOED to get 1k, not when a good one does even without an end game build
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Why are u in jail ....
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I don't use noed. It feels cheap to me. But I do appreciate it being used by others. Gens get done too quickly and if there was no threat of noed people would not worry about doing bones at all. noed and inner strength are actually good for the health of the game IMO.
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Cause I asked people not to change subjects when talking about who is the hottest character per gender and I mentioned the words "dumb" and "more than one gender" in the same sentence as a joke that got misslead to people thinking I was non-tolerant towards gender theories in that thread. Learnt my lesson, that is a sensitive subject here and I won't do it again, sorry if anyone got offended, I didn't mean it like that. Now I can't post threads for 7 days now.
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I think people take out of context why people call NOED a baby killer perk. The biggest problem is it rewards the killer for pretty much doing nothing which is why you see it used a lot in camping etc.
It is indeed a issue with NOED basically it's not very fun seeing a killer who pretty much played like a total buttface the whole game get rewarded with a "second chance" while i get people say just cleanse totems things become a little more complicated then just cleaning totems.
Example it's a leatherface and hes camping a hook the first thing every survivor thinks about is the objective the idea is to make the person's time on hook worth it and cleansing totems in this situation would be the exact opposite it would allow the killer even more time to down and camp yet another survivor once the other one has been sacrificed and with how the developers continue to want to make totems more hidden this problem only will get worse.
Point being is NOED a baby killer perk no but does it reward piss poor behavior 100% it does.
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60 seconds of being untouched... Can be really painful for the killer, especially against a sweaty META swf
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Why not carry, take the stun, down him again and make those 60 seconds into max 30?
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Not everyone is a potato and go down instantly
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I agree NOED is a baby perk but I don't think it should be reworked on until DS is reworked aswell.
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I can't tell if you're trying to be rude or not, but yeah there is a certain amount of respect for when the killer isn't riding on the back of NOED to get his/her kills. That being said, even if the killer is good, if your team had to sweat out 5 gens in what was otherwise a balanced game, only for the last two remaining survivors to get NOED'd that also feels bad.
I just want to make clear I'm not talking about the balance of the perk, I'm talking about the way it feels to lose against. Videogames where you are expected to lose work best when losing feels good (which it does in many, many games), but DBD often doesn't really capture that feeling of losing and it being epic. I think Moris and NOED (and keys to a lesser extent), really sit on the far side of the spectrum when it comes to mechanics that make losing feel bad. This isn't really a criticism of the balance of the perk at all, it's of how the mechanics of DBD have been handled.
I'm sure there is another universe where NOED is pretty much functionally identical to the way it is now but when it activates you feel excited rather than cheated, which is how it ideally should feel.
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Meh, true.
Then don't tunnel or just leave him slugged? It's annoying and another survivor has to waste time healing him
No man, I'm not being rude, I really mean it, I know the feeling of dying to a killer cause of NOED when he didn't deserve a single K cause he was tunneling and/or camping or just cause you outplayed him the whole match but NOED gave him a k.
But I don't feel bad when he was a really good killer and also had NOED, I usually think like "damn, you're that good and you also use NOED, give us a chance man! Hehehehe"
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I'm a endgame builder btw
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Whith all of your killers? Cause I only have end game build for Spirit and Freddy
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I don't mind noed on a killer like wraith/clown/legion but Freddy or Spirit with noed... is really frustrating to play against.
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I don't mainly use endgame builds, but I never use noed just in case i lose
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Okay cool yeah, I wasn't sure but thought I'd mention it because things are so easy to misinterpret when its text only, no worries :)
Thats a pretty good attitude you've got there when good killers run NOED haha, I guess it doesn't really happen often enough for me to really draw on my experience in that regard, but I can completely understand how if your adrenaline is already high enough, adding NOED into an already difficult equation can potentially make the situation even more thrilling, which in turn is the prime reason why devour hope feels so amazing to go against, it gives you that epic rush of "oh god no!". It's something that DBD would really benefit from having more of, but from a developer perspective it really is a thin line that has to be handled with care.
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So, depending on tier?
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Every time I hear someone accuse survivors of "gen rushing", it makes me think that person is of low intelligence. Survivors are dropped into a match with literally nothing else on this earth to do than to work on generators. What exactly are you expecting them to do....stare at the trees? I did a lot of debate at university and "gen rushing" might be the worst take I've ever heard on any subject ever since learning the English language at 2 years old. Especially considering the circumstances the game puts survivors in from the very beginning which is.....thats right, repair generators and nothing else.
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Meh, me and my SWF usually just do totems and open chests for a minute to help the killer think gens are not being done early game, I guess that's what people think is gen rush, early game gens done. That concept is just wrong in my opinion, I can 4k even with doors already opened
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The game gives Survivors two objectives, the first and main objective is to repair generators. The secondary objective which (is optional) is to cleanse totems. If they only focus on repairing generators and ignore totems, they’re rushing their main objective. It doesn’t take much time to cleanse totems, Survivors are just lazy and have tunnel vision. I have to question your level of education since you couldn’t figure that out.
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It is a crutch
lol
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Question all you like. Doesn't bother me a bit. If you want to throw totems in there go right ahead. Totems aren't going to open those doors. Hence why most survivors do gens. Because say it with me, that is THE objective for them to do. You wanna go through chests, go for it. Thats not an objective. You wanna cleanse totems, fine, thats not an objective. Objectives aren't optional in this game. Totems and chests are most certainly optional.
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The main objective of the game for Survivors is to survive. You are supposed to do everything that you can to avoid getting killed, sometimes that’s cleansing totems. If Killers are using NoEd, and you and your team chose to tunnel the generator repairs, then you only have yourselves to blame.
Objectives are optional in this game. You can choose to hide the whole match with a key and escape when everyone else dies. You can choose to do generators. You can choose to loop the killer. In the end, you choose to give the killer power by not cleansing hexes.
Saying totems are not an objective is just word play to justify only doing generators and ignoring everything else.
If you fall to NoEd, it’s your fault. It is not because the killer is bad, it is because you are bad at looking for totems or underestimating them.
Thankfully, the Devs have stated that NoEd is fine, and that they are looking at making games last a little longer by looking at things like totems rather than increasing generators repair speed.
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We can agree to disagree on the topic. As far as NoEd, in my opinion it absolutely is a bit of a crutch. Whether it stays like it is in game or not I don't really care. As long as it exists though, killer mains are wasting their breath on complaining about decisive strike.
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